Hi all even though i do like to have a good whinge against tesco and some of its practises, i find myself in a bit of a life dilema with the simple fact of i have no f****ng clue what career i want so have taken a gap year while i try decide. I was speaking to my manager at break and they suggested i could try do options and become a manager at tesco if it's something i wanted to pursue.
I'm just a bit split on talking to them more about it, I honestly can't find a career that seems like something I'd want to spend the rest of my life doing and am completely lost on where i see myself so becoming a manager is a nice bit of progression that could open up more doors and give me some more experience as well as a bit more pay ;).
I just have a couple of questions, 1. What's the average managers salary in tesco? 2. How hard is the options programme 3. Can you move cities / towns to other stores, I'm kind of stuck in a small town but the rest of the towns around me are also similar sized with the nearest coty being an hour and a bit away and in a different group, so can you move groups? 4. Would it be a s*** choice to do options haha.
I know I'm probably going to get ripped to shreds for asking for this info here but ay well
you must think of job security,managers could be axed and replaced with shift leaders in the near future
Quote from: Siwel123 on 06-12-19, 04:04PM
Hi all even though i do like to have a good whinge against tesco and some of its practises, i find myself in a bit of a life dilema with the simple fact of i have no f****ng clue what career i want so have taken a gap year while i try decide. I was speaking to my manager at break and they suggested i could try do options and become a manager at tesco if it's something i wanted to pursue.
I'm just a bit split on talking to them more about it, I honestly can't find a career that seems like something I'd want to spend the rest of my life doing and am completely lost on where i see myself so becoming a manager is a nice bit of progression that could open up more doors and give me some more experience as well as a bit more pay ;).
I just have a couple of questions, 1. What's the average managers salary in tesco? 2. How hard is the options programme 3. Can you move cities / towns to other stores, I'm kind of stuck in a small town but the rest of the towns around me are also similar sized with the nearest coty being an hour and a bit away and in a different group, so can you move groups? 4. Would it be a s*** choice to do options haha.
I know I'm probably going to get ripped to shreds for asking for this info here but ay well
On options, unless you apply through the Tesco Store graduates scheme, you'll be on 90% of the established rate of the position you're fulfilling (as a Team Manager, lowest salary is 22k-24k a year depending on store format) so 90% of whichever applies (i.e £20,800-£21,600), the stores graduate scheme advertises starting salary at 28k for the same position with a fast track to Express SM in 1.5 years.
As for if it's any good, from what I've seen and experienced no, the staff turnover for graduate SMs in Express is high because they aren't prepared for the stress the role brings, you will be better supported and treated more favourably than options candidates who got promoted the old fashioned way. Retail as a career isn't great for long term earnings either and is fiercly competitive and political above SM level.
A lot of grads are attracted to retail graduate careers because they think compared to other industries, it's a lot less intellectually challenging, while true, the amount of work and type of lifestyle you'll live (working lates and weekends) for some isn't worth the mentally easier work.
Relocating is harder as well, the higher up you go the more self-serving the managers become and the more they expect from you
While possible to relocate, don't expect it to be as easy as if you're a ca or SL, it's a lot more political.
While retail graduate starting salaries are attractive, you aren't going to reach the same salaries long term as those in other industries, as mentioned earlier Mon-Fri 9-5 office working is the norm outside of retail as well as lower productivity expectations.
😂 didn't take long
As NightandDay said.
Workload , stress level vary from store to store.
Extra hours might damage your life (i ended up wasting 12 h a day as mgr and belive me and my girlfriend at some point started crying beacuse of me not being at home).
If you want mgr job. SS, Extra is way to go. Short comuting time.
Many mgrs/ SM will not help you to progress, coach you. Will expect you to be salvation to theirs problems. You can be a manager who will just do bare minimum and you will stuck in retail to the rest of your days.
Thank you all so much, it's just I'm stuck in this rut of not knoeing where i want to go in life and what i want to do and this is the first thing thats been offered to me that actually seems achievable
Mobility is good. They are not supposed to let anyone sign on now who says they won't move to another store. You just need to set yourself up online to get prompts when jobs one up in other areas.
Who knows what structure change is coming in the future. The express and metro have been done and things very different for them. It's tough and it's hard but you will learn a lot and do well or sink. Be prepared for long hours. It just might not be that easy getting back into large store structure after, that may depend on where you would locate to.
As for large stores who knows what is coming. Some stores have been able to slim down management team into how they think things might go to try and reduce impact when it comes but it's only a guess, an educated guess but still a guess. Until it does come nobody knows.
I was on Options for a while some years ago, but ultimately decided I didn't want to be married to the job. As far as I'm concerned, coming in to do a damned good job, but leaving at the end of my shift without worrying about it is my idea of a good work/life balance. I know a manager outside of work, and the poor woman seems constantly stressed and is thinking of quitting.
Quote from: Siwel123 on 06-12-19, 11:06PM
Thank you all so much, it's just I'm stuck in this rut of not knoeing where i want to go in life and what i want to do and this is the first thing thats been offered to me that actually seems achievable
Get your degree and apply for graduate schemes outside of retail, I oversee a bunch of graduates in my role, they're paid 33k a year and the stress they endure is 1,000 x less than Tesco, the managers and colleagues are actually nice and professional as well, It took me a while to adjust to the differences in work life balance, stress, unhealthy work practices and mickey mouse management of Tesco, but now I'm very happy with my work life balance. Where I work has a nurturing culture as well (as opposed to the cut throat self serving culture Tesco has), which from what I've seen in my industry (technology and business consulting) is common place in the industry. The graduates are also very happy to.
Don't do it ,3 colleagues at our store were put on options and stayed there for 7 years before they even became managers and were only paid GA wages too during that 7 year period ......and in the meantime graduates kept coming and going immediately starting on ridiculous salaries. If you go on options they treat you like s***, think of you as a GA yet give you management responsibilities without the extra pay to do the actual jobs you are given. Management expect you to work 12 hour shifts with no extra pay on top of your normal shift and then use the "it will be good for your development" card..
DON'T DO IT
My experience of people being on options is twofold.
Some who went on options, but had a bit of nouse about them, in regard of standing up for themselves and challenging, progressed well and soon achieved sign off....though finding a vacant position to apply for became harder after the restructuring, and moving area was mostly required. However if you're really good, the SM will try and block your transfer as much as possible, as they don't want to lose a good worker, who they can keep, with vague promises of something in the pipeline ???
Others who went on options were non starters, obviously not managegement material, but useful as goffers to the managers. They never got signed off, but were always encouraged to try again, usually in September ready for the big build up, given huge responsibilities (good for their development ) and were almost flogged to death for the twelve weeks, doing everything on 12 hour shifts. Then come January, told not suitable AGAIN!
The armed forces are about the only place now in my opinion, where they train everyone properly for free, and in so many varied and differing trades, with qualifications highly regarded and recognised.
Ultimately for options, it boils down to the Store Managers discretion, I can't recommend options purely because it is not a fair transparant process as highlighted by what Lucgeo has said.
Getting a degree and going on the store graduates program is a slightly different matter as the graduates have extra processes in place making the dictatorship process of options quite unworkable and hence a fairer system for progression, not blocked by the political whims of one unduly unqualified manager.
Quote from: Siwel123 on 06-12-19, 04:04PM
Hi all even though i do like to have a good whinge against tesco and some of its practises, i find myself in a bit of a life dilema with the simple fact of i have no f****ng clue what career i want so have taken a gap year while i try decide. I was speaking to my manager at break and they suggested i could try do options and become a manager at tesco if it's something i wanted to pursue.
I'm just a bit split on talking to them more about it, I honestly can't find a career that seems like something I'd want to spend the rest of my life doing and am completely lost on where i see myself so becoming a manager is a nice bit of progression that could open up more doors and give me some more experience as well as a bit more pay ;).
I just have a couple of questions, 1. What's the average managers salary in tesco? 2. How hard is the options programme 3. Can you move cities / towns to other stores, I'm kind of stuck in a small town but the rest of the towns around me are also similar sized with the nearest coty being an hour and a bit away and in a different group, so can you move groups? 4. Would it be a s*** choice to do options haha.
I know I'm probably going to get ripped to shreds for asking for this info here but ay well
You've been to university. By definition, you have low self-esteem and an aversion to doing real work.
Perfect Tesco manager material, in other words. Get yourself on options, son. You'll go a long way. >:D
As someome who worked nights and went to university during the day at the same time, that must make me the exception then.
