Often on here there are stores v distribution questions. Ask away now we don't have long left and I'll do my best to answer your questions on the differing points of view/processes from a distribution side of things
Why do distribution get away with not sending stock to stores who cant claim for it when its missing but when stock takes comes the store managers get shafted for it every time?
not really looking for an answer 10 years in the job I've never had an answer that didnt involve "its in the business somewhere" so doesnt matter.
Few years back after modern stocktake my store was 15k down store manager was roasted as were dept managers I can remember after count sheets came in I was asked to look for about 1k missing non food which was not there .. another store in area was 45-50k down after modern stocktake ... funny thing was local depot after a little while was up a huge amount of money
Does a problem ever make it to you guys if its reported through Mpro5? Bad Stacking, Repair Labels on knackered cages still marked from other stores but still filled? etc? Cause that really feels like it goes absolutely NOwhere. lol
Believe the theory is that stock coming into Tesco is checked off. Once its signed into a distribution centre the stock will end up within a Tesco somewhere....
There is no profit yet a huge cost in allowing store A to claim for missing deliveries and Tesco having to hunt down whether its in store B, C, D or E.
Quote from: madness on 21-03-24, 12:55AMWhy do distribution get away with not sending stock to stores who cant claim for it when its missing but when stock takes comes the store managers get shafted for it every time?
not really looking for an answer 10 years in the job I've never had an answer that didnt involve "its in the business somewhere" so doesnt matter.
Are your backdoor colleague checking each UOD (Cage, Pallets, MU's etc...) as they are coming off the trailer via the drivers tablet? If you do that and you see you have a UOD missing you can reject it on the drivers tablet and it will flag up during the drivers de-brief.
Quote from: oldfashionedplayer on 21-03-24, 06:56AMDoes a problem ever make it to you guys if its reported through Mpro5? Bad Stacking, Repair Labels on knackered cages still marked from other stores but still filled? etc? Cause that really feels like it goes absolutely NOwhere. lol
Yes it does, never seen so many investigations, lets talk etc... being done as I have during my time at the DC. All the driver feedback is also logged via MyDC which requires a manager to review and sign off.
Just remember on the Repair/Fault stickers, all stores are required to nest together broken cages and send them back as a group, not mix them into the perfectly serviceable cage nest. This is how so many end up back into the supply chain. DC's do remove a lot of broken cages and send them to RSU for scrap or repair. Prob well over a million cages in the network the ratio of broken vs useable ones is actually very low.
I know personally I've nested them together and I get them sent back in full of stock the next day.. thats where my curiosity comes from.. cause I put one on the top, and one on the side of each cage I send back with the reason, store number and date. lol
In Distribution the priority of management is how fast the stock is picked. Everything else comes secondary. I see how this makes things bad for stores but I doubt it'll ever change. The only other thing that comes remotely close is making sure the deliveries are ready to leave on time
Quote from: madness on 21-03-24, 12:55AMWhy do distribution get away with not sending stock to stores who cant claim for it when its missing but when stock takes comes the store managers get shafted for it every time?
not really looking for an answer 10 years in the job I've never had an answer that didnt involve "its in the business somewhere" so doesnt matter.
