Heard rumours of a restructure affecting Team managers being trialled in a couple of DCs. Anyone able to shed any light on it?
Replace restructure with cost cutting, that's all its is. And it wouldn't surprise me they are hitting every soft bit they can.
No idea but i wouldn't mind restructuring a few of the managers in my store.
Stobarts have lost the Tesco contract in Ireland, and there is a 45 day consultation period in the DC's Dhl are taking over from stobarts
Quote from: Tsportyhead on 13-09-16, 09:36AM
Heard rumours of a restructure affecting Team managers being trialled in a couple of DCs. Anyone able to shed any light on it?
Apparently so, to what extent? Unknown at the moment.
Loads of rumours and unverified leaks but we are supposedly losing 8-10 warehouse managers and 2 Transport Team managers at Hinckley DC.
Some departments are also being amalgamated with Litchfield DC, reported to include Personnel and Transport Manager.
They are running a pilot scheme at lichfield and hinkley with running with reduced managers, not sure what it looks like in terms of numbers etc but have been told they run quite high numbers of managers compared to most DC's. They have however started consultation with some managers there (Not sure how it is still a pilot scheme if there is redundancies already). This will be ran until late this year, with it then potentially being rolled out across the board.
To be honest with what has happened in stores over the past few years this has been a long time coming.
Yes heard about this cutting in half I believe and pay reduction too
Probably not affect our area too much- transport & personnel already amalgamated with another DC. Pay reduction won't go down well as already on parity with warehouse ops and less than drivers , with significantly poorer benefits- less holidays, sick, etc:
Tesco are always playing with structures, basically every time they find a new thing or job role to cut its labeled a restructure, we are all adults time for the top brass to be sensible and admit its an ongoing cost saving project.
Well with all this restructuring going on across all areas of the business [ except express ] cutting costs , I see its that time of year that all Store Managers across the whole estate are up for there meeting next week with Matt and Dave, how much is that gonna cost....???
about 10 million I imagine ( though not just store managers go to it. There is around 400 customer assistants attending , community champions , long service awards colleagues invited.
Managers at Livingston DC were told at a meeting last week that restructuring of management will begin in January, and 40% of them face redundancy.
This was information directly from two managers who were present at the meeting.
Yes there's definitely a management restructure being piloted at Lichfield and Hinckley and yet again this COST CUTTING exercise again will be disguised as a customer related initiative.
I just wish that the "senior leadership team" would be open and honest - so much for David Lewis transparency policy - practice what you preach mate
How can the company claim to have a "safety first" and "people first " policies when they are changing the roles of the PM and the H&S managers rolls
There is a management restructure at Hinckley and Lichfield DC's...it's a bit like the badger/seal cull...it affects warehouse and transport and others...apparently there's a points system in place...the more points the safer you are...a management 'insider' said length of service is out...length of tongue is in...the more backsides you've kissed the better...some experienced staff are to go...but then Tesco have never wanted people who know what they're doing...they want people who do as they're told...volunteers were not asked for...it was a simple "we decide who stays and who goes.."...the big concern now is WHO'S NEXT????
Length of tongue is most definitely not in.
Who you know makes no difference.
Management skills is what it will be based on. They have an initiative already in place that will measure those skills.
I do understand your point though about the company deciding who goes and who stays, the concept of manipulation falls mainly with the individuals belief in is it possible? and would they?
Team support 36 half hours a week 25 years service can anyone tell me am I lined up for redundancy (-*-) (-*-) (-*-)
Quote from: Duracell on 14-09-16, 07:31PM
Length of tongue is most definitely not in.
Who you know makes no difference.
Management skills is what it will be based on. They have an initiative already in place that will measure those skills.
I do understand your point though about the company deciding who goes and who stays, the concept of manipulation falls mainly with the individuals belief in is it possible? and would they?
Some reached their level of incompetence as soon as they were promoted which isn't their fault, rather that of their cronies further up the food chain.
Too often it has been a case of spreading wealth among friends and family which never had the potential to help the company in any way shape or form.
Those pigeons are now coming home to roost and not before time!