Haven't actually been to uni, taking a gap year at the moment
But thanks for the advice so far, seems options is mainly used as a cheap way to ruin someones life haha, but if you've got some brain cells you can do well.
If you've got a few brain cells you wouldn't become a retail manager.
Quote from: Siwel123 on 07-12-19, 02:56PM
But thanks for the advice so far, seems options is mainly used as a cheap way to ruin someones life haha, but if you've got some brain cells you can do well.
Management don't want intelligence, they want yes men and women, disagree with anything a store manager says or stand up for yourself, the door opening to management becomes further away
The thing is people who say they wish to progress in Tesco tend to get used big time, expected to work every hour God sends for no extra pay, anything a manager does not wish to do, your going to be doing it, complain about either of the points mentioned, you will be told your not showing enough commitment, go along with it all, you will be told time and time again to keep going as your nearly ready for sign off, on, move to a new role etc. The entire system is awful and very few make it through.
Quote from: NightAndDay on 07-12-19, 01:50PM
As someome who worked nights and went to university during the day at the same time, that must make me the exception then.
"Worked nights" is like, "honest politician" or, "brave Italian". It's an oxymoron. >:D
How fast you progress still depends on who you know and whether your store manager is prepared to let you go.
You need to be good but not so good the store cant function without you. Being related to/sleeping with/or hinting you would potentially sleep with someone at least at store manager level seems to speed up the process.
Yes management has been cut in structure changes and it's fair to presume more will go in future. However you shouldn't let that hold you back as in any job no one knows what's around the corner.
Quote from: Siwel123 on 07-12-19, 02:51PM
Haven't actually been to uni, taking a gap year at the moment
Unless you are spending it doing charity work in a third-world country then that does come across well on your CV.
Quote from: VladPutin on 07-12-19, 06:09PM
Quote from: NightAndDay on 07-12-19, 01:50PM
As someome who worked nights and went to university during the day at the same time, that must make me the exception then.
"Worked nights" is like, "honest politician" or, "brave Italian". It's an oxymoron. >:D
Express-esso fuel site not superstore, express fuel site on nights is thr hardest job role in Tesco.
[admin]And back to the topic, Options/becoming a manager.[/admin]
Quote from: NightAndDay on 08-12-19, 12:59AM
Quote from: VladPutin on 07-12-19, 06:09PM
Quote from: NightAndDay on 07-12-19, 01:50PM
As someome who worked nights and went to university during the day at the same time, that must make me the exception then.
"Worked nights" is like, "honest politician" or, "brave Italian". It's an oxymoron. >:D
Express-esso fuel site not superstore, express fuel site on nights is thr hardest job role in Tesco.
Once again a subjective opinion
Quote from: Dougall on 08-12-19, 02:30PM
Quote from: NightAndDay on 08-12-19, 12:59AM
Quote from: VladPutin on 07-12-19, 06:09PM
Quote from: NightAndDay on 07-12-19, 01:50PM
As someome who worked nights and went to university during the day at the same time, that must make me the exception then.
"Worked nights" is like, "honest politician" or, "brave Italian". It's an oxymoron. >:D
Express-esso fuel site not superstore, express fuel site on nights is thr hardest job role in Tesco.
Once again a subjective opinion
"And back to the topic, Options/becoming a manager"
Alot of negativity here. But remember this site is primarily a griping complaining site full of people who are discontent with the company.
They are all superstar amazing workers who all have s*** managers and could do their job no problem or earn 50k at any other job in life but choose not to in principle.
The odd nugget of actual help and insight does appear among the doom and gloom but every company has a site like this or people who feel the same about their company.
Also remember most on here are basing their opinion on likely 1 store and how it works and assuming that is how every Tesco works.
So my advice for you if you want to go on options to become a manager. Try to latch onto a manager who is regarded as good in your store, take thier advice on how they do things or what they prioritise.
Your main job as a manager now is to enable your team to do their job all the time to the best of their ability. That comes in many different forms. Doing their training, communicating with them, Looking after thier holidays listening to their worries and acting on them or explaining your decesion why something is changing and getting them to want to work with you.
Short term results can be achieved by shouting and telling people "you have to do this" long term that never works.
That's just my general advice but the biggest difference in a good GA going up to a manager is that you have to make 10-50 people good as you can't do the work of 50 people by you doing crazy hours running yourself ragged.
The best advice I can give you is to go to university and try your best to do well in whatever subject you choose, in Retail and other industries, there's a glass ceiling for progression for those without a degree compared to those with one. Many do Retail as a career, but I think very few had aspirations to become a Store or Retail Manager when entering the world of work, if you are so inclined, then I still recommend going through the graduate route rather than options for long term progression in Retail.
Lots of graduate schemes these days don't care what your degrees in (usually as long as it has an element of Maths in it) as long as you get a 2:1 or borderline 2:1/2:2 with extenutating circumstances and a genuine interest in the industry, this applies to many industries, degree apprenticeships are also raising in popularity.
my personal journey on options...passed sign on and my manager (who was really good) went on maternity leave after a month. I had one weekly review with her before she left and that was the only one in the subsequent 5 years.
My next manager was a nice chap but very career oriented (his) and showed no interest in my development. He left after around 9 months and the store manager also changed. my next dept manager was an options placement from within the store, no interest at all in my development, store manager was preoccupied with turning around the badly performing store. I organised all my own workshops including sourcing all the workbooks. completed every one and then......nothing.
Store closed and transferred to a smaller format (express, lol) threw every bit of work in the bin because it was absolutely clear that you get nowhere in t*sco unless you are buddies with people in positions of control. Saw the most unsuitable people breeze through and get placements, weak and easily manipulated, aggressive bullies, all because they had the right contacts learned more in express than you could ever imagine but got paid a pittance for the hard work and received no recognition.
I no longer work in the company, left earlier in the year and for regular Mon-fri in a manufacturing role I am earning quite a bit more than my old express SM. it might work out for you, I may have had a bad experience, I really could only recommend getting out of retail, if not at least get out of tesco. the stress to pay ratio is not compatible with living a normal life. good luck in whatever you do =)
Options is self driven and self motivated. As above, you need to look after yourself as much as you can. A good manager will help and support and you will need that. You need to be prepared to be a pest, only you are looking after you and you need to be a pest to get things done like wkly reviews. There is also an element of managers standing back and not helping you if you don't help yourself.
You get more rounded knowledge in smaller stores but you tend to get the dept experts in the larger stores. The progression into a larger store is easier. Going into a smaller store is much harder without that broad knowledge base.
People tend to stay in larger stores. They do in my area anyway. We have managers with long service in same role and have often never worked in other stores. It's dead men's shoes waiting for jobs. Jobs do come up, but not very often.
Who would give up a Team Managers job in large format a lot get 30K+ a year for passing the blame to the higher up senior team and SM and passing the rest to GAs a lot who are on c**p part time hours.
Lead team are on 30k a year plus, ceiling earnings for Team Managers as far as i'm aware is 32k a year.
This was me it took me 8 months from sign on to sign off, i loved every second of it. Youve got to have a backbone or you will get walked all over. The job paid 22k once signed off but i decided the weekends and late nights was not good for me or my family. I know work in supply chain mon - fri and get paid more.. it
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
My experience of people being on options is twofold.
Some who went on options, but had a bit of nouse about them, in regard of standing up for themselves and challenging, progressed well and soon achieved sign off....though finding a vacant position to apply for became harder after the restructuring, and moving area was mostly required. However if you're really good, the SM will try and block your transfer as much as possible, as they don't want to lose a good worker, who they can keep, with vague promises of something in the pipeline ???
Others who went on options were non starters, obviously not managegement material, but useful as goffers to the managers. They never got signed off, but were always encouraged to try again, usually in September ready for the big build up, given huge responsibilities (good for their development ) and were almost flogged to death for the twelve weeks, doing everything on 12 hour shifts. Then come January, told not suitable AGAIN!
The armed forces are about the only place now in my opinion, where they train everyone properly for free, and in so many varied and differing trades, with qualifications highly regarded and recognised.
[/quote]
There appears to be many different ways to go about Options. I have seen lots of people progress on nights lately. They have not all been successful,or found it doesn't suit them. First of all are you in a store that supports its Options people. Some stores appear far better than others, also some managers are better than others. I think it's all good experience for whatever you end up doing. As long as you stay sensible and don't get walked over like others have said then it's all learnings for the future. And any other career you go to would rather hear you have looked at moving on or up and not just milled around waiting for a job to find you.