Depends on what you're missing to whether it'll get investigated. 20 cases of beans probably not, 20 cases of vodka maybe. I dont know how big your store is but if you get 100 cages of stock per day, my dc probably picks 15k cages per day. It might be a lot of stock to you but it's nothing to the DC. And if a cage label falls off it's like looking for a needle in a haystack
Quote from: oldfashionedplayer on 21-03-24, 06:56AMDoes a problem ever make it to you guys if its reported through Mpro5? Bad Stacking, Repair Labels on knackered cages still marked from other stores but still filled? etc? Cause that really feels like it goes absolutely NOwhere. lol
I dont know what Mpro5 is but people do get pulled up for badly loaded trailers. A lot of cages get restacked before loading too for the reasons you mentioned. But remember they are loaded by big machines so manually moving them is kept to a minimum. Different for you guys if your pulling them off by hand
Quote from: oldfashionedplayer on 21-03-24, 10:13AMI know personally I've nested them together and I get them sent back in full of stock the next day.. thats where my curiosity comes from.. cause I put one on the top, and one on the side of each cage I send back with the reason, store number and date. lol
People who take the cages off the trailer are supposed to split the damaged ones away from the 'good' ones to be taken to be repaired/scrapped. However if they get mixed in with the 'good' cages, because the pickers are in a rush they might get used
When the DC has an audit it is often millions and millions of pounds up in stock, mainly because pickers scan it, confirm they picked it, then 'drive by' it. Only a problem for the picker if they are caught. Those 5l bottles of water are a good example, as they are an absolute nightmare to stack securely in a cage
Mpro5 is the app to record temp checks, store checks, problems with depo cages etc... We use master movers think that's the name? Similar to the depot but just not a ride in one, still able to take 3 cages at time etc.
I just think that there's zero care at a depot as like mentioned "they might get used" - so no ones using their brain and seeing the big yellow labels saying repair required plastered all over cages / stacks of cages.
Just like stacking items, 1 item store has listed as offsale wanting it to put out and then 3/4 of the cage is bulk items?? Both fresh and grocery...
Makes no sense how it happens so easily. And if that is "restacked beforehand" then God knows how bad it was before.. :D
If you walked around a DC you'd be amazed you got anything, never mind what the store ordered
Quote from: oldfashionedplayer on 21-03-24, 01:43PMMpro5 is the app to record temp checks, store checks, problems with depo cages etc... We use master movers think that's the name? Similar to the depot but just not a ride in one, still able to take 3 cages at time etc.
I just think that there's zero care at a depot as like mentioned "they might get used" - so no ones using their brain and seeing the big yellow labels saying repair required plastered all over cages / stacks of cages.
Just like stacking items, 1 item store has listed as offsale wanting it to put out and then 3/4 of the cage is bulk items?? Both fresh and grocery...
Makes no sense how it happens so easily. And if that is "restacked beforehand" then God knows how bad it was before.. :D
As I said, speed is all that matters to the higher ups. There's a well known picker who's stacking is horrendous, however it's laughed off by management cos targets are hit. I don't know what your 'offsale' point is from our side
I'm just saying with the offsale point being annoying, cause it's an item that's needed and usually the only thing on the cage needed but everything else is bulk ontop - referencing the horrendous stacking.
I think i get what you mean. But another example of why that might happen is; 'here you are oldfashionedplayer, here's your standard 13m trailer that holds 45 cages for you to load. There's 60 cages to fit on though, so get it all on by hell or highwater'. So you see how things get piled on top of other things
Quote from: grim up north on 21-03-24, 12:51PMQuote from: madness on 21-03-24, 12:55AMWhy do distribution get away with not sending stock to stores who cant claim for it when its missing but when stock takes comes the store managers get shafted for it every time?
not really looking for an answer 10 years in the job I've never had an answer that didnt involve "its in the business somewhere" so doesnt matter.
Depends on what you're missing to whether it'll get investigated. 20 cases of beans probably not, 20 cases of vodka maybe. I dont know how big your store is but if you get 100 cages of stock per day, my dc probably picks 15k cages per day. It might be a lot of stock to you but it's nothing to the DC. And if a cage label falls off it's like looking for a needle in a haystack
great i'll use that answer in the 6 monthly reprimand we get from the sm about shrink. and also at my review.
doesnt matter the scale of it if someones job is on the line for something not their fault.
also re checking off every cage, even if every cage comes in picker at the deopt just has to click yeah i picked 20x of that even though they scanned and picked 1. 19 lost cases but no lost cage.
not a go at you just the system is flawed.
edited to add..
Are you a depot worker or pretty high up in the depot wanting some on the ground feedback and issues that usually get missed/lost in the lines of communication within Tesco?
