Pay Review 2022

[Nomad]

An update on what's going on over the pond.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/retail-and-services/tesco-in-ireland-and-unions-heading-for-the-labour-court-over-pay-rise-1.4848323

"Both Mandate and Siptu representatives attended the talks again on the 22nd February, 28th February and finally on the 9th March in effort to reach agreement. However, agreement could not be reached so in line with our procedural agreement with the company the claim was referred to the Labour Court," the notice to Mandate members stated.

The two sides appear to be several aisles apart. Tesco, it seems, has offered a 5 per cent rise, plus an offer to buy out certain premium payments that are made to staff.

[kaled78]

just spoken to a friend who is a pre 2005 employee,she was told yesterday by her manager once you sign the new contract the 2005 agreement no longer stands,so she said fine im not going to sign it,my son used to work for asda and they had a similar thing where some employees refused to sign a new contract with worse conditions,eventually they told them they would terminate their old contract if they did not sign the new ones

https://eachother.org.uk/asda-workers-threatened-with-sack/#:~:text=Thousands%20of%20Asda%20staff%20face,a%20%E2%80%9Csmokescreen%E2%80%9D%20by%20unions.

[chris9997]

just spoken to a friend who is a pre 2005 employee,she was told yesterday by her manager once you sign the new contract the 2005 agreement no longer stands,so she said fine im not going to sign it,my son used to work for asda and they had a similar thing where some employees refused to sign a new contract with worse conditions,eventually they told them they would terminate their old contract if they did not sign the new ones

https://eachother.org.uk/asda-workers-threatened-with-sack/#:~:text=Thousands%20of%20Asda%20staff%20face,a%20%E2%80%9Csmokescreen%E2%80%9D%20by%20unions.

If she looks at the release from usdaw re the pay deal it clearly states the 2005 agreement still stands.however only for checkouts not self serve or replenishment.

[penguin]

Most on here, should have to work a month in an express store. Then you have something to moan about. CAs in express have to clean ( yes toilets) checkouts, Tip delivery's, bakery trained, Do merchandise plans, Price integrity, Work stock. List goes on. Most express colleagues would find working in a larger store a breeze.

Yeah most of the time is just two or three people in the building to do all of the above, and then do not forget all the unforeseen stuff that you come across, like dealing with shoplifters, auditors, reps, a busy day as the suns out, footballs on, it was payday weekend etc group team who love to arrive and tell you how it was done in large format 15 years ago so no reason you cannot do it in a tiny little express, and that is on a good day.

[person7]

Most on here, should have to work a month in an express store. Then you have something to moan about. CAs in express have to clean ( yes toilets) checkouts, Tip delivery's, bakery trained, Do merchandise plans, Price integrity, Work stock. List goes on. Most express colleagues would find working in a larger store a breeze.

I work in a superstore and we have to clean everything except toilets. we have to clean checkouts, clean all the shelves, do plans, price integrity, work stock etc. etc. the only ones I dont have to do is cleaning toilet or bakery trained cause we have a contractor who comes in to get the frozen bread out, stick in oven then put on the shelf. - an express worker once came to my store for a couple months then moved back as "its about the same work but least the express is smaller and closer to me"

however i defo agree an extra store is more likely to be easier as they can seem to hire lot more employees. 80% my weekly shifts im on my own entirely in the entire department - which is hell when checkouts or firework stands need me then customer service as for me at same time. its like ... well its only me on today. someone is going to get mad waiting no matter what I do!

[Stevie-lad]

It's about time some people get a reality check. Tesco is a supermarket serving thousands of customers every week. Why would anybody think it's acceptable not to be trained to work on a checkout? Maybe it was OK in 2005 but things change over the years and businesses need to adapt. I wonder how many of these people moaning and crying about this are also claiming equal pay 

And I wonder how soon you'd be moaning and crying if you were put into a work off with a pre 2005 colleague.

They have knowledge of the company that you will never be trained to do, as your manager probably won't know what they know! At one time it was common practice to help a new colleague, buddy them, teach them the ropes...most became team leaders, but were then got rid of, so those who chose to stay,  understandably refused to train new colleagues as they were told surplus to requirements, as the business progressed and adapted...into sheer chaos!
Look what happened when they go rid of the stock control crews, some stores were on their knees, as they hadn't taken the time to train up the newer colleagues properly. They didn't know what the different functions of the PDA was for or how to read the information on them, how to do customer orders, or how to actually control the stock!!
Ditto the merchandising teams, PI etc...Tesco never learn by their past mistakes!