Like I say nights and twilights are doing lots in our area and its driven by the people partner and there are vacancies in our area. Sometimes if there are no jobs it seems to drag out for people. I would say dont listen to all the bad stories. I have seen both sides. It may be something I look at when I've finished my studies. Never say never. Good luck.
Don't let anyone put you off going for a managers job. But be aware that some managers will take the p**s out of you on options only to tell you a year or so later that they wont be signing anyone off as theres a hold on it. Seen it and two decent people left the company shortly afterwards.
No harm in getting experience as a manager whilst you try and figure out what you want to do with our life.
Quote from: NightAndDay on 09-12-19, 12:05PM
Lead team are on 30k a year plus, ceiling earnings for Team Managers as far as i'm aware is 32k a year.
Senior team manager at our store when I worked there ( extra format ) was on 72k a year. He wore a Patek Philippe watch on the shop floor and drove a 50 grand motor........and did absolute jack s*** all day. Wonder if it's different for different stores
Take your gap year mate and don't come back. There is no future in this company. Manager will be axed next and replaced with shift leaders very soon.
The future of the Retail industry isn't good, apart from the uncertainties around Brexit, the state of the macro-economy and Retail slowly transitioning into a state of 100% automation, the experience you get as a retail manager is only good as a character building exercise, yes some of the stuff you do is relevent in other management/hr jobs, but outside of retail they typically want someone with a degree. In my opinion, the work ethic and attendance habits are the most valuable things I left Tesco with.
The future of retail isn't good but for some others it is great.
My advice to anyone considering starting the options programme was always the same instore when asked:
-Sign up for all the courses and training you can possibly do
-Use the options platform for a potential career not necessarily in the big T or even retail
-Understand that it is going to be difficult
-You WILL get taken advantage with long expected hours all over the day
-Staff may not take well to your stepping up, especially longer serving staff
-Sod the company and use all the training for your own benefit
-After everything and you stay, you could be one of the good managers and not one of the poor ones and make a difference for your team
You should not be allowed to be a team manager where you have previously been a GA. Simples!
That used to be a rule in Tesco anyone who got promoted had to move store, not sure if that's still the case.
If you go for options, what is the worst that would happen? 1, lose your job. A bit extreme, but it happens. 2, decide you still want to be a G.A.. A likely scenario, and quite common. I have known a fair few options candidates who have struggled, decided they are being taken for a fool/ride, and returned to G.A. status feeling quite bitter. 3, if you do well and your face fits, move to another store, where you have no baggage and find wether you are capable or not. If you decide options or not, I wish you well.
What options? :)
Quote from: Cleaner1 on 23-12-19, 12:36PM
You should not be allowed to be a team manager where you have previously been a GA. Simples!
You should experience another store, even if it's just for a short while. Does not always happen.
Simple fact, there are only so many jobs, have to go where the job is. Could be that a manager is moving/leaving and that a prime candidate is spotted to come up through the ranks. Fellow colleagues resent this and it can be hard. They will refuse to admit that candidate deserves a shot at it. Harder than moving stores.
It's usually Hungarians etc who become team managers who can't even do the GA role.
Two of my friends in my store were told yesterday that the SM wants to start them up on the Options journey. They have a meeting about it on Friday. This is something I think I'd be interested in in future. Any advice on what the whole process involves and what you get out of it along the way please?
What will you get out of it along the way - You'll be used, abused. lied to. expected to work for nothing. sacrifice your social life, work all the hours god sends, pick up shifts no one else wants to do. etc etc etc. And when you finally get tired of it all and start saying "No" they'll drop you like a stone and look for the next mug. Get the picture now?
I would suggest you stand back and watch your friends going through the process...many people go onto options and give up mid way. It entirely depends on the store, mainly the SM, senior team and the accepted culture of the management in general.
Are your friends easily manipulated? I ask, as it's going into silly season which is the run up to Christmas. This is the time, in my experience, that CA's are encouraged onto the options programme...mainly because they will be used as general dogsbodies. Given whole department's to run, expected to work 12-14 hour shifts, as its "good for their development" will pick up all the middle/ late shifts, the duty phone most shifts, and be working all over Christmas, bar Xmas day. They will be on the last shift Christmas Eve and the earliest Boxing Day, the same for New Year's Eve and New Year's Day. Then come February, they will be told that they don't show enough potential " at this time" but to gain more experience in retail and they'll look at it again in 6 months (start of next silly season)
There is a glut of displaced managers at the moment, with ongoing structure changes, more could follow.
It may not be the case for your store, and your friends may prove very good, but even if signed off, they are expected to take on a managerial role, without the pay, until they secure a management position they applied for.
:D
About 15 years ago was the time to be on options at Tesco. Any old ratbag with the IQ of an ant could put themselves forward for it and actually manage to get a management job at the end of it if they persevered enough. That's why Tesco has such a large amount of 'quality' managers in place at the moment.
Not saying the odd person can't make from GA to manager through the options programme nowadays but it'll take a whole load more time and work and/or knowing the right people. If you manage to get to the end of the process you'll then maybe find that there aren't actually any managers jobs going anymore as, well, there aren't going to be that many available managers jobs anymore.
And then just when you think there's an available managers job coming.....they'll parachute in the kid from the graduate scheme who's never done a days work in retail in their lives.
Good luck with it all though :)
The convenience area manager of my old group has a new system in place, I'm unsure if the new process is company wide or just one she's made up, but after an incident where a highly paid SM put forward someone to be options express SM, and in the first month racked up 20 grievances after being put in a "training store" (I prefer the term special store) she not only stepped him back down to shift leader but also changed the process of internal promotions, past shift leader, a Store Manager can no longer put you forward for promotion, candidates must now seek out the roles and interview for them off their own back.
That is not to say that the AM in question won't have any influence over the decision making (in my view, she's turned down too many meritocratically suitable candidates for me to give any credence to Tescos selection process.)
With this being the case, it is common practice for options SMs to be placed on options for an excessively long period of time to save cost, there are no guarantees of promotion or development (proper development, not the mickey mouse development the current matey boy SMs give you.) All it is is a carrot on a stick to get more out of you for an extra grand a year if that, don't bother doing it.
Options is being pushed at the moment. Just be aware that depending on where you live there are very few jobs going but I suspect a shuffle could be on the way next year. Becoming a manager is not about doing your old job on extra money with just issuing a few tasks to others. It can be a good or bad experience depending on your store. It also has to be self driven and self motivated so to a large extent what you get out of it is up to you.
Quote from: NavyNinja on 23-09-20, 01:06PM
Two of my friends in my store were told yesterday that the SM wants to start them up on the Options journey. They have a meeting about it on Friday. This is something I think I'd be interested in in future. Any advice on what the whole process involves and what you get out of it along the way please?
This isnt the best forum to be asking that question in all honesty. There are a lot of helpful posters who can share information not readily available or who can advise in circumstances involving misinformation from poorly trained managers or colleagues. There is a new options pack on colleague help that you can look at.
Ordinarily you are nominated by your manager who puts you forward for sign on to the programme. At a talent and resource meeting (managers and people partners from convenience and large stores in your local area meet every few months) your nomination is discussed and you are usually put onto the program.
Tesco will tell you that the program is self driven, this is true to an extent but you won't get to where you want to be on your own.
You learn the technical knowledge for team manager through workshops and e learning. Once you have completed the training the next stage is your placement. This can be a 12-26 week placing of you in a team manager role. You should have regular reviews throughout the placement until it ends and you are either signed off as a manager and await appointment into a role or the programme ends and you come off the programme.
I believe you now receive a percentage of the pay for that role during placement, eg the job pays 23k you get 20k pro rata for the time during your placement. Get this confirmed though.
My advice would be to apply for a shift leader/team support position and do the options programme from that position as the jump from customer assistant to team manager can be quite a leap.
The expansion plan for the next few years is very aggressive mainly in England so there may be opportunities for shift leader/team manager/express store manager.
Good luck.
I know an SM who has been on options for over a year, they move her store to store without increasing pay, a lot of the time, promises of sign off are dependent on the position being available which means waiting for a manager to quit, which could be a long time.