Quote from: grim up north on 21-03-24, 03:53PMI think i get what you mean. But another example of why that might happen is; 'here you are oldfashionedplayer, here's your standard 13m trailer that holds 45 cages for you to load. There's 60 cages to fit on though, so get it all on by hell or highwater'. So you see how things get piled on top of other things
which it shouldn't... especially cause we then get a trailer an hour later with 1-3 cages on it... saving space and the planet.. yeah... sure... travelling 2-4 hours with 1 cage is ridiculous.
we get complained at for how long it takes us to have to fix the trailers that are sent in, everything wedged in, knackered, loose stock on top, trying to check it off.. miss something and it gets picked up by next shift that then passes the blame..
what could be an on and off, easy working, becomes a nightmare day in day out.
Sounds like OP works in a packaged site. I work in fresh as a manager, so I can jump in and answer questions too.
In terms of shrink, there was an agreement reached a number of years ago that the amount of time spent investigating missing stock wasn't financially viable when realistically the stock really is in the business somewhere. That's a c**p answer for managers and colleagues in store getting hammered for shrink, but it's the reality of things. The store service policy says that DCs will investigate to try and solve the root cause of missing stock, but only tobacco will be repicked.
In reality, half the time we don't even know for sure that we have the right amount of stock from suppliers because we don't count every pallet in (in Fresh, we do in packaged sites) so there's a chance it never even arrived in the first place.
Damaged cages I have to agree are a major problem, but there's as much to do from stores returning them correctly and drivers unloading them correctly as there is for pickers to identify them. I'm not making excuses for warehouse workers because they should spot them, but unless it's a missing door or wheel it's pretty hard.
mPro5 reports do come through to depots, but being frank they are hardly answered. Most managers don't know how to access it because the training and engagement was terrible. ATC feedback rarely gets beyond the DCM, so chances are the people who can really make changes just aren't aware of all the problems.
its the missing wheels that tend to make it back to store the quickest though :D
Quote from: madness on 21-03-24, 08:11PMQuote from: grim up north on 21-03-24, 12:51PMQuote from: madness on 21-03-24, 12:55AMWhy do distribution get away with not sending stock to stores who cant claim for it when its missing but when stock takes comes the store managers get shafted for it every time?
not really looking for an answer 10 years in the job I've never had an answer that didnt involve "its in the business somewhere" so doesnt matter.
Depends on what you're missing to whether it'll get investigated. 20 cases of beans probably not, 20 cases of vodka maybe. I dont know how big your store is but if you get 100 cages of stock per day, my dc probably picks 15k cages per day. It might be a lot of stock to you but it's nothing to the DC. And if a cage label falls off it's like looking for a needle in a haystack
great i'll use that answer in the 6 monthly reprimand we get from the sm about shrink. and also at my review.
doesnt matter the scale of it if someones job is on the line for something not their fault.
also re checking off every cage, even if every cage comes in picker at the deopt just has to click yeah i picked 20x of that even though they scanned and picked 1. 19 lost cases but no lost cage.
not a go at you just the system is flawed.
edited to add..
Are you a depot worker or pretty high up in the depot wanting some on the ground feedback and issues that usually get missed/lost in the lines of communication within Tesco?
I'm just a normal worker in the DC. To add to your other point, once the picker has finished their pick, they randomly get an accuracy check where the cages are checked so see if everything is correct. If they should have put 68 boxes in and they put 67 or 69 they'll get a slap on the wrist. If they have none or 1 and should have 20 they'll get the sack
Quote from: oldfashionedplayer on 22-03-24, 12:07AMQuote from: grim up north on 21-03-24, 03:53PMI think i get what you mean. But another example of why that might happen is; 'here you are oldfashionedplayer, here's your standard 13m trailer that holds 45 cages for you to load. There's 60 cages to fit on though, so get it all on by hell or highwater'. So you see how things get piled on top of other things
which it shouldn't... especially cause we then get a trailer an hour later with 1-3 cages on it... saving space and the planet.. yeah... sure... travelling 2-4 hours with 1 cage is ridiculous.
we get complained at for how long it takes us to have to fix the trailers that are sent in, everything wedged in, knackered, loose stock on top, trying to check it off.. miss something and it gets picked up by next shift that then passes the blame..
what could be an on and off, easy working, becomes a nightmare day in day out.
