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Author Topic: Disclaimer form - shielded employees  (Read 3412 times)

skyray

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Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« on: 12-06-20, 01:40PM »
I understand returning employees who were previously been shielding on the 12 week scheme are expected to sign a disclaimer form before they can return - what rights are they potentially signing away and is this a legally binding document?

oldfashionedplayer

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #1 on: 12-06-20, 03:31PM »
Short version - Covers their back, still need to give duty of care, but better to go back 29th / next shift after that and go through health assessment.. If you did you'd still get the death in service benefits.


They are signing a disclaimer if you come back before the 29th, to mainly say that you've refused the rights to a health assessment which could otherwise change you from vulnerable to extremely vulnerable and / or require change of adjustments, it's their bit of legal document, they are still expected to provide safety adjustments for you but if however you did contract the virus and unfortunately passed from it, they wouldn't be liable as you knew the risks and opted out of returning at a safer date...


Pretty much don't go back until 29th and ask for a health assessment, then you've atleast made sure your safety is put first, also you have a right to leave work if you feel unsafe and can't be penalised for it, though you do need to try and tell them why and if they aren't fixing it can report to government health and safety thing.

Least that's what I gather from it.

T.C.1

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #2 on: 12-06-20, 04:49PM »
Best to go back on the 29th and follow the Tesco time line which is on 'our Tesco' on the 15th of June OH should get in contact with all affected colleagues then from the 22nd of June fill in a OH questionare on line.

Pathfinder

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #3 on: 12-06-20, 07:18PM »
A extremely vunrebal  staff member who has been sent a new nhs letter telling them to stay isolated till 15th august is coming back to work next week ...as they are bored at home . They are just signing a waiver form . Unbelievable  that manager is even allowing them back into the store .

oldfashionedplayer

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #4 on: 12-06-20, 07:28PM »
Should be reporting it as due to the risk, they aren't allowed to return currently...

notsofunny

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #5 on: 12-06-20, 07:41PM »
A extremely vunrebal  staff member who has been sent a new nhs letter telling them to stay isolated till 15th august is coming back to work next week ...as they are bored at home . They are just signing a waiver form . Unbelievable  that manager is even allowing them back into the store .

Gov .com has only given a date till the end of June , this was updated on the 5th June , and Doctors are also going by this date , So can you say how this person has a letter saying to Isolate till the 15th August  ?  have you seen it ? or are you just going by someone saying so ?

notsofunny

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #6 on: 12-06-20, 07:44PM »
Should be reporting it as due to the risk, they aren't allowed to return currently...

Nothing to stop anyone from going back to work if they want to , No law has been passed to say they cant decide to work if they want to , The Shielding letter is Just Advice , which can be taken or not ,

Short version - Covers their back, still need to give duty of care, but better to go back 29th / next shift after that and go through health assessment.. If you did you'd still get the death in service benefits.


They are signing a disclaimer if you come back before the 29th, to mainly say that you've refused the rights to a health assessment which could otherwise change you from vulnerable to extremely vulnerable and / or require change of adjustments, it's their bit of legal document, they are still expected to provide safety adjustments for you but if however you did contract the virus and unfortunately passed from it, they wouldn't be liable as you knew the risks and opted out of returning at a safer date...


Pretty much don't go back until 29th and ask for a health assessment, then you've atleast made sure your safety is put first, also you have a right to leave work if you feel unsafe and can't be penalised for it, though you do need to try and tell them why and if they aren't fixing it can report to government health and safety thing.

Least that's what I gather from it.


Having health assessment does not mean they will move you from vulnerable to extremely vulnerable , they are only doing it to see how adjustments can be made for you at work , Your classification has already been done by the NHS or your Doctor ,

And are you sure that if you go back on the 29th you will not be going back to your old Job with out any adjustments ? Since the point of you doing the Assessment before is to see if you can or need to be moved to another roll ,

Are you sure what you are saying are facts not just something you yourself have understood it to be ?
« Last Edit: 12-06-20, 07:55PM by notsofunny »

Pathfinder

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #7 on: 12-06-20, 08:07PM »
Should be reporting it as due to the risk, they aren't allowed to return currently...