I would say if you really want to get promoted to Team Manager and beyond then the graduate scheme is the best way, £28k starting salary, advertised fast track to Express SM in 18 months and the process has more checks and balances in their governance system than the one of options scheme, the options scheme which offers a vastly lower salary, no promises of progression and being ruled by a psuedo-dictator.
As someone who was on the options scheme for 2 years running nights at a fuel site 1 on 1, got bullied and transferred only to be replaced by a full fledged shift leader and an additional ca, it's an extremely flawed process.
I got signed off in March this year, then we went into lock down. When I returned at the beginning of August I was told that because of a ‘soft structure change’ I couldn’t be apportioned at the store - despite the fact that I had been managing the department since Nov. 19, before lock down.
I have also been told that there are no management jobs in my area.
I was asked to go on secondment for 6 months on nights at an Extra & only be paid an extra £209 per week / night premium of £2.95 on top of my contracted hours of 32 hours per week. The starting hourly rate for a newly appointed team manager is £12.95 per hour.
I’m only earning an extra £50 per week give or take. With the added stress & extra Unpaid hours it isn’t really worth it. I’m thinking of stepping down already. At least I’ll get paid for the extra hours that I do & I’ll get a break. Tesco really has gone to the dogs & being a team manager is for mugs.
All I can say is don't bother!! Signed off on options last year only to be told afterwards that the vacancy I had be working towards, was no longer available due to sturture change. I returned to my original store and kept dangling for another 10 months.....yet again nothing. Waste of time massively.
Now because of the structure change in superstore, there's less manager positions going round making opportunity for progression harder to come by, though even with this being the case, I doubt it will stop the whole "good for your develooment" spiel, though there will no doubt be desperate and gullible people bending over backwards for a slither of hope of progression.
It depends on where you live. There are jobs regularly going online for some parts of the country. The word is that being willing to relocate may be key to being put on options now.
Just had a look and there are currently five vacancies within 50 miles of London.
Have been asked in the past if I'd be interested (way before the recent changes) but I'd heard too many stories of previous colleagues going down the Options route only to be constantly messed around to the point they threw in the towel and either remained in situ or left the company altogether.
The last person to go on placement in our store returned to their previous store and is now working at either Aldi or Lidl.
Personal opinion but I really do feel they need to stop peddling this 'opportunities to get on' rubbish.
Quote from: Redshoes on 06-05-21, 07:50AM
It depends on where you live. There are jobs regularly going online for some parts of the country. The word is that being willing to relocate may be key to being put on options now.
Yes, but that's always been the case, the strategy of becoming less top heavy by devolving responsibilities of management roles and having more feet on the floor occupied by the likes of shift leader positions means there's fewer management positions and more people competing for what little there will be.
Add to this, there's the psychological aspect, this strategy is being seen across competitors, more often than not, back in better times Retail managers jumped ship to competitors for a higher salary or a more senior position, but with the likes of Asda and Sainsburys cutting down the head count of their manager positions, it has led to somewhat of a bullish market, current Retail managers everywhere are holding on to their jobs in the face of decreased opportunities elsewhere, this means that not only are there less positions to go around, but staff turnover for these now valuable management positions have plummeted due to economic uncertainty.
On the occasions when fresh faced people come to the store on Options stuff. It's interesting to see how long till their optimism about the position goes. That look of 'I am here for a purpose' doesn't last long.
Managers have a quota to recruit people to options thats why its pushed so hard they are measured on it.
Quote from: NightAndDay on 06-05-21, 08:43PM
Quote from: Redshoes on 06-05-21, 07:50AM
It depends on where you live. There are jobs regularly going online for some parts of the country. The word is that being willing to relocate may be key to being put on options now.
Yes, but that's always been the case, the strategy of becoming less top heavy by devolving responsibilities of management roles and having more feet on the floor occupied by the likes of shift leader positions means there's fewer management positions and more people competing for what little there will be.
Add to this, there's the psychological aspect, this strategy is being seen across competitors, more often than not, back in better times Retail managers jumped ship to competitors for a higher salary or a more senior position, but with the likes of Asda and Sainsburys cutting down the head count of their manager positions, it has led to somewhat of a bullish market, current Retail managers everywhere are holding on to their jobs in the face of decreased opportunities elsewhere, this means that not only are there less positions to go around, but staff turnover for these now valuable management positions have plummeted due to economic uncertainty.
There are still manager jobs being advertised in some areas.
The manager jobs should not be easy to come by. There was a time when people were just asked to become managers and stepped into jobs almost straight away. It is hard on those on options now or have completed options and awaiting appointment but for the stores who have vacancies they now can pick from the applicants that apply and not have to settle for the only one up for the role. There are a lot of comments on here about the quality of managers. The company is now in a position to pick the best candidate for the job. They are also in the position where they can manager a poor performer out of a job and then have the pick of candidates.
Retail is like everywhere else, there is no such thing as a job for life. Those who are honest and work hard will always be the ones the company will want to retain. Going forward they will probably need to show team player capabilities. Managers will definitely have to see the bigger picture and look at the whole store and not break things down into Depts.
I have got long service, I have been through restructure myself three times now. I know what it feels like to be under consultation but digging in your heals and refusing changes in tasks is a battle individuals can win but I don't think they will ever win the war. There will be opportunities, there will be jobs. Some areas may move slower than others but you need to help yourself and be aware of the way things are going.
"Those who are honest and work hard will always be the ones the company will want to retain."
Opposite view in 10,9,8,7,6,....
We are at a point now where there are almost zero opportunities to get on. The company have dangled the carrot of progression and mugged GAs off for years but we are now at a stage where you really may as well forget about progression all together - unless you are willing to relocate anywhere in the county and are happy with Express being you're only realistic possibility.
I personally know of 4 GAs/Shift Leaders in my group that over the past 12 months moved to different stores and eventually we're signed off - only for them now to all be told to go back to their original stores.
The company is in a dark place. It no longer values experience and/or capability. The values no longer apply. It only wants part-time flexi workers with a skeletal management team. Cutbacks after cutbacks and a wealth of knowledge and experience left through redundancy thanks to the elimination of a lot of night teams, team leaders and full-time staff. It's amazing that a lot of store management teams can't understand why GAs working 12hrs a week of a flexi contract neither have enough time to do their roles effectively and simply have no passion.
Samcro sums the situation up perfectly, one of the reasons I left last year was lack of progression chances, when my line manager talked with me about why I was going he said himself he is looking for something else as he has been told off the record he is to old to move on now as the company want younger managers, he is 36 by the way. He also left after Christmas to train up as an SM for Sainsburys local and has recently moved into his own store. I hope he does well as to be fair he was one of the better managers I had at Tesco and to be honest deserved a chance to move upwards.
There is still people being put on options in our store
To be strung along as GA's for 12 months
Quote from: penguin on 09-05-21, 03:01PM
Samcro sums the situation up perfectly, one of the reasons I left last year was lack of progression chances, when my line manager talked with me about why I was going he said himself he is looking for something else as he has been told off the record he is to old to move on now as the company want younger managers, he is 36 by the way. He also left after Christmas to train up as an SM for Sainsburys local and has recently moved into his own store. I hope he does well as to be fair he was one of the better managers I had at Tesco and to be honest deserved a chance to move upwards.
I to was told I was too old to progress when I was 30, the SM at the time and I had our own issues between us, but to his credit he was being honest, he said he himself (38/39 years old at the time) was told he was too old to progress, that the SM job isn't all it's cracked up to be and he's staying put only because of the salary and job security.
The nature of the Retail industry despite the current economic climate of constant restructuring centered around cost cutting is that it's a young persons game, I was fortunate enough to be qualified, educated and intelligent enough to move out of Retail into an industry where my salary rapidly exceeded that of Team Manager then Express SM then Lead Manager then Area Manager, then Superstore SM and is now in the region of Store Director earnings. At the time I was told by my SM that I wasn't worth more than 24k a year.
There are better opportunities out there for those seeking it, but it's sad for those wanting a career in Retail to be in the industry right now, the tough times are likely to continue until either the economy recovers from Brexit and Covid or there's a USA style services industry revolt like what is currently happening.
Over the years there have been good managers and bad, however recently we do seem to have recruited some very lazy self centrered team managers and when looking for new managers for options they should start looking at hard working staff not the ones that fall into a slot in order to Make them "modern".