How many pre 2005 colleagues do you think are left in your store? I can guarantee your store manager would rather have them available on the shop floor, to assist the teams and the customers, mainly because of their knowledge and experience. Believe it or not, they were even trained on how to properly slit the boxes when filling shelves for speed and ease, spot the delivery to the floor in front of the shelves to save time... cardboard runs...it's second nature for them to pull off empty cardboard trays from the shelves as they're passing and pull the back forward! Regularly check the freezers for dumped fresh that can be saved, same with the shelves! Random date checking and rotation is also the norm!
They're also not looking at their 'phone every 2 minutes and will actually check for missing stock rather than just say "no" when asked by a customer if any more in stock, or " dunno" as to when next delivery due!

So why do you assume that I started after 2005? Is it because I think that the ruling regarding not going on a till is archaic 
I've actually got almost 40 years of service and I'm not far off retiring but if you want I'll gladly have a "work off" with anybody who thinks they are entitled not to go on a checkout 
Unless you have a medical condition or some other valid reason it is absolutely ridiculous that anyone can refuse to do a basic task for the company that employs them.

[Nomad]

Pre 2005 are entitled not to go on a till because that was an entitlement granted to them by the company, they can choose to ignore that entitlement if they so wish, but it is their choice.  Not yours or for you to moan about.

[penguin]

But you can understand some staff being upset at how the pre 2005 till agreement seems to be treated like one of the ten commandments when so many other entitlements and rights have been removed from staff over the years, I fail to see why this one causes so many arguments by both sides when so much else seems to have gone on with hardly a word being said from anyone affected.

[VladPutin]

I thought the pre-2005 deal no longer applied under the new pay deal? Don't even the Old Sweats have to go on checkouts now?

[lucgeo]

But you can understand some staff being upset at how the pre 2005 till agreement seems to be treated like one of the ten commandments when so many other entitlements and rights have been removed from staff over the years, I fail to see why this one causes so many arguments by both sides when so much else seems to have gone on with hardly a word being said from anyone affected.

It's because those pre 2005 colleagues that are left, see how the system is abused...once they're till trained they're pulled on the till at the drop of a hat!! They don't have to, so don't want to...they're not department manager's pawns, to be argued over. The lack of respect shown to colleagues by managers is at times a disgrace.
I once recall my manager and a team leader arguing , in front of me, how I should be covering my own dept rather than their all hands call!! Told them both they'd find me in the rest room when they'd finally finished disrespecting me!!

[lucgeo]

I thought the pre-2005 deal no longer applied under the new pay deal? Don't even the Old Sweats have to go on checkouts now?

Bet you don't go on checkouts Vlad 

[Teddybonkers]

@nightandday
It was New Labour that did that with overpopulation not the Tories, it was New Labour that allowed unlimited movement across the EU to Britain, and It's the Left wing parties that are always pushing for more immigration from other parts of the world not right wing parties!

Now back to the pay review

Absolutely correct Morris999 - well said.

[chris9997]

The 2005 deal was probably to counter a poor/non pay rise.
And for those upset by the pre 2005 agreement there will for a time be pre 2022 agreement re premiums not being paid for Sundays for new starters when these new starters start coming through there will be little overtime as they will give to the cheapest first.

[Rumblerumble]

Can someone confirm

R.E Core hours. Can these be moved to fit within availability windows, if giving the e week notice

[barafear]

There's a lot of discussion on here about the pre-2005 agreement - to clarify, I didn't join before 2005 - and also I do not work on the shop floor - in fact I work on checkouts. My disagreement about this new deal with the Union happily agreeing to our contracts being ripped up and replaced with paperweight new ones is partly on the principle of "what's the point of a contract of employment if this is allowed to happen?" - but moreover from my point of view, I don't actually want to work on the shop floor - or collecting trolleys (although this isn't specified in the new agreement, I'm sure it will be in the small print) -
Clearly, this is all down to personal preference - but can I ask why some "old-timers" don't want to work on the tills? Is it merely just a timing thing? Surely, if a shop floor worker gets moved to tills for an hour of their shift - does that mean that they have to still do their aisles in less time? - surely not? we're all hourly paid - so if I work on shop floor for 7 hours but get pulled onto the till for an hour - then I'm only working shop floor for 6 hours and what doesn't get done is done by the next shift?