I have to disagree with you slightly Duracell...if management skills is the only criteria then why would you get rid of a Transport Manager with 27 years experience who could run the job single handed but retain a newcomer with no experience whatsoever?...Tesco want yes men...do it our way with a smile and good telephone manner and you'll be okay...but don't take my word for it..ask the drivers at Hinckley who are the managers who could run the job blind folded and run it efficiently and get the best out of their staff?...their names will be on 'sorry you're leaving' cards.. :'(
It would be interesting for someone from one of the "pilot" dc's to inform us what the restructure actually looks like, because there is a shroud of secrecy around the "project"
Matt Davies is very vocal on public media about the importance of communicating to the people involved in any decisions made by the main board, but he's certainly been quiet on this subject.
It is also very interesting why the announcement of possible redundancies (both at store and dc's) were made after the WMTY survey >:(
How many managers have gone and what roles have been replaced.
Quote from: Crybabybunting on 15-09-16, 09:49AM
I have to disagree with you slightly Duracell...if management skills is the only criteria then why would you get rid of a Transport Manager with 27 years experience who could run the job single handed but retain a newcomer with no experience whatsoever?...Tesco want yes men...do it our way with a smile and good telephone manner and you'll be okay...but don't take my word for it..ask the drivers at Hinckley who are the managers who could run the job blind folded and run it efficiently and get the best out of their staff?...their names will be on 'sorry you're leaving' cards.. :'(
And this has happened has it?
Or are you speculating?
Are you aware of the company initiative that will be used to measure the qualities of the managers concerned?
I have been made aware of how it is going to happen.
From what I have been told what you are suggesting will be difficult to achieve.
The process will be closely scrutininised, some concerns have already been raised and that scrutiny has already started.
Also what happens in the First two DC's may look nothing like what gets roles out to all the other company occupied DC's.
It has been discussed that how they do this will have a major impact on distribution, and if they make stupid decisions and mistakes like you suggest, it will devastate distribution.
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 15-09-16, 12:28PM
It would be interesting for someone from one of the "pilot" dc's to inform us what the restructure actually looks like, because there is a shroud of secrecy around the "project"
Matt Davies is very vocal on public media about the importance of communicating to the people involved in any decisions made by the main board, but he's certainly been quiet on this subject.
It is also very interesting why the announcement of possible redundancies (both at store and dc's) were made after the WMTY survey >:(
How many managers have gone and what roles have been replaced.
The pilot at the Two DC's is going to realise the best approach, the best way possible before it is applied to every other Company Occupied DC.
This is why there are no facts to other DC's the Idea of a Pilot is to test the ways and means before it is applied to all.
Quote from: Duracell on 14-09-16, 07:31PM
Length of tongue is most definitely not in.
Who you know makes no difference.
Management skills is what it will be based on. They have an initiative already in place that will measure those skills.
I do understand your point though about the company deciding who goes and whho stays, the concept of manipulation falls mainly with the individuals belief in is it possible? and would they?
Duracell, you seem very well informed on the "pilot" and the processes around the process for deciding who stays and who goes - I wonder why this is , could there be a cuckoo in the nest !
As I'm sure you're fully aware Tesco now has a (or claims to have ) a people first policy and part of this is speaking to colleagues as adults (not children), well the silence on this issue stinks of childtren should be seen and not heard, and ask no questions and you won't be told any lies - what has happened to Dave Lewis's open and honest approach.
As for the initiatives for measuring management skills, are already in place, pray tell me , what these are and how would you know !!!!!
Cuckoo? nest?
Not even going to respond to that nonsense.
And if you continue with it I have better things to do.
As for policy and speaking to people like adults.
Are you one of the adults affected at the pilot DC's or a distribution manager or rep ? if not they have nothing to tell you. If you hear silence at this particular time you do not need to know.
As for the initiative for measuring is all ready in place, for quite some time, the tool they will use, has been in place for several years.
How do I know, because I saw it launched and I listen to the facts when they are told to me.
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 15-09-16, 12:28PM
It would be interesting for someone from one of the "pilot" dc's to inform us what the restructure actually looks like, because there is a shroud of secrecy around the "project"
I don't think that there is a shroud of secrecy around this project. I am just a warehouse op at a different DC as to where the trial is going on and I know that our managers have had the briefing about what is going on .