Being a hard worker doesn't make you a good manager unfortunately. They do need to look at how people are brought through the business. It's far too easy for the wrong people to be put into management because of who they know etc
I wish someone told me I'm too old to progress, it would be a quick easy payday for me
Being a hard worker is all you needed to work your way up in express a few years back, if one could work a delivery quickly the chance to be a step up and then a team leader, and possibly more usually followed very quickly, no formal training needed just do you want the job mate kind of thing, and not many said no, eventually the company found being a hard worker does not always mean someone can run a shift well or lead people, many hard workers can but a good number cannot, things are different now as shift leaders in express replaced team leaders and to get that job you attend a formal interview and training programme.
When I first started a number of years ago we had one manager who was brilliant in terms of he wasn't brown nosing, he treated everyone equally and if he had to cover the backdoor in the morning, he would do.
Sadly, as time progressed, people got wind of the fact he worked hard and run rings around him and the lovely (I use the endearment sarcastically) Lead manager made his life a misery.
He couldn't do right for doing wrong and ended up just leaving one day.
There's absolutely nothing wrong with hard work but in my personal opinion there are times when it can be counter productive.
Yep we have had a couple of those types over the years. They dont last long they tend to show up the other managers for the lazy waste of times they are.
Couldn't agree more Forrest.
Still, with the way this company is going, there'll be no one left at this rate to be lazy as they'll have no one to manage.
Not that I would miss any of them :D.
I'm in my 14th year of service. If I could turn back time I would put in half the amount of effort I have and I'm certain I would be better off for it. Hard work does not mean progression - in all honesty it is hard work that holds people back. There are plenty of GAs in the company who hold departments together, who unofficially run a department on behalf of their manager. The company depends on GAs like that, which is why the progression carrot is dangled but ultimately it leads to nothing.
Quite Samcro, seen it far to often, GA or in the past TL who could easily be doing a higher role but never offered the chance to move on so the department or store does not lose them, while the useless ones the managers and especially the SM wants gone are giving glowing reviews and fast tracked into stores elsewhere.
In complete agreement Samcro.
There's one colleague on our team who was offered the chance to progress a number of years ago now but has been messed around constantly since.
Even now they do far more than the TM for £9.30 an hour.
Have lost count the amount of times a TM/SM has gone to them to delegate 'managerial' responsibilities but is quick to have a dig and 'remind' them they are just a GA.
They've told me in the past the then SM has turned around and said that there's something stopping them progressing but that they didn't know what it was.
Erm... perhaps the fact you know full well they'll do pretty much any job you'll ask them. Heaven forbid the TM is the one who is challenged and asked to carry out said task.
And that's before said SM tried to make out their mental health wasn't 'up to it'-the colleague in question actually suffering mentally because they felt unable to speak up about treated like a doormat because SM/TM would have turned around and told them they are being mardy/petty/too quiet ???.
Quote from: SAMCRO on 18-05-21, 06:09PM
I'm in my 14th year of service. If I could turn back time I would put in half the amount of effort I have and I'm certain I would be better off for it. Hard work does not mean progression - in all honesty it is hard work that holds people back. There are plenty of GAs in the company who hold departments together, who unofficially run a department on behalf of their manager. The company depends on GAs like that, which is why the progression carrot is dangled but ultimately it leads to nothing.
If you had put in half the effort in your 14 years you would have been at least a store manager by now ;D as I have said before most of the managers are so mixed up in trying to cause problems with let's talk c**p and other nonentities and can barely tie their shoelaces, not saying all as there are some good managers but I would love to see some of these impoverish neanderthals try and run their own business.
Batmanjo... I'd rather buy Third Class tickets for the Titanic than see some of the TMs in my store actually 'run' the store/their own business :D
a lot of them couldn't run a f***ing bath!!!
:D :D :D.
Took the words right out of my mouth.
[admin]Topic is, Options / becoming a manager.[/admin]
I was told many years ago that you don't give the keys to the sweet shop to a kid. Too many options candidates are lacking experience in life never mind management. They also don't realise that getting signed off is the beginning of the journey not the end point. Typically people on options are grafters , but hard work will only get you so far. Murphy's Law is true and you can see it in action every day in store they can work 10 cages but can't build a rota or plan holidays or do reviews etc etc.
It's been my experience that Tesco is loaded with lazy idiots in their management teams.
And they also tend only to promote those who fit it.
Which means the problem only grows bigger and bigger.
It's just an ever growing pile of c**p.
The few good managers flee the company because they're tired of the c**p too.
Quote from: Ibanker2 on 21-05-21, 12:19PM
I was told many years ago that you don't give the keys to the sweet shop to a kid. Too many options candidates are lacking experience in life never mind management. They also don't realise that getting signed off is the beginning of the journey not the end point. Typically people on options are grafters , but hard work will only get you so far. Murphy's Law is true and you can see it in action every day in store they can work 10 cages but can't build a rota or plan holidays or do reviews etc etc.
80% of the time options is exploitation, sure a few on options are built like brick s*** houses and can slaughter delivery, but don't have the IQ or organisation to get signed off, others like me wouldn't have got signed off if I didn't grievance, plenty of step ups outperforming TMs and above.
When I transferred store they replaced me with a fully fledged SL and an additional CA, combined hourly wage now would be more than £20 an hour (as I was on nights). Outside of the graduate scheme, the options system is flawed as there are no checks and balances on the conduct of managers overseeing the development of options candidates.
The managers who have the candidates best interests at heart and using options the way it's intended are in the minority, most are self serving machiavellian idiots using the carrot on a stick aspect to get blue ratings on costs and other big 6 measures.
To put it into perspective, I've been told I'm not worth more than 26k a year when I'm now on a 6 figure salary (of course not in Tesco, but still a leadership role).
Go figure
"People on options are grafters" seriously! How long have you worked for the company for? The typical options candidate is a clueless, brown noser, chosen for their ability to go how high when asked to jump by the store manager on the basis it's good for their development.
The ones with any talent have to do it the hard way but these are the ones who never get found out.
Many people on options see progression as staying in same job but on more money. Being able to work a cage quickly does not make a good manger but being a manager requires hands on.
in my opinion old school managers are much better than the youngsters they make managers nowadays
I have never met a manager with fully managerial skill, best just got admin skill.
No basic business managerial, financial managerial, marketing, human resources, none. What I found from these people, mostly when they are higher than sm, its only about ocd-ness. About cleanliness in not so obvious spot, level row, height of object, colour matching, budget without calculating resources and target, and avoid like a plaque all the real problem.
It is sad, because tesco still have some potential.
Hard worker people on option is still better, even if they admin skills are low, rather than slow, bossy, can't do much with no admin skills.
Quote from: lackofinterest on 22-05-21, 02:25PM
in my opinion old school managers are much better than the youngsters they make managers nowadays
The main reason being old school managers usually had worked there way up, one of our old store managers started as a Saturday lad collecting trollies, and worked his way up over about 20 years, someone like that is going to have far more experience than someone who has spent a few weeks in a training room and then been put in charge of a store or a department, I know its not considered the done thing anyone but the old way of people in general not just Tesco starting at the bottom and working there way up in there chosen job worked a lot better than thinking taking a course means someone can quickly be promoted.
Times have changed since then, Tesco was a very different beast 20 years ago. Nowadays it's a company focused on costs and profits above all, it's not the investor in people it once was, the training is also very bare bones nowadays compared to back then. Working your way up through the company doesn't hold the guarantee of competent managers now than it did back then.
I have seen many come in after uni and I have seen those who have come up the ranks. At the end of the day it's the person that matters. You can't learn people skills. As soon as someone is put under pressure they revert to type. It does not matter how you learned, someone can say all the right things but it's actions that really matter.
Who cares
Options in my store seem to be the chosen option to thin out the number of team leader that wouldn't accept shift leader role or being demoted and pay cut to CA.
Quote from: horatiocain on 21-05-21, 01:15PM
It's been my experience that Tesco is loaded with lazy idiots in their management teams.
And they also tend only to promote those who fit it.
Which means the problem only grows bigger and bigger.
It's just an ever growing pile of c**p.
The few good managers flee the company because they're tired of the c**p too.
a common theme in every store i think! especially ours
Yep ever single store Scruff, back in my express days we had a shift leader join from superstore where he had been a GA, it was obvious to anyone he was far better as a leader than the store manager and within weeks to all intents and purposes he was running the shop, although not a bad thing as the store manger used to spend half the time locked in the office crying when anything went wrong or even if it just became a stressful day, shift leader in question wanted to move on and said so time and time again, after getting sick of banging his head against a brick wall he quit and went to Aldi, he is now a store manager and is already being asked if he wants to move further up, meanwhile in that express the same sm is still in place and still acting as she always has. A totally ridiculous situation but sadly far from a one off.