Nothing to stop anyone from going back to work if they want to , No law has been passed to say they cant decide to work if they want to , The Shielding letter is Just Advice , which can be taken or not ,

Short version - Covers their back, still need to give duty of care, but better to go back 29th / next shift after that and go through health assessment.. If you did you'd still get the death in service benefits.


They are signing a disclaimer if you come back before the 29th, to mainly say that you've refused the rights to a health assessment which could otherwise change you from vulnerable to extremely vulnerable and / or require change of adjustments, it's their bit of legal document, they are still expected to provide safety adjustments for you but if however you did contract the virus and unfortunately passed from it, they wouldn't be liable as you knew the risks and opted out of returning at a safer date...


Pretty much don't go back until 29th and ask for a health assessment, then you've atleast made sure your safety is put first, also you have a right to leave work if you feel unsafe and can't be penalised for it, though you do need to try and tell them why and if they aren't fixing it can report to government health and safety thing.

Least that's what I gather from it.


Having health assessment does not mean they will move you from vulnerable to extremely vulnerable , they are only doing it to see how adjustments can be made for you at work , Your classification has already been done by the NHS or your Doctor ,

And are you sure that if you go back on the 29th you will not be going back to your old Job with out any adjustments ? Since the point of you doing the Assessment before is to see if you can or need to be moved to another roll ,

Are you sure what you are saying are facts not just something you yourself have understood it to be ?

Yes I have a copy of the letter from the chief medical officer of Wales which has different rules from England. 

notsofunny

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #8 on: 12-06-20, 08:18PM »

ok my fault should have Stopped to remember that we are 4 country's , And not Just England ,,sorry ,

Can you say when this letter was dated from ?


Pathfinder

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #9 on: 12-06-20, 08:33PM »
Dated june 2020 recived 2 days ago ....this is second letter and a follow up to previous one to shield to 15th june this tells them to continue to shield to the 16th of august .

notsofunny

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #10 on: 12-06-20, 09:19PM »
Thanks, that could mean that the English Government will do the same.  It's going to mean some are happy others not so.

Have a few friends that can't wait to get back.  Would be interesting to hear how others feel about it.
« Last Edit: 12-06-20, 11:21PM by Nomad »

oldfashionedplayer

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #11 on: 13-06-20, 03:10AM »
Should be reporting it as due to the risk, they aren't allowed to return currently...

Nothing to stop anyone from going back to work if they want to , No law has been passed to say they cant decide to work if they want to , The Shielding letter is Just Advice , which can be taken or not ,

Short version - Covers their back, still need to give duty of care, but better to go back 29th / next shift after that and go through health assessment.. If you did you'd still get the death in service benefits.


They are signing a disclaimer if you come back before the 29th, to mainly say that you've refused the rights to a health assessment which could otherwise change you from vulnerable to extremely vulnerable and / or require change of adjustments, it's their bit of legal document, they are still expected to provide safety adjustments for you but if however you did contract the virus and unfortunately passed from it, they wouldn't be liable as you knew the risks and opted out of returning at a safer date...


Pretty much don't go back until 29th and ask for a health assessment, then you've atleast made sure your safety is put first, also you have a right to leave work if you feel unsafe and can't be penalised for it, though you do need to try and tell them why and if they aren't fixing it can report to government health and safety thing.

Least that's what I gather from it.


Having health assessment does not mean they will move you from vulnerable to extremely vulnerable , they are only doing it to see how adjustments can be made for you at work , Your classification has already been done by the NHS or your Doctor ,

And are you sure that if you go back on the 29th you will not be going back to your old Job with out any adjustments ? Since the point of you doing the Assessment before is to see if you can or need to be moved to another roll ,

Are you sure what you are saying are facts not just something you yourself have understood it to be ?

Without posting all the information word for word  - Extremely aren't allowed, can't sign a disclaimer for returning, have to use CSP and holidays according to what's been passed down, marks it in red that not allowed to sign to say they are coming back until government says its safe, they have to go through the health referral and if it still marks them down as Extremely then they MUST stay off.

also the combination of health conditions could put you into the extreme category from what it says, or how they would look at it as being a high risk even if NHS doesn't class you as one, so if you've got a LOT of the clinically vulnerable stuff then you could be deemed by them as too much of a high risk to return.

as for returning you can return to own role and just keep distance, or you can ask for adjustments / referral to see if any extra would help, such as temp job change, for example day worker going onto nights where less footfall / stores closed so lesser risk etc.