As for your previous post regarding Duracell,I think maybe you should read some of the many informative posts that he/she has posted across a wide range of topics on here before making assumptions.
Quote from: darklighter on 15-09-16, 08:48AM
Quote from: Duracell on 14-09-16, 07:31PM
Length of tongue is most definitely not in.
Who you know makes no difference.
Management skills is what it will be based on. They have an initiative already in place that will measure those skills.
I do understand your point though about the company deciding who goes and who stays, the concept of manipulation falls mainly with the individuals belief in is it possible? and would they?
Some reached their level of incompetence as soon as they were promoted which isn't their fault, rather that of their cronies further up the food chain.
Too often it has been a case of spreading wealth among friends and family which never had the potential to help the company in any way shape or form.
Those pigeons are now coming home to roost and not before time!
Ahh I see someone else listened to what they were told. Another cuckoo ?
No a rational listener of fact!
I believe that this money saving exercise is to take place at the DC I work, it is rumoured that the eleven Managers (team leaders) on each shift will be cut to four on each shift. What is to happen to the surplus is as yet unknown. It is also rumoured that there will be changes to HR and H&S. It is also rumoured that there is talk of moving to ten hour shifts (not sure how that will work unless they are considering getting rid of the night shift) With regards to the conversation about retaining the Managers with the better skill-sets in my experience there are very few I would even consider employing at all. It's got to be said it's entertaining working for Tesco. I wonder if all of this has Usdaw's full support?
Quote from: Duracell on 15-09-16, 07:10PM
Ahh I see someone else listened to what they were told. Another cuckoo ?
No a rational listener of fact!
Say what? ???
probably a response to
reply 22
Thanks optout, didn't make sense until you explained.
Quote from: Duracell on 15-09-16, 07:01PM
Cuckoo? nest?
Not even going to respond to that nonsense.
And if you continue with it I have better things to do.
As for policy and speaking to people like adults.
Are you one of the adults affected at the pilot DC's or a distribution manager or rep ? if not they have nothing to tell you. If you hear silence at this particular time you do not need to know.
As for the initiative for measuring is all ready in place, for quite some time, the tool they will use, has been in place for several years.
How do I know, because I saw it launched and I listen to the facts when they are told to me.
Duracell , again I will ask you your source of information , I certain haven't seen the initiative for measuring management so skills launched , if it exist why isn't it used as part of the section process, and what facts have you listened to, because there aren't any available on this subject , you can clearly see this from reading this thread.
Perhaps I am adult at one of the pilot dc's, a distribution manager or rep , are you ! If not how do you know more than anybody else
Quote from: picktocube on 15-09-16, 07:03PM
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 15-09-16, 12:28PM
It would be interesting for someone from one of the "pilot" dc's to inform us what the restructure actually looks like, because there is a shroud of secrecy around the "project"
I don't think that there is a shroud of secrecy around this project. I am just a warehouse op at a different DC as to where the trial is going on and I know that our managers have had the briefing about what is going on .
As for your previous post regarding Duracell,I think maybe you should read some of the many informative posts that he/she has posted across a wide range of topics on here before making assumptions.
informative across a wide range of topics , that statement speaks for it's self , so was Kim Philby and look what he turned out to be.
As for the brief about what's going on , it is exactly that - brief i.e. Pilot at 2 dc's... no structure to the comms, no numbers , no criteria, etc, so there clear is a shroud I'd secrecy
Arizonarugby. You seem to be answering your own questions in your speculation.
You say perhaps you are affected at the pilot DC's. In which case you will know more than I do. Which obviously isn't the case.
If you are a Manager or Rep within distribution you should have heard the facts briefed out If you haven't then you should ask for them from your DCLT and your National Reps.
If you are none of the above then quite frankly at present, why do you need to know?
The situation is not set in stone, the pilot will be a work in process and a learning curve as to what works best, best approach, best methods etc, before it is roled out to every other company occupied DC.
Your national reps and management structure at your DC's have been told the same as mine, a discussion with Both will confirm what I have said, if you are at either of the pilot DC's you will probably know even more, as you don't I suspect you are not.