Been at a Lancs store for 14 years working my ass off in a morning doing jobs of three people. I ran a business for afew years so been part time but things haven't been so good recently. I've been offered options but heard it's not great. Experiences please?
If you've been there 14 years, I daresay you already know the answer? How many have gone on options in your store during that time, and never got signed off?? Ask those who tried their experience of what was expected of them, and why they didn't succeed?
This comes up every year at this time...it's coming up for silly season. Saturday hails 13 weeks to Christmas Eve, the Christmas plans will be dropping down, the stock will be arriving, the warehouse will be filling up and the summer seasonal students have left.
You will be expected to do most management jobs without the pay. The term "good for your development" will constantly be used to have you running around in circles as their personal go-for!
You will do all the lates, expected to do the 12 hour shifts and I can guarantee you will be last to leave Christmas Eve, and first in Boxing Day...ditto for New Year's Eve and New Year's Day!
In February they will tell you, you haven't made the grade this time and perhaps try again in another 6 months! Meanwhile you'll now be treated as a colleague with some training, so will be first they go to to cover menial management tasks!
If you're interested on going on options, ask them when there's a lull due, possibly just before Easter, where they may be tempted to cover the busy weekend, then you could get the chance of proper training for the rest of the six months.
I had an idea just needed the nudge being stuck, I was offered didn't say interested. Everyone at ours on options ended up leaving over the years so no-one to ask. Sounds more like voluntary work than paid work?
Don't give them your answer yet, there may be other supporters on this site who have gone on options at this time of year, and give you an insight into what their experiences were!
I can only tell you the constant experiences I witnessed of people going on options in my store! But to be honest, if they've got you covering every morning for other people now, would seem a similar store management culture to mine!
Might be just them thinking of Christmas. I would hold off. If they think you can do the job they will wait till after Christmas. Tell them you have already made commitments over the festive period. If only they had come to you a few months ago.
I did the apprenticeship about 10 years ago to join options and passed but didn't take it any further because I started my business so could manage part time work instead of progressing. It's been since I had to close my business, not sure if they're taking advantage or believe I can do it. Hold off till after Christmas?
One experienced manager put it like this to me.
If you're a team support wanting to go on options. Why would you give up the hourly rate for an extra (on paper) £3k or something, in return work a fully flexible rota, work all the hours that god sends, no overtime, treated like c**p and being the newbie getting all the rubbish jobs, all whilst not being given half the training needed to do the job? So why not just stay organising the breaks for the aunties on the tills and save yourself the stress, as they no longer invest in staff simply want to exploit!
I was offered the opportunity didn't say I wanted to, was just asking opinions before I make any decisions. In a polite way, those "aunties" are the people who have been there years and actually want to work and do a damn good job, not come in wanting to be paid to do nothing like lots of them these days
Options = Staff exploitation scheme. (Mugs only, need apply)
In a good company, a step up or an option before busy time is a good way for you to show how capable you are and take the ladder of management up.
In a bad company, a step up or an option before busy time is a way to have cheap low manager to be used to covering the role needed.
The question is, do you think tesco or at least your store is a good one or a bad one.
There is deputising pay now but I think the real question is the the jobs at the end. I don't know what the rest of the country is like but my store is overmanned by one manager but other in the group are still very top heavy.
we have no shift leaders,but all our managers are in their late 50's waiting for retirement or redundancy
There probably won't be any redundancy for managers again, just natural wastage.
Quote from: Andi_Lancs on 21-09-22, 05:11PMI had an idea just needed the nudge being stuck, I was offered didn't say interested. Everyone at ours on options ended up leaving over the years so no-one to ask. Sounds more like voluntary work than paid work?
If you want to progress in the company then do what you have to but like others have said, you will be expected to do everything for nothing.
Seen a few people on options for over a year and they ended up leaving because it became clear they weren't actually going to be signed off anytime soon.
You need a a manager who is actually going to help you, show you all the ropes and put your name forward for higher roles/placements elsewhere.
Quote from: kaled78 on 22-09-22, 07:27AMwe have no shift leaders,but all our managers are in their late 50's waiting for retirement or redundancy
At 50 is 16 years until retirement. It's a long, long time to coast. We have been told often enough that the chances of redundancy are very slim. My guess is that if redundancy will be removal of certain roles, as they did with compliance manager. It may be modified for the different sizes of stores but I think unlikely to be open to all. So you could have a 68 year old grocery manager hanging on and waiting on redundancy but it's offered to the 25 years old fresh manager. I use grocery and fresh as example as I think they are the least likely to be be ever offered redundancy, they will probably get a change to the role but it will be extra areas to look after.
I know of more than one manager over retirement age that is hanging on and waiting for redundancy. I get that they don't want to miss out but why work years past retirement age on the slim chance they could retire with a huge lump sum. It's not that they can't afford to retire, it's the thought of missing out on that lump sum.
Quote from: Sherwoodforest on 22-09-22, 08:01AMThere probably won't be any redundancy for managers again, just natural wastage.
There will be redundancy for them and for many staff they will also be removing premium for mutliple places such as nights bank holiday sundays etc.
I cant see many stores getting to their required management headcount without another redundancy programme unless they either:-
1) Start performance managing managers out of roles in a serious way.
2) Force managers to move stores to fill vacancies.
3) Make job so unbearable that numbers leaving dramatically increase.
Once colleagues do their own training/admin and the scheduler decides your hours/work - there will be even less need for the current headcount of management.
Quote from: londoner83 on 23-09-22, 08:07AMI cant see many stores getting to their required management headcount without another redundancy programme unless they either:-
1) Start performance managing managers out of roles in a serious way.
2) Force managers to move stores to fill vacancies.
3) Make job so unbearable that numbers leaving dramatically increase.
Once colleagues do their own training/admin and the scheduler decides your hours/work - there will be even less need for the current headcount of management.
s
Tesco will have to increase their wages a lot and will do again in 2023 when the minimum wage increase again so it makes sense for them they will do redundancy and remove more staff. I believe they will be removing staff from the manager side so mass lay off of all managers except for store manager. It is cheaper for them to have 1 store manager and multiple shift leaders. In the store I work in there are no staff for night only around 4 to 5 per night and now we are losing extra 2 staff which will mean per night we will have 3 to 4 staff at most. Which is even worse if we have people going on holiday. I believe that it will be store by store basis.
Quote from: londoner83 on 23-09-22, 08:07AMI cant see many stores getting to their required management headcount without another redundancy programme unless they either:-
1) Start performance managing managers out of roles in a serious way.
2) Force managers to move stores to fill vacancies.
3) Make job so unbearable that numbers leaving dramatically increase.
Once colleagues do their own training/admin and the scheduler decides your hours/work - there will be even less need for the current headcount of management.
Number 3 is a thing, Store Managers get a bonus for managing to get people out of affected roles, they're currently doing it on my friend in Superstore who works in large format by giving him additional responsibility of produce, fresh, counters and bakery while not bumping up his pay from £24k a year. He's thinking about stepping back down to Shift Leader for more money.
Quote from: NightAndDay on 23-09-22, 11:07AMQuote from: londoner83 on 23-09-22, 08:07AMI cant see many stores getting to their required management headcount without another redundancy programme unless they either:-
1) Start performance managing managers out of roles in a serious way.
2) Force managers to move stores to fill vacancies.
3) Make job so unbearable that numbers leaving dramatically increase.
Once colleagues do their own training/admin and the scheduler decides your hours/work - there will be even less need for the current headcount of management.
Number 3 is a thing, Store Managers get a bonus for managing to get people out of affected roles, they're currently doing it on my friend in Superstore who works in large format by giving him additional responsibility of produce, fresh, counters and bakery while not bumping up his pay from £24k a year. He's thinking about stepping back down to Shift Leader for more money.
I don't know anyone who would be happy being
an a shift leader and breaking their back working harder for manager for only 1 pound extra an hour.
Quote from: NightAndDay on 23-09-22, 11:07AMQuote from: londoner83 on 23-09-22, 08:07AMI cant see many stores getting to their required management headcount without another redundancy programme unless they either:-
1) Start performance managing managers out of roles in a serious way.
2) Force managers to move stores to fill vacancies.
3) Make job so unbearable that numbers leaving dramatically increase.