Clearly, you can tell I'm very untrained on shop floor - so apologies if I've missed anything?

Clearly, there's much to discuss with these new contracts - and for some there will be minimal effect because those people are already happily multi skilled and happy to work hours in various depts in order to make money - but what happens now with till staff for example -

Does being "older" and "less fit" qualify for exemption (seemingly not if it requires medical evidence) - shop floor work seems to be more physically demanding - pulling out cages - sometimes very heavy -

Clearly with these new contracts, it's not just a case of "I don't want to work on the floor" - I'll happily sit in my nice comfy (!!!) chair on checkouts!!

Sorry - I'm rambling a bit - but would appreciate any feedback from others (most of whom on here appear to be shop floor workers).

[NightAndDay]

A big reason why many don't want to work on tills is because of societal classism, there is the ingrained psychology that exists in older generations (people that existed where there was a middle socioeconomic class) that people who work in Retail or the services industry in a non-managerial capacity were "uneducated" and beneath them, this psychology is very much alive and well today and manifests itself in some vile customer interactions.

Similarly, some managers hold the same psychology, many a moon ago, Retail Managers were considered skilled, educated positions that were well respected and compensated thusly, but overtime, the economy has changed, downwards pressures were applied on the bottom line workers in the name of corporate profits and greed, the name of the game was to keep the poor poorer, by stealing cost savings from them and distributing it across the top brass, and this extended to supervisors and as of recently Retail Managers. As such the job became less desirable and so Retail Managers are now appointed in a more "battlefield promotion"  fashion than before, a consequence of this is lower rigourous requirements than those who held the position 30 years ago.

It's a historic mindset of a bygone era, they are unaware that the middle class is almost dead and that the near future will be serfs and property owners. But it's also because of this that working on the tills is considered the most undesirable of jobs.

[rogerthedodger]

I'm suprised its even an issue anymore most stores have more self scan that's tills anyway not like they need many bodys on checkouts. The Main issue they will have is keeping and recruiting team supports why do it for £11+ when you can earn basically as much to drive a van. Strange

[NightAndDay]

There are a lot of idiots out there that insist on being served by humans, not wanting to embrace the age of automation, they see automation as a threat to jobs, quite frankly I can't wait for the days that cashless stores become the norm, working on tills isn't a job for people.

What needs to happen is the government needs to implement an automation tax to maintain revenues and to prevent wealth distribution becoming too uneven and to then use the money generated to start a UBI scheme.

[Trv20]

A big reason why many don't want to work on tills is because of societal classism, there is the ingrained psychology that exists in older generations (people that existed where there was a middle socioeconomic class) that people who work in Retail or the services industry in a non-managerial capacity were "uneducated" and beneath them, this psychology is very much alive and well today and manifests itself in some vile customer interactions.

Similarly, some managers hold the same psychology, many a moon ago, Retail Managers were considered skilled, educated positions that were well respected and compensated thusly, but overtime, the economy has changed, downwards pressures were applied on the bottom line workers in the name of corporate profits and greed, the name of the game was to keep the poor poorer, by stealing cost savings from them and distributing it across the top brass, and this extended to supervisors and as of recently Retail Managers. As such the job became less desirable and so Retail Managers are now appointed in a more "battlefield promotion"  fashion than before, a consequence of this is lower rigourous requirements than those who held the position 30 years ago.

It's a historic mindset of a bygone era, they are unaware that the middle class is almost dead and that the near future will be serfs and property owners. But it's also because of this that working on the tills is considered the most undesirable of jobs.

There's going to be a lot of unhappy people and morale is already low with the various cutbacks of recent years eg loss of hot food in canteens, closure of meat/fish counters, day staff having to do filling without night staff having filled due to job losessl Also for example can't see many people wanting to collect trolleys especially when it's teeming with customers and pelting it down with rain or freezing cold!

[Bread to]

There's a lot of discussion on here about the pre-2005 agreement - to clarify, I didn't join before 2005 - and also I do not work on the shop floor - in fact I work on checkouts. My disagreement about this new deal with the Union happily agreeing to our contracts being ripped up and replaced with paperweight new ones is partly on the principle of "what's the point of a contract of employment if this is allowed to happen?" - but moreover from my point of view, I don't actually want to work on the shop floor - or collecting trolleys (although this isn't specified in the new agreement, I'm sure it will be in the small print) -
Clearly, this is all down to personal preference - but can I ask why some "old-timers" don't want to work on the tills? Is it merely just a timing thing? Surely, if a shop floor worker gets moved to tills for an hour of their shift - does that mean that they have to still do their aisles in less time? - surely not? we're all hourly paid - so if I work on shop floor for 7 hours but get pulled onto the till for an hour - then I'm only working shop floor for 6 hours and what doesn't get done is done by the next shift?