The simple truth is that Tesco would not be implementing these so called pilot schemes if it was business as usual, sadly managers will be losing their jobs exactly in what form or how many, that has as yet too be decided..long live the king!!! :-X
The simple and sad truth is that we have a union that says yes more than the man from delmonte .
I come from an age when the union was there to protect the rights and jobs of the workers , but unfortunately USDAW are neatly tucked in to Dave Lewis's back pocket.
Since I started working for the company "real pay" has reduced significantly as the payments for unsocial working has been taken away.
The fact that the union allows the company in introduce two tier pay structures - new employees are paid differently (less) than the longer term employees , speaks volumes
Where have they introduced a tow tier system. If anything they're there removing that as longer term employees are getting same as new employees.
Arizonrugby. Whilst I understand the point you are making as many here and through the years have said the same.
How can the union as a united entity fight or something object to new terms for new staff?
When the company wish to reduce terms for new starters, where is the support for taking action, not existing staff as they are left unaffected. Also not from new starters because at introductory of terms there would yet to be anyone on them, after the roll out where the workers start on these terms? How they accept the terms it is the individuals choice what terms they accept.
So where are the numbers, the head count, a majority number that would be required to take effective action?
What is the point of the Union at national level saying NO NO NO, we will take action.
To then ask for support to all staff to take action about a change they will be unaffected by, because the change is rolled out to new starts?
We had a scenario where pension change affected all, a call for action from Usdaw in distribution showed a response of less than 20%.
Retail pay review has seen little official resistance.
Current restructuring is devastating even more in all pay tiers.
Where is the revolt from the members?
It's laughable to Blame USDAW.
We are USDAW.
So yeah in simple terms, we only have ourselves to blame.
Expressdude2016
Soon to be 4 Tiers in distribution in the same location if workers agree to it.
If a worker is offered a new contract a different role with different terms for a job they want to do, who am I the unaffected to say no and take action?
You're right, Duracell, there is no collective stomach for industrial action in spite of pay and benefits being constantly hit. The saving grace will be that the National Living Wage will force the company to increase the CA hourly rate in the next few years but it will no doubt be at the expense of other benefits being reduced or done away with. The cutting of Sunday premiums for long serving colleagues was sold as a necessary to help fund a pay rise for all - classic divide and rule tactics. Expect to see similar tactics in the race to the bottom of the pay league.
I think most people have resigned themselves to all the cost cutting as fallout from the unbelievable antics of the Philip Clarke era. He may theoretically be at risk of a lengthy jail term but in all honesty I would sooner his punishment be to pay back all the money he made out of Tesco - it can hardly be said that he 'earned' the money for wrecking the business! His most credible defence will be to claim rank stupidity - the ultimate example of the Tesco management culture!
There was no call for action over the pension, in Distribution or anywhere else!
There was an insipid letter, a while after the changes took place, inquiring as to whether anyone would have been prepared to fight. The majority of us saw the futility and simply declined to answer such nonsense.
Do you really think that the union needed to ask if anyone was unhappy with the pension changes?
Unfortunately for any action to be deemed lawful they are legally bound to ask you.
And when the response is pitiful, sadly it's says it all.
There was a letter to distribution members asking if they wanted to engage the consultative process to take action, not sometime after either, the response was sadly dismall.
Duracell , I don't agree with u . At present Tesco have been quite clever at reducing hours and taking away enhanced overtime rates . The staff outcry has been minimal as they have targeted the minority ie nightshift and long term staff. Already there seems to be a growing outcry against the union . It is only a matter of time till the mass withdrawing of membership starts to be noticed .Either by another union or by Tesco who will then push forward with there entire plans . All nightshift gone , canteens gone , bank holiday rates gone . Guess work , on my part , maybe , but nightshifts are going and vending machines are being trialled in stores as a replacement for canteens . As for management can anyone really say that looking at metro stores , lidl etc that we really need so many managers ?even do we need so many lead team ? does a PM role in every store seem justified ? no . too expensive , for doing too little .
How is the company seizing the opportunity to manipulate opportunity against an apathetic Union membership Just the Union Hiarchy's fault?
Quote from: Duracell on 19-09-16, 06:00PM
There was a letter to distribution members asking if they wanted to engage the consultative process to take action, not sometime after either, the response was sadly dismall.
