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New Union

Started by tempworker2020, 05-07-20, 04:12AM

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person7

#50
Quote from: NightAndDay on 28-03-22, 03:57PM
If someone needs sacking, they get sacked, bar 1 case I have not seen the union successfully defend anyone from being sacked, the exception was when the target used the race card (She was black the out of store SM was Indian) and it worked, the union said the people partner was woefully incompetent, it got to the point that not only did the final written warning get overturned, but the union supported her in building a case for racial discrimination against Tesco, my opinion on the case was that she needed to be disciplined for conduct, not sacked, but at the same time the SM in question (not the Indian one but her normal SM) had posters of A Dictator in the office, was openly racist and ableist. Last I heard she went on long term sick but played the game to get as much company sick pay as possible (she also got caught working another job but they couldn't prove it.) And the SM, even though he was found to be racist, got moved to another store (as seems to be the case with a lot of managerial misconduct).

Every other time though the union has been ineffective, even bending the knee for some puff chested SMs.

must depend on the store as there's a few lazy workers at my store, managers admitted they're trying to get rid of them (because they keep messing up and making rest us do more work fixing their mistakes) - but as they have not done anything "wrong" they can't sack him due to the union blocking it saying it will be "unfair dismissal" and "consider some training as alternative" (this person has been working there over 15 years -- and they still can't find a reason to try sack them as "laziness" is not a valid reason lol

Redshoes

Being a bit slower is not always being lazy. Cutting corners can make one colleague appear to be working faster than another so this also muddies the water. Then there is general health issues, this can be resolved by matching colleague to right role and it's not always easy and may require more than one move.
Saying all that we all know the colleagues that are not as fast as some others. It's a long process to deal with them. Nobody seems to like a manager actually doing a managers role. If they are not shoulder to shoulder filling they are lazy and drinking coffee in the office. This is an example of one process that only a manager can do and it takes time. It's also not that easy. Just now there is a fear of tribunal with dismissals and there is also a fear of not being able to replace anyone who goes.

person7

its not that they are slower, heck i have my slow days at times!

more the fact they do 5 minutes of work then just wonder around the warehouse for 3 hours pointing out to others "oh that will need doing soon" and "oh that cage needs to go out" before doing another 5 minutes of work then going home. i think they stocked 4 towels, 1 vacuum and 5 promo cups and few kettles in their 4 hour shift. - not tagging any of them so then the rest of us get told often "please ensure everything is tagged as we had a visitor from headoffice to find they arent tagged" - so quarter of our shift is checking the tags

in fact Thursday i had to spend 2 hours checking all the tags and tidy up and check for gaps (its a very large store and i thought i was on my own as didnt see anyone until i went to get the gaps/stock out the backstock --and they were in the backstock checking if we had any engine oil as it was a gap they noticed.. about an hour later, i went back in with the left over off the backstock cage.. and he was still there then said "oh well, couldnt find it, what ya gonna do? (shrugging shoulders while texting someone).. well lots still left to do but im off now"

everyone, including all managers cant stand them, except the union rep as they know each other. -  ???

lucgeo

You should bring it to the managers attention.

You will always get those that try it on...one stockie used to start /finish 2 hours earlier than me and would pass on his instores /discontinued list that he didn't "have time to find?" (He finished before rumble, but I had a 30 min break to take and an hour rumble in the remaining 2 hours!) Then when he was queried next day as to why they weren't completed he'd say he gave them to me to finish!!

I eventually refused to take over his list, and insisted to the manager, we take ownership of our own depts  for gapping, instores and discontinued as we both had the same allocated time to complete them!

People can be managed out of the business, but it is a long process, they have to be given every opportunity to improve, be given retraining, and update meetings in agreed time frames. If there is little or no improvement, then Conduct V's Capability comes into play, in as much to determine if they are just unwilling or just unable to perform the role, to the best of their abilities!
Live for today. Learn from yesterday.

NightAndDay

If process is followed then yes, but there are managers rated as "effective" that will chiller chat colleagues out of the business, one SM was notorious for it, union reps didn't want to try and take on this manager in question as the last few that did were all sacked for gross misconduct after somehow being found with goods not paid for when leaving the store.

Redshoes

Quote from: person7 on 26-04-22, 11:17AM
its not that they are slower, heck i have my slow days at times!

more the fact they do 5 minutes of work then just wonder around the warehouse for 3 hours pointing out to others "oh that will need doing soon" and "oh that cage needs to go out" before doing another 5 minutes of work then going home. i think they stocked 4 towels, 1 vacuum and 5 promo cups and few kettles in their 4 hour shift. - not tagging any of them so then the rest of us get told often "please ensure everything is tagged as we had a visitor from headoffice to find they arent tagged" - so quarter of our shift is checking the tags

in fact Thursday i had to spend 2 hours checking all the tags and tidy up and check for gaps (its a very large store and i thought i was on my own as didnt see anyone until i went to get the gaps/stock out the backstock --and they were in the backstock checking if we had any engine oil as it was a gap they noticed.. about an hour later, i went back in with the left over off the backstock cage.. and he was still there then said "oh well, couldnt find it, what ya gonna do? (shrugging shoulders while texting someone).. well lots still left to do but im off now"

everyone, including all managers cant stand them, except the union rep as they know each other. -  ???