That'll be because someone has spent 3 hours trying to squeeze 60 cages on to a 45 capacity trailer and couldn't do it. So they'll put another run to your store, which they should've done to start with but someone thought they'd spend a pound to save a penny. I agree, things should run like clockwork, but because pressure is put on by 'higher ups' who all have different priorities, everything becomes a s*** show
Quote from: oldfashionedplayer on 22-03-24, 08:43AMits the missing wheels that tend to make it back to store the quickest though :D
DC work many hours in front so if the person loading the trailer spots the cage with the wheel missing, chances are the person who picked it has gone home. So if the loader reports it, guess who restacks it? It takes a second to check a cage before you use it but sadly some people just dont care
i've always said that the reason for the bad stacking of cages and hence loads of damages is the fault of managers and higher ups rewarding pickers for speed instead of accuracy
in my opinion a lot of the pickers lack brain cells. eg stacking wine and canned beer on its side at the bottom of a heavy cage. an avalanche waiting to happen but higher ups obviously don't give a s**t as long as targets are met >:(
any training given to loaders on how to tighten the straps properly??? some of our deliveries are wedged against the door when it arrives and sent back as the driver can't get the door open?
Quote from: lackofinterest on 22-03-24, 04:22PMi've always said that the reason for the bad stacking of cages and hence loads of damages is the fault of managers and higher ups rewarding pickers for speed instead of accuracy
No reward, just constantly pressured(eventually sacked) to hit the target
Quote from: lackofinterest on 22-03-24, 04:30PMin my opinion a lot of the pickers lack brain cells. eg stacking wine and canned beer on its side at the bottom of a heavy cage. an avalanche waiting to happen but higher ups obviously don't give a s**t as long as targets are met >:(
As said many are restacked. I understand that some will make it to stores
Quote from: lackofinterest on 22-03-24, 04:37PMany training given to loaders on how to tighten the straps properly??? some of our deliveries are wedged against the door when it arrives and sent back as the driver can't get the door open?
The straps are supposed to be tightened until taught, not overtightened. Also if there's rapid acceleration or hard braking, a 20t load will shift in the trailer no matter how tight the straps were. Also see my previous point about cramming more cages in than the trailer capacity. If the load is sent back to DC because you cant get the door open, do you think we have a yard full of trailers sat full of stock? Or they are opened with a bit of effort?
The straps are supposed to be tightened until taught, not overtightened. Also if there's rapid acceleration or hard braking, a 20t load will shift in the trailer no matter how tight the straps were. Also see my previous point about cramming more cages in than the trailer capacity. If the load is sent back to DC because you cant get the door open, do you think we have a yard full of trailers sat full of stock? Or they are opened with a bit of effort?
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Us drivers would never drive quickly or harshly ;) We are the safest drivers on the road lol
In all seriousness thou, if the trailer cannot be open due to stock which is rare, normally its actually a fault with the door. Transport would normally organise your maintenance provider to go to the store to force it open. Anytime I have had an issue with a door, lack of equipment sympathy was all that was needed to get it to open.
Next thou raise it and ask "Why were the last 3 cages loaded not shrink wrapped that sit against the door to avoid stock falling." You will also start to see new Ambient Mesh guards coming online soon which is a big sheet that is clipped over the last row of cages and ratchet strapped tightened to stop stock from falling. The Shrink wrapping only applied to Packaged DC's as fresh is all 4 side cages.
Quote from: lackofinterest on 22-03-24, 04:37PMany training given to loaders on how to tighten the straps properly??? some of our deliveries are wedged against the door when it arrives and sent back as the driver can't get the door open?