Factually incorrect and I too have suspicions regarding your continuing defense of the union and company. If you would care to produce such a letter (I'm sure you would have kept a copy) I will apologise profusely.
Are you for real?
It was an expression of wish letter, I was one of the minority that actually sent it back expressing a wish!! To invoke the consultative process , a ballot for taking industrial action. Why on earth would I have kept it ? Perhaps you could ask one of the 80% who didn't respond for a copy!
Not Factually incorrect at all.
Defense of the Union and the company? I am not defending anyone.
Just disagreeing with the proportation of blame.
But like I have said yes in simple terms we USDAW have ourselves to blame.
My view is simply different with regard to a perception of actually who USDAW is.
Just for your info the proof you require is before your eyes.
Quote from: picktocube on 05-11-15, 05:26PM
Quote from: The Mrs on 05-11-15, 03:24AM
This is the vote on the current pay offer and should not be confused with the recent voting papers received in the post gauging whether DC's would take industrial action over the changes to the pension.
Do you know when the results from the vote regarding the pension are announced.?I can't remember when the closing date for voting was.
No profuse apology required, just stand corrected.
I can't believe that you didn't think to look to the archives of this site to gauge what has or hasn't happened over time.
Unless the site and the other two posters are what was it again ? ........
Oh yeah factually incorrect.
Oh and are you going to question their integrity to.
If we consider timeframes for a moment.
From what I can see (again from taking the time to investigate what I am about to post), the final realisation of what the pension change would be was communicated 24/08/2015, now as USDAW couldn't really challenge what had yet to be realised, from 24/08/2015 it took 9 weeks for reps to discuss the changes, gauge the feeling of their members, relay the feeling to national officers organise a postal drop of the expression of wish all to be received on the doormats before the 5/11/15 as quote above.
SOME TIME AFTER!!!!! I'd say a pretty good response time myself, the response failure were the letters and expression of wish going back!
Which only the MEMBERS had control over.
Just to clarify facts as you seem so insistant.
All available in the Archives of VLH!
One more point I would like to make before I get chastised for going off topic, as there seems to be uncertainty for some as to whether the mail drop correspondence I referred to actually took place.
At my location during the time and process I referred to, it was rigorously reiterated to members by reps that they should check that their correct postal details were recorded with USDAW administration, as in such times where communication takes place your current up to date details are essential for you to be kept fully consulted.
Been an USDAW member for a decade and have moved home during that time, and may wonder why you have no knowledge of a correspondence? Did you update your details when you moved?
Just a thought.
Quote from: Duracell on 19-09-16, 12:04PM
Arizonrugby. Whilst I understand the point you are making as many here and through the years have said the same.
How can the union as a united entity fight or something object to new terms for new staff?
When the company wish to reduce terms for new starters, where is the support for taking action, not existing staff as they are left unaffected. Also not from new starters because at introductory of terms there would yet to be anyone on them, after the roll out where the workers start on these terms? How they accept the terms it is the individuals choice what terms they accept.
So where are the numbers, the head count, a majority number that would be required to take effective action?
What is the point of the Union at national level saying NO NO NO, we will take action.
To then ask for support to all staff to take action about a change they will be unaffected by, because the change is rolled out to new starts?
We had a scenario where pension change affected all, a call for action from Usdaw in distribution showed a response of less than 20%.
Retail pay review has seen little official resistance.
Current restructuring is devastating even more in all pay tiers.
Where is the revolt from the members?
It's laughable to Blame USDAW.
We are USDAW.
So yeah in simple terms, we only have ourselves to blame.
Expressdude2016
Soon to be 4 Tiers in distribution in the same location if workers agree to it.
If a worker is offered a new contract a different role with different terms for a job they want to do, who am I the unaffected to say no and take action?
Duracell, you are quite right the union is only as strong as its membership, but in turn the membership is only as strong as the leaders (of the union) and at the moment the national reps and the senior union members are nothing more than puppets for David Lewis.
No doubt they'll all be sat at the NEC "event" this morning paying homage to the his wilful distruction of what once was a great company to work for.
All get for usdaw is a regurgitation of the company issued statements.