Once colleagues do their own training/admin and the scheduler decides your hours/work - there will be even less need for the current headcount of management.
Number 3 is a thing, Store Managers get a bonus for managing to get people out of affected roles, they're currently doing it on my friend in Superstore who works in large format by giving him additional responsibility of produce, fresh, counters and bakery while not bumping up his pay from £24k a year. He's thinking about stepping back down to Shift Leader for more money.
Everybody's workload has got bigger. As people do leave it's harder and harder on the store to manage this. Could it just not be your friend is just having to cope with the rolling changes. Every manager in my store is feeling it. We talk openly between us and we chat to the store manager about it. We wonder where it will end. We have a store manager with very high standards and we struggle to present the store to his liking. He is not a bad store manager, he understands and is supportive but sometimes asks the impossible. He knows this and will say so but still asks. He can however cope with the open and honest conversation about what he is asking. We also cope by helping each other. We chat and support by physically helping and by offering moral support. Things are just not what they used to be. I saw times like this about 28 years ago and a few times since.
Superstore structure is for us;
Team Manager - dairy, meat & poultry, produce and bakery
Team manager - checkouts, CSD, pfs, trolleys and off till
Team manager - stock control, wages, cash office, pi
Team manager - grocery, non- food, gm, freezers and warehouse
Pay is according to time in role and last review.
Is that 1 team manager per department ie the same one for stock control Cashoffice wages and pi or one for each of them
1 for all i assume,as it is in my extra,
Whether by corporate design or ulterior motive, the strategy of getting more with less only works as long as comparable structures and compensations are in place at the competitors, currently the competition are downsizing in similar ways (except for Sainsbury's) but they pay significantly more in recognition of the additional responsibilities.
£24k a year to manage 37 staff and what equates to about 6 aisles including the technical challenges of the departments (OOC being a much bigger thing in Fresh than grocery) isn't competitive, especially when a shift leader role pays pretty much the same when premiums are factored in.
The store in question has had difficulties retaining a Fresh TM for many years, If they want him to take additional sections as part of the role then I don't see them being able to recruit adequately for the position any time soon, much less on £24k a year when the competition offers £2-3k higher for a similar role.
Quote from: Spec24 on 24-09-22, 02:26PMIs that 1 team manager per department ie the same one for stock control Cashoffice wages and pi or one for each of them
4 managers in total
Quote from: NightAndDay on 24-09-22, 04:45PMWhether by corporate design or ulterior motive, the strategy of getting more with less only works as long as comparable structures and compensations are in place at the competitors, currently the competition are downsizing in similar ways (except for Sainsbury's) but they pay significantly more in recognition of the additional responsibilities.
£24k a year to manage 37 staff and what equates to about 6 aisles including the technical challenges of the departments (OOC being a much bigger thing in Fresh than grocery) isn't competitive, especially when a shift leader role pays pretty much the same when premiums are factored in.
The store in question has had difficulties retaining a Fresh TM for many years, If they want him to take additional sections as part of the role then I don't see them being able to recruit adequately for the position any time soon, much less on £24k a year when the competition offers £2-3k higher for a similar role.
I am down to 37 people now. I used to have over 50. We need to deliver the same with a lot more people. I am on more money than your friend but I have had good reviews and I have been in the role a few years. There used to be a services role but I now do the whole thing so I have pfs, CSD and trolleys on top of the checkout areas. I did have cash office too for a while but that has gone to stock/admin now. I just cover cash office for holidays now. I also used to have team support but as we are not big enough to retain them I now only have off till colleagues.
The job has however got easier in some ways. The fresh manager and I love the extra hours market. So much work off my shoulders. It's much quicker to do and easier to fill shifts.
Managers should be due a pay rise soon, reviews are pending. As a manager yourself you should know this. As someone who has left the company and come back it can't be all bad. No really bad job is worth even a huge pay. I work to live, I don't live to work but I spend far more time in work than I do with my family. I would not do this for any pay if I hated it, life is too short for that. I do have bad day but on the whole there are far more good ones and I like the people I work with.
Tesco's structure and processes for office roles are different compared to in Store, We have quarterly performance reviews and pay reviews 2 times a year, pay is also not solely dependent on performance in my role due to the comparatively poorly defined salaries in industry (bigger variance competitor to competitor compared to more defined store roles) The problem domains are also not always clearly defined and there is a need for SMEs and advisors in various areas, because of this there's not a direct hierarchy, though I am the head of technology and people do report to me and I do manage people, it isn't in the same way as at store level, there isn't a direct translation really, they're completely different in operation, structure, culture and everything else.
Stores are still on performance pay and they do have to manage big teams. So the answer to your friends pay is still the same.
A lot people would say there isn't a big enough difference in pay between SL and the minimum for TM in light of the new structure changes, even £25k a year would at least put them at parity with Sainsbury's 2S CTMs.
to be honest TM pay is better because it's performance based. Yes it's s*** but gets better over time if you do a good job. With SL no matter how hard you work it's still bad for the responsiblity
With the real living wage now at £10.90 an hour outside of london and Tesco's habit of at least matching it year on year and giving the same nominal increase over all graded roles except for Delivery Drivers due to shortages, it implies that the next pay review will be at least an 80p an hour increase across all hourly paid roles, for Shift Leaders this means a minimum of £12.76 an hour, if premiums stay as they are, that means Shift Leaders could be paid over £25k a year from next year, if that is the case it would be very hard to justify new starting TMs to be on less than that.
That presumes the business wants to keep the TM role....
Think it's more likely Shift Leaders will run the shift and existing TM/Lead will compete for a limited number of new manager roles.
They'd be hard pushed for that considering the competition have managerial roles with similar responsibilities salaried, Shift Leaders are equivalent to 2S CTMs in Sainsbury's and they're on just over £25k a year, Team Managers have to do rotas, RTWs etc, more managerial responsibilities, those responsibilities are also not in the Shift Leader role pack, they can't add those responsibilities without using manager in the title and increasing pay by a substantial amount.
Firstly RTWs are a SL job to do. ARs aren't. SL can look after departments when they're manager is away on annual leave/sick etc.
Also other roles and responsibilities such as helping with Rotas can be within SL role if required & agreed. There is a clause within the role pack saying that this list is not exhaustive and other jobs may be required from time to time.
Its such a broad role, which has its positives and negatives.
With regards to rotas this will soon be controlled by computer, rather than Team Managers.
Under the new contract, you can be scheduled anywhere instore as the computer will use your availability window to deliver all fill/pick/serve tasks across the store eliminating any red hours.
The days of the Produce Manager (for example) scheduling produce staff to cover all produce tasks will soon be over.
So is the department specific to be removed from their new contract ???
it will be intresting to see what this new system does with breaks,i:e Fred your on produce from 9-12,then grocery for 12-1,then back on produce from 1-6,what about my lunch hour?,oh just go 12-1 fred
This is what it says online:
If colleagues are scheduled to work in other departments during their shift, it's important that colleagues go for their break as close to the set time as possible, and at very least taken while working on the same department that the break was scheduled. Failing to do this could mean a colleague has to take breaks on another department where there is none scheduled. This could leave a gap on that department E.g.
Customer Service Desk could have a gap as a break was not taken earlier in the day on a previous department or worse a colleague does not get all of their breaks.
You can use the Scheduler tablet and MPC to review the break times for colleagues.
Will be interesting to see what happens when checkouts leave service call folk on there for hours on end, even when queues have died down, and people are taking their breaks when they should be filling BWS, for example ;D
It won't last...there'll be instore arguments going on with the section managers...they didn't get their full quota of help, there was an all hands, their colleagues were called on checkouts so took later breaks, the daily rumble ( or 3) not calculated for etc..etc..
Then the store manager and senior team will override every one of them, to have their own preferred departments fully covered, totally disregarding the system.
It's the old brown paper initiatives and training scenario all over again!
Quote from: lucgeo on 28-09-22, 07:48AMSo is the department specific to be removed from their new contract ???
That false you will have your department but if there is need you will work another department
That was a question, not a statement 8-)
Bobmay- the vast majority of colleagues will have a job title of Tesco Colleague.
Each will have a primary task (their current department) but depending on how much work there is on that area at the time your scheduled to work, you could be scheduled on other areas you are trained on (secondary tasks).
Options is a complete joke, Tesco is a disgrace, the company clearly have an agenda to promote only people who improve diversity figures, senior managers are corrupt and fake, they treat colleagues differently and have favourites and bend the rules for the staff they like.