Yes, better training than in most store roles to be fair. If people choose not to follow it, there's a driver feedback process which actually does get used in my site so we pick up coaching/conduct conversations with loaders.
If no one feeds it back though, no one at the DC knows about it.
What's the buzz of the equal pay case going around in dc?
I know the job I do, I should get paid more than alot of my colleagues on the shop floor(nights). There's things I can achieve physically demanding that I'd say 90% couldn't.
I'd imagine the argument for this case being why does a checkout worker deserve the pay the same as someone in dc, or even nights.
Little too late, but tesco should of introduced skill and workload base pay years ago.
My opinion this day in age, tesco and other retailers will lose this battle.
Quote from: Nightproduceworker on 24-03-24, 10:01AMWhat's the buzz of the equal pay case going around in dc?
I know the job I do, I should get paid more than alot of my colleagues on the shop floor(nights). There's things I can achieve physically demanding that I'd say 90% couldn't.
I'd imagine the argument for this case being why does a checkout worker deserve the pay the same as someone in dc, or even nights.
Little too late, but tesco should of introduced skill and workload base pay years ago.
My opinion this day in age, Tesco and other retailers will lose this battle.
If you look at the way Tesco has set up its distribution system, it is treated as a different company to Tesco Stores, That's why it is known as Tesco Distribution Ltd. It has its own accounts and tax returns. The DC operate on different T&C;s to stores as well. The same way Distribution workers are not affected by the Sunday Opt Clause under the law as it does not apply to them.
Personally I think Tesco will win there case on this one as the 2 are so far different its impossible to say "Yes, Checkout operator A is warranted the same rate as Warehouse picker working in +1 fridges all day" If they want to go down this road and want equal pay for all across all areas off the business, get your coat on and go start picking in that frozen chamber for 20mins at time.
Have you ever worked the shopfloor in a supermarket?
The cages you load have to be manually unloaded in a cold open air warehouse wearing thin customer facing uniforms ...same products different pay grade.
The only time coats are allowed is to work the freezers, rotating or finding shrink in some manky freezer coat, worn by all that stink to high heaven! These tasks can take well in excess of any 20 minute agreed time limit and you'd be laughed at if you requested your right to the time limit or a hot drink if exceeded! Same for requests that the freezer coats be laundered regularly as per the agreement!
Stores are now operated on a system where any colleague can work any department if able...so old Doris from checkouts, if declared physically fit, would be required to go unload that same cage you loaded, or take that freezer cage into the freezers and split it!
Agree that the contracts are different, but they were agreed in the last century...probably at the same time big businesses and factories paid men more than women to do the same job!
No wonder WASPI women are fighting their corner, they've dealt with all this sort of unjust treatment, during their working lives. :-X
Quote from: lucgeo on 24-03-24, 01:32PMHave you ever worked the shopfloor in a supermarket?
The cages you load have to be manually unloaded in a cold open air warehouse wearing thin customer facing uniforms ...same products different pay grade.
The only time coats are allowed is to work the freezers, rotating or finding shrink in some manky freezer coat, worn by all that stink to high heaven! These tasks can take well in excess of any 20 minute agreed time limit and you'd be laughed at if you requested your right to the time limit or a hot drink if exceeded! Same for requests that the freezer coats be laundered regularly as per the agreement!
Stores are now operated on a system where any colleague can work any department if able...so old Doris from checkouts, if declared physically fit, would be required to go unload that same cage you loaded, or take that freezer cage into the freezers and split it!
Agree that the contracts are different, but they were agreed in the last century...probably at the same time big businesses and factories paid men more than women to do the same job!
No wonder WASPI women are fighting their corner, they've dealt with all this sort of unjust treatment, during their working lives. :-X
Well for a start, your last statement indicates that Tesco is paying women different to men in an hourly rate role, which is completely false, so that argument is out the window. Everyone is paid the same in store & depot. You are paid a rate relevant to your job role. And yes, I have worked in the stores, 15 years in the stores.