Clyde

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #12 on: 13-06-20, 05:39PM »
I am in Scotland and have been told by the Scottish government I've to shield until the end of July and can't go back to work. I've had a letter from tesco saying I'll be paid ssp from the 29th of June and tesco will make this up to my full wage if I've no ssp left or run out. They also say they will deduct 2 days holiday every pay period!!! My Question is can they do this as im"off sick" through no choice of my own but they are using my holidays. I understood this when tesco were footing the bill but now they are using my ssp

notsofunny

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #13 on: 13-06-20, 06:19PM »

SSP is for 28 weeks , are you sure you are not mixing up Company sick pay with SSP ?

Tesco WILL  pay you Company sick pay till it runs out , after which they will pay you SSP , and since that is only £94 a week they will top it up to bring you to your normal wage ,

They do not have to top up your salary when you are getting SSP but they are so that is a gain for you , This has been agreed with the Unions as has the 2 days Hoilday ,

SSP is being paid by Tesco , it can not be claimed back from the Government ,so as such Tesco is Footing the bill , This is what was explained to me some years ago when the law changed so that company's had to pay it them self's ,

As to you being off sick , well are you? they are only using the SSP as a way to make sure you get paid ,

I would say that losing 2 days is nothing compared to not getting paid at all

notsofunny

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #14 on: 13-06-20, 06:34PM »
@ oldfashionedplayer

Word for word would help , Yet it still stands that NO law has been passed to say that anyone can not go back to work , and if people have been able to go back , does that not show that Tesco or any other company can NOT stop them from going back.

Again Tesco will not move you from one to another only your Doctor or NHS will do that.

As to the Assessment is it true that they will not get full pay  for staying off after the 29th if they have not done it before ? and what other consequences will they face if they do not have the assessment done before ? after all why would anyone want to do it before if all they had to do was go back on the 29th ?

Administrator Comment quotes deleted, becoming to long. Nomad.
« Last Edit: 13-06-20, 09:43PM by Nomad »

oldfashionedplayer

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #15 on: 13-06-20, 10:33PM »
There's no consequences for not doing a review, you can refuse and they will send you another letter just confirming it, one for you, one for their records, you don't have to return on the 29th, you can work with your manager to take time off either via holidays, unpaid or lifestyle break. As for the pay after 29th it just says sick pay, and from what I gather they are mitigating the first 3 days while your being assessed still...

Also in regards to no law... Tesco clearly state their standpoint that they won't allow the return of those workers, so you'd have to challenge it, they could possibly win with it since its a high risk scenario and they can't protect you as well as you could by being indoors, you could ask though if there's any temporary change of areas where there is an absolute minimum or see about working from home such as office colleagues from my understanding, but it's probably slim to 0 for returning with tesco.

Also their current employment seeking bit states that if you are classed as clinically vulnerable you'll be exempt from being hired, since they don't have the required space to make the necessary changes for everyone, so only those that are currently employed will be able to move in house job to job, if you've say got a brother who wants to join who has diabetes, if he makes it known before being hired he would be struck off from the list of applicants (which for the most part would be grounds for equality claims, since this is discrimination)

notsofunny

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #16 on: 14-06-20, 02:12AM »
So are you saying that those that have done a review and gone back are worse off that those that do not do it and wait till the 29th and go back? , since I think you said everyone should go back on the 29th with out any consequences ?
 As to Law are you know saying it is Tesco Policy and not Law ? since you are know saying it is Tesco stand point , and  did you not say that some have gone back ?

As to Tesco moving you from one Group to low risk to high risk another if a assessment is done ?  Tesco will not move you from one to another only your Doctor or NHS will do that.




Thailand

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #17 on: 14-06-20, 05:03AM »
I am in Scotland and have been told by the Scottish government I've to shield until the end of July and can't go back to work. I've had a letter from tesco saying I'll be paid ssp from the 29th of June and tesco will make this up to my full wage if I've no ssp left or run out. They also say they will deduct 2 days holiday every pay period!!! My Question is can they do this as im"off sick" through no choice of my own but they are using my holidays. I understood this when tesco were footing the bill but now they are using my ssp
So youve used all your sick pay,taken 12 weeks off fully paid,expect the company to pay you another 12 weeks so you can not go to work,and then when you do go back to work you expect a years worth of holidays even though your only working half,thats assuming you arnt sick again

Annabelle

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #18 on: 30-06-20, 07:54PM »
you don't have to return on the 29th, you can work with your manager to take time off either via holidays, unpaid or lifestyle break. As for the pay after 29th it just says sick pay, and from what I gather they are mitigating the first 3 days while your being assessed still...