There is no one at any level who cares and you can't not trust that any concerns raised would be addressed fairly instead any feedback they don't want to hear is avoided and swept under the carpet.
Quote from: Jeff123 on 30-03-23, 09:45PMOptions is a complete joke, Tesco is a disgrace, the company clearly have an agenda to promote only people who improve diversity figures, senior managers are corrupt and fake, they treat colleagues differently and have favourites and bend the rules for the staff they like.
There is no one at any level who cares and you can't not trust that any concerns raised would be addressed fairly instead any feedback they don't want to hear is avoided and swept under the carpet.
Had a bad experience, have you? Jealousy gets you no where.
If the company is that bad, why work for them?
Quote from: Jeff123 on 30-03-23, 09:45PMOptions is a complete joke, Tesco is a disgrace, the company clearly have an agenda to promote only people who improve diversity figures, senior managers are corrupt and fake, they treat colleagues differently and have favourites and bend the rules for the staff they like.
There is no one at any level who cares and you can't not trust that any concerns raised would be addressed fairly instead any feedback they don't want to hear is avoided and swept under the carpet.
Someone didn't get signed off
Quote from: SpudChucker1970 on 30-03-23, 11:04PMQuote from: Jeff123 on 30-03-23, 09:45PMOptions is a complete joke, Tesco is a disgrace, the company clearly have an agenda to promote only people who improve diversity figures, senior managers are corrupt and fake, they treat colleagues differently and have favourites and bend the rules for the staff they like.
There is no one at any level who cares and you can't not trust that any concerns raised would be addressed fairly instead any feedback they don't want to hear is avoided and swept under the carpet.
Had a bad experience, have you? Jealousy gets you no where.
If the company is that bad, why work for them?
Had years of bad experiences, years of senior managers not following process correctly and making it up as they go along.
Golden handcuffs I've invested to many years to leave my current role losing my benefits is not something I can afford but it is disheartening witnessing years of poor behaviours and processes not followed correctly to the detriment of my career after years of loyalty.
If you raise a concern it is washed over and ignored and again failings in process, store managers unsupportive, colleague partners failing to respond or follow up on concerns, protectorline failing to investigate.
So due to other people treating me badly,
Your answer is why work for Tesco? The answer should be an honest transparent workplace where all processes are followed fairly and people are given equal opportunity's.
Where are you trying to get to on options? A lot of management roles are being made redundant so there simply may not be a position to promote you into. Obviously existing managers that passed the scoring will fill any vacancies first.
There will be options after structure change is fully implemented. The company will no longer be too heavy with managers. The new roles are however much bigger and should be more admin based. Shift leads should run the shop floor so there should be less filling, there will never be none. Just a hint though, as you go up the ranks you just end up with more and more people handing out tasks. You manage your team but you still have those above you. Sometimes you need to let go. As a team manager you are responsible but the store manager is accountable. You can have a difference of opinion but you need to pick your battles, and pick them well.
Stores differ, even within the same group. If it's not working out for you it's time to take the control back. Why not try moving stores within the group or close to home. I did this many years ago and it worked for me.
As for staying or leaving the company, it all depends on circumstances but it's not good to be in a toxic environment. Many find that options is not what they expected but butting heads with those above is not the most productive way to do things.
@Redshoes has nailed it completely. Once the dust is settled with the management moves etc, look at getting out of your current store. For many a year I was a 'General Assistant' ( as we were then called ), and I was that person who managers would go to to sort or do tasks others wouldn't.
I accepted it as I wanted to progress, but I would never progress, I was just a tool, a yes man, a dogsbody who was always hungry, but I was never fed. And it was all my own fault.
However, I had in a five year period, a great SM who saw potential and couldn't believe I hadn't progressed, a Team Leader position to Line Manager position to moving to a different store. It worked for me, and now I'm long in the tooth and moving on through redundancy.
I would definitely recommend moving store, I don't know the dynamic of your store, but I would say you're probably as I was many moons ago. Give yourself a fresh start elsewhere and I'm sure the effort you put in will be rewarded.
It's a fine balance between knowing your worth, being open to constructive criticism, gaining experience from that, doing your time and having the right amount of flexibility, you don't want to be completely flexible as to be a yes man, but you need to balance the interests of the business with your own development.
Nobody should be stuck in the same place for more than 2 years without progression and 5 years in general. As a person who's worn many hats and jumped many ships, the art of the deal is knowing your worth but not being too big for your own boots, if you're all style and no substance, talk the talk but don't walk the walk, that's a fast track way to ruin your own reputation and hold yourself back.
Moving stores, starting afresh is absolutely essential to moving up the pay scale. I've done this with great success, I strongly suspect if I didn't leave for a different company, I would still be a SL, maybe a TM, but gaining experience in other more senior roles elsewhere has resulted in my potential being recognized appropriately and being placed as head of a Delivery Group within the company with a salary that reflects that now being roughly 7x what I earned as a Shift Leader.
Dreamer
I'd honestly recommend trying shift leader role before making the jump to TM.
As mentioned the new TM role is much bigger than it was in the past. Before you could make the transition from GA to TM because you'd only be looking after an area with a small team. By doing SL first you'd get the experience of the day to day while taking some time to help TM with small admin tasks. I think we will see a lot more TM stepping down into SL roles in the coming months
Wouldn't be surprised if there's only £1k odd in it between SL and entry level TM.
Quote from: Davethebave on 01-04-23, 02:49PMI'd honestly recommend trying shift leader role before making the jump to TM.
As mentioned the new TM role is much bigger than it was in the past. Before you could make the transition from GA to TM because you'd only be looking after an area with a small team. By doing SL first you'd get the experience of the day to day while taking some time to help TM with small admin tasks. I think we will see a lot more TM stepping down into SL roles in the coming months
I also think there will be team managers leaving. The role is so big that those that are staying are going into it reluctantly. Colleagues will be hard on remaining managers, there is going to be a lot of "but Steven spent a lot of time filling" and mangers will be in the dreaded office more but the admin side of the role is huge and getting bigger. It's not for everyone.
I don't understand how the role is going to be so big now. I've read through the role pack and there isn't that much difference between what I do now and the new TM role. Other than more colleagues to look after what are the changes that are making everyone think it's a massive role that nobody will want to do?
It becomes bigger because reduced management headcount means more operational responsibilities.
So, for example in a store with two managers and 150 colleagues.
One manager will be responsible for literally all of the shopfloor, aswell as 75 colleagues.
The second manager all front end/ service operations, aswell as 75 colleagues.
Stock and admin is split between the two managers
The store gets 4 shiftleaders based on the headcount. If you get 4 bad shiftleaders you will still need to support the day to day running of the shop (stacks, pallets, etc) on top of any admin/ managerial tasks you have to complete. If the shop isn't good you'll still get challenged on it because the colleagues report to you.
On the days when it's all going wrong (sick calls, no OT, vacancies, etc)and your the only manager in the store with a shift leader and everything is needing sorted you aren't going to be sitting in an office, you'll still be getting dragged into the day to day.
@Davethebave is right, and that's why I'm glad I'm leaving. I inherited stock control a few years, as well as the majority of the shop I already had,and it was a nightmare. Whilst I was expected to do all my office work, the SM would be wandering the shop floor loading next steps. And no shift leader available? Guess who's doing it? Another issue is if there is a particular'flavour of the month' dept or KPI. You will have multiple areas of the store to manage, but your SM will want you to focus 100% of your time on that one area, to the detriment of all others, until the wheels fall off there and you are then tasked with also being 100% focused on that issue. And as we know 200% does not fit into 100%.
But that's the job now, spinning multiple plates whilst juggling three balls, and your SM Will throw in another three balls as well at any moment!
Further to the above after taking 364 days of s*** from the SM about how c**p you are after xmas they will declare to the management team how good they are blah blah blah
Been there, done it, bought the t-shirt, left it and haven't looked back. Not worth the money, not worth the hassle, not worth the BS. You think store colleagues feel like they never get listened to, wait until your a manager. If you aren't singing the store managers tune good luck in your career. Careers progression has now become extremely difficult in the business. Lead managers are all but gone, Store managers will be the next big change where they will combine the smaller stores into 1 store manager over 3. That has been talked about for a while now and I think once they get all this change over the line that's the next port of call. If you want to do it, go for it. But there is far better paths to take outside of Tesco management.