And from what I have witnessed there is a big difference between working in DC vs working in a store and the DC is much tougher environment to be as it is all performance based. Don't hit your performance figures, see you later.
As for the contracts, they have all changed and now anyone who is not on the 2022 contract with exception to drivers is being paid a severance pay and leaving the company. If you don't take the severance pay they are still gonna move you onto the new 2022 contract.
The last paragraph doesn't state anything of the sort! It's relative to the previous paragraph on unjust pay discrimination in the work sector during the early years of the WASPI women's employment. I'm not in the habit of making false statements!
The current case going through the courts is due to the prior pay differentials between DC's and stores in Tesco and Asda.
Indeed you make the comparison yourself on equal pay in that a checkout operator should not be paid the same rate as a picker, and I have made the point that each store colleague are now required to work any department including unloading cages and working in the freezers!
So if you worked in a store and then moved to a DC, was the higher hourly rate a factor?
I was hoping this thread wouldn't turn in to this. I started it to give you store workers a chance to ask us DC staff why things aren't sometimes the level you'd expect. I'd say practically every staff member of tesco has been in a shop, but relatively few have been in a distribution centre
Quote from: lucgeo on 24-03-24, 04:40PMSo if you worked in a store and then moved to a DC, was the higher hourly rate a factor?
None your dam business whether the pay was a factor on my choice to move from stores but if you must know, I moved because I got myself an HGV licence plain and simple and didn't want to deal with the public face to face anymore.
Quote from: ImBackBaby on 24-03-24, 06:36PMQuote from: lucgeo on 24-03-24, 04:40PMSo if you worked in a store and then moved to a DC, was the higher hourly rate a factor?
None your dam business whether the pay was a factor on my choice to move from stores but if you must know, I moved because I got myself an HGV licence plain and simple and didn't want to deal with the public face to face anymore.
wow you're nice 8-)
wow you're nice 8-)
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I know, I realised I was a bit harsh in that response, apologises to the previous person.
Quote from: ImBackBaby on 23-03-24, 09:17AM... The Shrink wrapping only applied to Packaged DC's as fresh is all 4 side cages.
If only it was... plenty of fresh goes out on 2 siders & there's been many a time where even trays have been picked up off the floor of a trailer.
As to tightening the straps... if the load shifts under acceleration then it's not been secured full stop - especially in a lame dog Tesco wagon, even a harsh deceleration should not cause appreciable movement. There's many issues with the strapping, but the biggest three are that defective and poor condition straps rarely get replaced, overwinding & foldovers blocking the reel up - rather than releasing an rewinding the loader just moves on. The final one is not hooking on far enough back - the point of the straps is to pull the load back into the previous row, if the ends of the strap aren't at least half a cage back when tightened then the forces are primarily pulling the sides of the trailer inwards rather pulling the cages towards the headboard. There are other issues such row levelling, propper use of the compartment bulkheads, only having three dollies per row on DTMD upper decks.... the list goes on. The problem is that by the time the loaders are getting the hang of the job they are fed up and on their way out of the door.
Quote from: Nightproduceworker on 24-03-24, 10:01AMWhat's the buzz of the equal pay case going around in dc?
I know the job I do, I should get paid more than alot of my colleagues on the shop floor(nights). There's things I can achieve physically demanding that I'd say 90% couldn't.
I'd imagine the argument for this case being why does a checkout worker deserve the pay the same as someone in dc, or even nights.
Little too late, but tesco should of introduced skill and workload base pay years ago.
My opinion this day in age, tesco and other retailers will lose this battle.
A large amount of the basis of this equal pay claim is around gender equality - the argument being that since stores are majority female and DCs are majority male, it's sexual discrimination to pay differently. This will get thrown out straight away as there is clear evidence going back years and years of why there is a difference in pay.
Union membership in DCs allows for much better pay negotiations which means bigger pay rises. The retail membership is so low in comparison that they just don't have any real clout.