Sounds like the old "very good at looking busy" trick. We all know some of them. They also seem to be the worst at complaining at what others do. I would have a word with your manager. Times are really hard now and we can't afford to carry anyone. People like that just build resentment, they can demoralise a whole team.

person7

yeh, especially as im looking for more hours, i could easily replace their shift and get double the work done! -

but its annoying everyone, i do agree it builds resentment and demoralize the team as everyone has stopped caring about keeping backstock organized and tidy over past few months -

to point if a customer wants something they know to be in backstock as someone from another store told them we have them, everyone now looks for 30 seconds but if they cant find it they just say the stock level must be wrong or its on the way in a delivery (me and maybe 1-2 others are the only ones who really try find it as fast as possible and even then we sometimes give up... then find it hours later)

in fact I did find "new line" products for christmas promotion i just discovered the other day at the back of the warehouse behind load of unused equipment. now all zeroed of course...and the one im on about was the one who was supposedly sorted that out. - i informed my manager i found it all and sent a picture of it on whatsapp asking what to do with it as it was promo around Christmas time.

so lets see what happens as the "lazy" worker is the one who usually sorts them out (the displays that's not on the fixed shelves etc)

NightAndDay

Retail is a breeding ground for these types of employees, more often than not they get promoted to management. The practice won't change and is a factor behind Tescos worsening pay, benefirs and working environment.

Cinderella

I'm still having a nightmare getting any response whatsoever from the union. I was under the impression that you could contact them with questions, get information on laws and policies to help you decide how to proceed with an issue.

My experiences with USDAW since trying to get help from November last year are that reps "don't know" answers, the area manager doesn't talk to individuals, and the office don't reply to emails. I'm seriously questioning what I am paying them for?

I'm about to get into a dispute over inflated absence levels, and I can't get hold of anyone with any knowledge to talk it through with.

mr tom

USDAW appear to be a union in name only...your union fees go to keeping the salaried officials in a pretty safe job, with most probably a decent final salary pension whilst they constantly sell out the membership to Tesco.

lucgeo

Tesco helpline number should be displayed on the staff/union notice board.

Another alternative would be to 'phone ACAS
Live for today. Learn from yesterday.

Sherwoodforest

Logging onto our tesco,you can search policies yourself,yes your usdaw reps should be able to help you,so should your area usdaw,

Sherwoodforest

If its a policy query your after,why not ask on here,

Cinderella

#63
Sometimes policies aren't clear enough. For instance, I am off with covid, and the policy on that has now changed, but doesn't say what the application is to someone already off with covid when it kicks in.

I have found my absence levels being inflated, where I have asked for reduced hours (which doesn't impact absence) every time I get a payslip it has been coded as sick. (This is not related to the covid comment). I want to know about the policies relating to that, and the best way to raise a query without jumping straight to grievance (which is what the in store reps keep insisting I do)

Cinderella

As I'm getting no support at all from USDAW (and tempted to try to get back every fee I've paid, as I've got no service from them whatsoever!) I am wondering if anyone has had any experience at all of using a different union? Can a company actually refuse to recognise them?

NightAndDay

You can be a member and use a rep from any union to represent you but Tesco won't recognize them. USDAW is hamstrung by Tesco and the partnership agreement which is why they're ineffective, you're best placed to arm yourself with legal knowledge and Tescos policies rather than depending on them.

Not a lot here would have anything good to say about USDAW as a union for shopfloor workers at Tesco unfortunately. For delivery drivers, they actually seem functional.

horatiocain

#66
You can use a rep from any union, and they are treated exactly the same as an USDAW rep.
Don't try explaining the right to represented to a Tesco manager, you'll run out of crayons trying.
One of our guys is a GMB member and the official was refused entry to the meeting, they sacked the guy and at his appeal the people manager (that's how long ago it was, remember them) reinstated him with an apology to avoid being sued.

Any authorised trade union rep or official or a colleague can represent an employee, there is no difference between them.

I know an ex rep who reps people still and they buy him a Christmas present each year as a thank you, and he was a fantastic rep.

There are good USDAW reps, the problem is Tesco managers are largely idiots, and they target good reps and keep bad ones.

Complain about bad reps, it's the only way the officials can do something.

Cinderella

I finally got someone at the union to speak to me yesterday - after calling and stressing the urgency of my situation that has been allowed to escalate.

The strange thing is - the person I am told is now my "personal advisor" at the union is the person I contacted back in November who said he doesn't deal with individuals!

RichardHands

It would be interesting to know how many people are members of another union as well as USDAW.  I've been a member of GMB for several years, as well as being a rep for USDAW.   If there were sufficient membership of an alternative union, then the company would have to recognise it, and the likes of GMB would not cozy up to Tesco as USDAW have!

FarmerFred

Any second union is unlikely to meet the requirements for statutory recognition by the Central Arbitration Committee.

penguin

#70
As far as I know companies do not have to recognise any union no matter how many of their staff might be a member, please enlighten me if wrong but that is my understanding.
Do not let anyone tell you there is not a decent job and life beyond Tesco.

FarmerFred

If there is no union in place and certain requirements are met then it is possible for the company to be forced to recognise a union https://www.gov.uk/trade-union-recognition-employers


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