There are a number of examples of this, but let's discuss the turnaround bonus, we were told no pay rise but if the company met its target we would get a turnaround bonus (in addition to shares in success) , so what did we get, yes we got 5% bonus but no SIS (normally 3.5%) and no pay rise (normal 1.5%) so in short we got nothing
Another fine example of our union leaders dancing to Drastic Dave's tune at the expense of its members
I have heard that at the moment we are in a phase 1 of 4 phases of restructuring. Has any one else heard about this. Phase2 apparently is about managers .. has anyone else heard this?
Arizonarugby I certainly don't disagree, the USDAW leaders do contribute to the spin wherever possible reflecting things positively, emphasising and promoting the positive side and not reflecting on the negative detrimental effects at all in some cases.
Their approach certainly could be a lot better.
Yet I also think that the membership's attitude needs to change also.
If members are unhappy we have to make it clear so that the leaders have to act on it.
For example
We are rapidly moving into areas where Employment rights are individually gauged.
The Equality Act.
Parental and Carers rights.
Employee management and consideration is becoming individualistic.
On that basis a forum that can decide change without the need for individual agreement or consent of the wider membership isn't fit for purpose in this day and age.
I have an opinion about current changes and how they sit in the grand plan. It pure assumption on my part so I won't go into detail.
I am disappointed in the reluctance higher up in the partnership at the lack of acknowledgment of the potential negative effects of change and the problems they can create.
"There is None so blind than those that will not see".
Proportion of blame... (If we are discussing blame) is less for the membership, but we must learn from experience that we must support each other even if individually we are unaffected.
Another example
For retail the pay review justified a cut for a minority in favour of an increase for the majority.
Where does that pay increase now sit in the bigger picture with all of the restructuring with more likely to come.
From a united union point of view, change should be considered as a negative unless there is a positive gain for all or the implication is fair and the same for all.
We should care and support another when they lose out to change, because quite frankly it is likely that at some point we will all suffer similar in turn.
I am happy to stand beside any member and fight for what they hold dear. I can't accept doing it for them without their support. Members have to stand and be counted too.
I have been reading this thread from afar but I cant keep quiet anymore, seems to be that Duracell is trying to hijack this thread. Is it not about a management restructure?, this means job losses?
As I know around 40 managers are to be made redundant, yes managers so lets rejoice?!
This is just the start of a roll out at all distribution centres, so all in distribution will be affected.
Duracell I would love you to say your what role you have in the company and where you are based............... sssssssssssssssssshhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Just waiting for some company orientated answer
We know there are high up lurkers on this page.... guess we should expect a few tantrums now and then when we say stuff they dont like...boohoo!
Quote from: nolotil on 22-09-16, 03:39PM
I have been reading this thread from afar but I cant keep quiet anymore, seems to be that Duracell is trying to hijack this thread. Is it not about a management restructure?, this means job losses?
As I know around 40 managers are to be made redundant, yes managers so lets rejoice?!
This is just the start of a roll out at all distribution centres, so all in distribution will be affected.
Duracell I would love you to say your what role you have in the company and where you are based............... sssssssssssssssssshhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Just waiting for some company orientated answer
Please look at the thread closely, I am not hijacking the thread.
I have responded to a couple of points and posts directed at me.
Yes I am aware managers are going to lose their jobs. No I am not rejoicing its shocking, I actually believe if their operational workload is farmed out to other less competant staff because of inexperience it will cripple distribution. So I am not dismissing the damage that is being done or defending the decision. Yet I do appreciate it could be a lot worse if they don't apply the pilot, and roll out the uncertainty to all at this time.
Is appreciating it could be much worse defending the company's decision of where to make cut backs, I don't think so.
I have seen some roll outs to all, lost jobs in the past and have been in the firing line myself with difficult decisions to make, with the damaging effect now being dealt with because the change wasn't suitable, just because I welcome a pilot rather than a compliance roll out style that have been quite damaging in the past, does not mean I welcome the changes.
Without being specific
Work level 1 Distribution .
For over 2 decades.
Never been a manager or had any inclination to be a manager.
Quote from: Magz21 on 22-09-16, 04:26PM
We know there are high up lurkers on this page.... guess we should expect a few tantrums now and then when we say stuff they dont like...boohoo!