As to whether the jobs are different - I've also done both. I've worked nights on drinks, produce, and frozen (sometimes all in one night) and can honestly say that working in a DC is more physically demanding.
Working on the back door unloading a delivery in chilly temperature is not the same as 8 hours in +0.5. Filling two cages of bananas is not the same as picking 4 pallets of them. Looking for missing shrink in a freezer is absolutely not the same as picking in the high bay at Dav F.
My personal opinion, there's zero to this claim, and it's a law firm trying desperately to clutch at very faint straws.
It's not about physically demanding etc, it's whether the roles have the same similarities... So if the role requires you to move and stack cages in both store and DC then that would be looked at..
Are wagons loaded both sides? - if so how and with what equipment? Is the training the same or similar? Is the equipment similar?
It's like the machines, everytime it's "they are different" just slap a seat on it and your good to go... Its a different model sure, length maybe a little longer? But concept and purpose = same..
So there's plenty of grounds... I agree that the checkout vs DC wouldn't work though for women saying checkout workers do the same, I've worked checkout and that's far easier... But for shop floor, checkout, backdoor, stacking etc, similar / more = yes definitely.
It's not so much about job similarity, but more "value to the company" - is stacking a cage in the DC as valuable to the company as serving a customer on the checkouts? This is why it's such a complicated matter & part of why it's taking so long.
@last hurrah think its more down to handling stock is handling stock,you put it on a cage,we take it off,no difference in the motion or muscles used to complete that task
Exactly that. We also work in cold warehouse, well some of us do. Produce. Problem I hear alot, oh I've done produce. Many times I've heard this, yet they probably come went on there for 1 shift or to help and works some dollies and cages. 13 years I've done it, no one lasts more than 6 years in the past due to the load. Plus extra like coleslaw, bread eggs. If tesco pay out equal pay for job value and similarities, I'm for it.
Quote from: Sherwoodforest on 26-03-24, 09:06AM@last hurrah think its more down to handling stock is handling stock,you put it on a cage,we take it off,no difference in the motion or muscles used to complete that task
I agree that handling stock is handling stock, but that's on a case by case basis. Picking pallets of a hundred cases of butter or fifty trays of potatoes or boxes of bananas is harder work than working cages of even the heaviest stock in store. Moving one box of bananas in +12 requires on slightly more work than doing so in a store. But the quantities involved are drastically different.
I'm not saying that working in a store isn't hard graft on some departments, just comparing the two jobs as like for like isn't accurate.
In terms of using machinery, yes our DCs use powered MHE for many tasks but that also brings with it significant risk of injury to yourself or others in a cold and noisy environment.
Loading a trailer in a fresh site is probably one of the most complicated things we ask a colleague to do as a business. You have to work out what order you're going to load in, what temperature zones to set and how much of each temperature to load. Then collect the stock, arrange it safely and secure it with straps, close bulkheads and ensure temperature zones are within tolerance. All the while you also have to be mindful of the weight of stock you are loading and ensure there's enough weight over the fifth wheel, or that the bottom deck of a DD or MDDD is heavier, even if you haven't put stock on it yet. You are responsible for tens of thousands of pounds worth of stock which hinges on your diligence and decision making. Unloading one in store means opening a door, checking a temperature, and pulling stock off into a warehouse (or to a chiller if you don't have tip and fill teams anymore). Technically you could say that putting stock on a trailer and taking it off is the same but in reality it isn't.
If we look at value to the business, an average store gets what, 10,000 customers per day? An average DC services 200 stores, so around 2,000,000 customers a day. With a headcount probably only twice that of a big extra.
Again, I want to be clear that I absolutely do not think working in store is easy, but working in a DC is not on the same level in my opinion.
Quote from: Last hurrah on 27-03-24, 04:48PMQuote from: Sherwoodforest on 26-03-24, 09:06AM@last hurrah think its more down to handling stock is handling stock,you put it on a cage,we take it off,no difference in the motion or muscles used to complete that task
I agree that handling stock is handling stock, but that's on a case by case basis. Picking pallets of a hundred cases of butter or fifty trays of potatoes or boxes of bananas is harder work than working cages of even the heaviest stock in store. Moving one box of bananas in +12 requires on slightly more work than doing so in a store. But the quantities involved are drastically different.