What would be the difference between unpaid leave and a lifestyle break? I'd like to be off until I feel safer being clinically vulnerable (perhaps when we know if antibodies help, and we can get tested).
I don't know how to ask how much CSP I have left, as when that finishes I'm not eligible for SSP.

I'm annoyed we can't talk to OH regarding the outcome of the assessment we did online as mine came back ok to return to work, but my other disabilities are not allowing me to! (Anxiety and Chronic Pain) I also have Coronavirus symptoms (not the 3 to form a diagnosis) have tested negative twice, but as I've had the symptoms since 20/3/20 I'm guessing I'd show negative anyway! I know anxiety can do funny things to your body, but I don't want to risk spreading the virus.

My role involves yellow stickers, and I'm really not sure in an Express store with 1.5m wide aisles, how I can stay 2m from customers, obey the one way system, and do my job without it resembling
a game of pac-man.

Also, is anyone else confused as to why it's been coded as self-isolation when we have no symptoms, aren't expected to isolate indoors, and now has been referred to as shielding on OurTosco!

"Coronavirus - latest update

Page last updated: 5th June 2020

Supporting our vulnerable colleagues - updated information.

For the last twelve weeks as we have stepped up and adapted to the impact of the COVID-19 pandemic, the safety and wellbeing of our colleagues and their families has remained our first priority.
On 19 March we put exceptional measures in place to support our most vulnerable colleagues,
asking them to shield in line with government advice whilst on full-pay."

I've also found today, a link that says "Clinically extremely vulnerable people or clinically vulnerable people should always work from home"!

https://www.gov.uk/coronavirus-business-reopening/y/shops/over_4/yes/yes/no/no

notsofunny

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #19 on: 30-06-20, 09:30PM »

If I remember correctly , Unpaid , is taking a week or few weeks off , Life style is a set number of weeks with a few weeks of your holidays included , say 2 weeks hoilday and 6 weeks preak unpaid ,,


I've also found today, a link that says "Clinically extremely vulnerable people or clinically vulnerable people should always work from home"!

That has been updated i think to say those that can work from home for the vulnerable should  but others to return to work if they cant  ,

And the clinically vulnerable are still to work from home if they can but still not go to work


Annabelle

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #20 on: 01-07-20, 12:05AM »
Thank you, so lifestyle it will be. Unless, as I'm off sick with my anxiety I'm not allowed?
I know if you're sick when it's your planned holiday, it's cancelled and coded as sick.

I realise at the end of this I probably won't have a job as my absence rate will be sky high again :(

If you check the gov UK link above you'll see the current guidance for businesses reopening is as I state.

(It's not letting me attach the images of the quote so you'll have to 'find in page')

oldfashionedplayer

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Re: Disclaimer form - shielded employees
« Reply #21 on: 01-07-20, 03:54AM »
pretty much, lifestyle used to be 12 weeks, most of which was unpaid, but you'd take a minimum of 2 weeks holiday and discuss how much extra holiday you wanted to take, now they've extended it to 52 weeks (1 year), so you could take the remainder of your holiday on lifestyle (6 weeks + 1 day initially, and more found on holiday policy / you earn as you reach per 5 milestone), after which is just living on savings.

Note also that lifestyle is meant for adventure / travel / relaxation etc, not for working, so if you're working elsewhere that isn't your own business (and tesco know of the business), then you could come under gross misconduct.

If your off sick on your planned holiday, if you notify them beforehand you can take it as sick and take your holidays later (put in another request / sit down with manager), however you can choose to just take it as holiday if your sick and be paid your holiday pay... If you are however off sick, it does say "don't do anything to make it worse" - You can actually go on holiday / travel, etc, anything you deem as "not making you worse", just don't be calling in sick and going on a night out lol.

as for the gov thing, it's only until 4th July it looks like.... Though government wants everyone back between start of july and august depending on what your business has offered, so Tesco is 1st August.

 

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