Clearly, you can tell I'm very untrained on shop floor - so apologies if I've missed anything?

Clearly, there's much to discuss with these new contracts - and for some there will be minimal effect because those people are already happily multi skilled and happy to work hours in various depts in order to make money - but what happens now with till staff for example -

Does being "older" and "less fit" qualify for exemption (seemingly not if it requires medical evidence) - shop floor work seems to be more physically demanding - pulling out cages - sometimes very heavy -

Clearly with these new contracts, it's not just a case of "I don't want to work on the floor" - I'll happily sit in my nice comfy (!!!) chair on checkouts!!

Sorry - I'm rambling a bit - but would appreciate any feedback from others (most of whom on here appear to be shop floor workers).

Can only say from my point of view but no if I spend an hour on checkouts that doesn't get done by the next shift there flat out doing the normal which they normally don't finish. I work on bread and cakes and the main problem is the lack of realisation so I'm on a checkout (no problem) but the bread isn't filled it's empty for a few hours when it  gets put out the next day customers reject it as it's closer to going out of date so I've then got to reduce it then waste it if it doesn't sell. So to serve a couple of customers on checkouts and have 3* the work to do on my department over the next few days and obviously no assistance to do this.

[Redshoes]

The relief side of things is built into the shop floor role so if you don't go on a till you gain extra time. There is however no wriggle room, the hours for replenishment are very tight.

[Anglia88]

Can someone confirm

R.E Core hours. Can these be moved to fit within availability windows, if giving the e week notice

This is what I am thinking. I think the striking thing in this new contractual agreement that many people seem to be missing is this new wording in the brief that basically says something along the lines of all staff will have to fill out a new availability form and must have 1.5x availability.

Essentially Tesco are saying they will try to base you're hours around your core department but if that's not possible they will put them anywhere else around another department and anywhere in your availability window with two weeks notice. So your shifts could and likely will in theory change week to week to suit them.

Specifically the wording of all colleagues must have 1.5x availability from what I gather means that everybody is expected to offer up on their availability form their current core hours plus 50% availability above that.

To give a theoretical example, and to keep things simple, let's say Jenny works Monday to Friday 9-5 on checkouts. She is full time and her contracted hours are 36.5 per week. So going forward under this new contract, Jenny will be required to fill out her new availability which will need to include her core Monday to Friday 9-5 shifts, plus another 50% availability on top of that (so another 18 'ish hours as that is 50% of her 36.5 hour contracted hours). So Jenny would need to put on her availability that she is willing to work maybe say until 9pm instead of 5pm. Under the new contractual agreement Tesco can then schedule Jenny to work within any hours on her new availability window with two weeks notice.   

So essentially how I see this new agreement is that this is Tesco basically forcing everybody onto a flexi style contract. I don't agree with it but I guess given the current cost of living crisis they probably consider this as good a time as ever to do this as fewer staff may jump ship right now as they figure most people need all the money they can get right now.

[Hibobhi]

They said in the statement "they would like you to increase your availability, but you don't have to"

[King1999]

Union confirmed no you don't have to .

[Totot]

This is one of main problem in tesco. They too focus on financial report to please the stockholder while got no skill, strategy and ability to compete in retail business, so cutting cost is the easiest way.
Normally in this kind of management, they will cut the cost to the level of it to just enough to run operational in very basic level.

They can't see the elephant in the room such as the system are hungry of resources, without any decent target of effectiveness business wise. Examples like changing plan really often, changing goods without proper  study, too rigid on top bottom business strategy, promo price (still call promoting for a product that so popular 100 years old ) and all this strategy from economy book in the 80's.

Switching job in between will make it longer to finished, even it seems like the priority job done well, but the rest will lag behind and will accumulate and create more problem. That mean more resources needed to do the same thing.

But again it is not the top manager concern, as long as their bonus target achieved, meanwhile the mid manager just do whatever to make it looks like they done the job, make some adjustment strategy to justified their salary and bonus, and the lower managers are too stress from the pressure from every corner.