I'm not saying that working in a store isn't hard graft on some departments, just comparing the two jobs as like for like isn't accurate.
In terms of using machinery, yes our DCs use powered MHE for many tasks but that also brings with it significant risk of injury to yourself or others in a cold and noisy environment.
Loading a trailer in a fresh site is probably one of the most complicated things we ask a colleague to do as a business. You have to work out what order you're going to load in, what temperature zones to set and how much of each temperature to load. Then collect the stock, arrange it safely and secure it with straps, close bulkheads and ensure temperature zones are within tolerance. All the while you also have to be mindful of the weight of stock you are loading and ensure there's enough weight over the fifth wheel, or that the bottom deck of a DD or MDDD is heavier, even if you haven't put stock on it yet. You are responsible for tens of thousands of pounds worth of stock which hinges on your diligence and decision making. Unloading one in store means opening a door, checking a temperature, and pulling stock off into a warehouse (or to a chiller if you don't have tip and fill teams anymore). Technically you could say that putting stock on a trailer and taking it off is the same but in reality it isn't.
If we look at value to the business, an average store gets what, 10,000 customers per day? An average DC services 200 stores, so around 2,000,000 customers a day. With a headcount probably only twice that of a big extra.
Again, I want to be clear that I absolutely do not think working in store is easy, but working in a DC is not on the same level in my opinion.
and is this just one person loading the fresh stock? Or multiple workers with a machine or handwork?
Quoteand is this just one person loading the fresh stock? Or multiple workers with a machine or handwork?
Just one, two for a fixed double decker if your store still gets them. They'll use MHE to move stock to the bay, only loading it onto a trailer if it's a standard 13m. No MHE on any deckers or short trailers/rigids - then it's all by hand.
Gets even more complex for multi run drops with more than one store on.
Quote from: Last hurrah on 27-03-24, 06:33PMQuoteand is this just one person loading the fresh stock? Or multiple workers with a machine or handwork?
Just one, two for a fixed double decker if your store still gets them. They'll use MHE to move stock to the bay, only loading it onto a trailer if it's a standard 13m. No MHE on any deckers or short trailers/rigids - then it's all by hand.
Gets even more complex for multi run drops with more than one store on.
what about picking and stacking of cages? How many does it take to load 64 cages for double decker. I know it's done on speed, why the cages come packed and absolute mess, which yes can be due to loading onto the lorry and travelling in the lorry. How many hours contracted to staff work to pick these cages?
Quote from: Nightproduceworker on 27-03-24, 08:19PMwhat about picking and stacking of cages? How many does it take to load 64 cages for double decker. I know it's done on speed, why the cages come packed and absolute mess, which yes can be due to loading onto the lorry and travelling in the lorry. How many hours contracted to staff work to pick these cages?
It's difficult to say really. Fresh is picked very differently to packaged:
Packaged (grocery, non food, bed etc) is all picked by store. One colleague takes cages on a LLOP and drives up and down lanes of pallets picking into those cages what they are told to pick. One cage will only be picked by one person, and the time will wholly depend on what product they are picking. H&B will take a long time, crisps or toilet roll very little time.
In Fresh cages are laid out in a big u-shape where each store has its own 'lane'. Pickers there will walk around that layout with a pallet picking stock from their pallet into a cage. That means a cage of yoghurts or ready meals could have 50-100 different people pick into it (which is why fresh cage fill and stacking will be worse than you should see from grocery - it's very very difficult to pin down who is poorly stacking).
On average, a site will do 200,000 cases per day at a pick rate of 175 cases per hour which means they would use somewhere around 1,150 hours to pick it.
If I had to take a rough guess at the time to pick all of the stock for that 64 cages, I'd say somewhere around 9-10 hours total.