The high up lurker, seems like you Magz21, trying to change this subject off subject again.
Any job lost, is a family wage lost......... so boohoo
Quote from: Duracell on 22-09-16, 05:26PM
Quote from: nolotil on 22-09-16, 03:39PM
I have been reading this thread from afar but I cant keep quiet anymore, seems to be that Duracell is trying to hijack this thread. Is it not about a management restructure?, this means job losses?
As I know around 40 managers are to be made redundant, yes managers so lets rejoice?!
This is just the start of a roll out at all distribution centres, so all in distribution will be affected.
Duracell I would love you to say your what role you have in the company and where you are based............... sssssssssssssssssshhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Just waiting for some company orientated answer
Please look at the thread closely, I am not hijacking the thread.
I have responded to a couple of points and posts directed at me.
Yes I am aware managers are going to lose their jobs. No I am not rejoicing its shocking, I actually believe if their operational workload is farmed out to other less competant staff because of inexperience it will cripple distribution. So I am not dismissing the damage that is being done or defending the decision. Yet I do appreciate it could be a lot worse if they don't apply the pilot, and roll out the uncertainty to all at this time.
Is appreciating it could be much worse defending the company's decision of where to make cut backs, I don't think so.
I have seen some roll outs to all, lost jobs in the past and have been in the firing line myself with difficult decisions to make, with their damaging effect now being dealt with because the change wasn't suitable, just because I welcome a pilot rather than a compliance roll out that have been quite damaging in the past, does not mean I welcome the changes.
Without being specific
Work level 1 Distribution .
For over 2 decades.
Never been a manager or had any inclination to be a manager.
Thank you Duracell, a most honest reply.
Quote from: Magz21 on 22-09-16, 04:26PM
We know there are high up lurkers on this page.... guess we should expect a few tantrums now and then when we say stuff they dont like...boohoo!
Magz21, I really hope your senior position isn't put under threat
Quote from: nolotil on 22-09-16, 05:37PM
Quote from: Magz21 on 22-09-16, 04:26PM
We know there are high up lurkers on this page.... guess we should expect a few tantrums now and then when we say stuff they dont like...boohoo!
Magz21, I really hope your senior position isn't put under threat
I am a TM in Distribution (Not Pilot DC) and right now it's a very worrying time for all. :'(
Word is the pilot is running well which is even more worrying (Rumour).
15 became 7 less than 30 days gone is this true?
No My Performance Meetings with 20 Team Members per crew and peak.
Buddy Clerks/Options running departments dishing mate's best jobs :thumbup:
Distribution WILL fail! Free for all. Matter of time,
Customers will suffer,
Tesco loses Credibility,
Profits will dip
Someone has pressed Self Destruct
Transparency? Bo**ox!
Info Leaked on SM then Panic brief, emailed Brief with no more info
Ill Wife worried sick; kids worried, Mortgage, bills, debt
Commitment, Job Security they said
Am I Committed For Peak?
Is anyone right now?
Happy Christmas now get out!
So what's your problem Number 4563425? >:(
Duracell will now explain that it's for the best and how you brought it upon yourself anyway........ ???
Here's the score as I see it. Tesco see they can remove an average of 10 mangers per site. With an average wage of 30k with pension and nat insurance payments. That's 300k per site saving.
some sites will loose less per site others will loose more.
20 plus dcs saving them 6million.
sorry to see anyone made redundant but there it is.
On a personal level I will be pleased when it gets to the Depot I work. I do have some sympathy for the wives and children of the affected but I can't bring myself to have any sympathy for the spineless bunch who will say and do anything to suck up to senior Management whilst not giving a sh*te about the colleagues who's lives they are messing around with to the point of causing physical and mental illness. Have any of them shown any remorse for their actions, have any of them shown any consideration for the colleagues livelihoods. NO! So for me it would be a stretch to expect anybody to feel sympathetic. >:(
Nolotil....
If you actually read any of my other comments, you would see Im not a manager. But think what you want. GA for 12 years and no intention of wanting to be a manager for this pathetic company.
Quote from: hesketh on 24-09-16, 10:55AM
So what's your problem Number 4563425? >:(
Duracell will now explain that it's for the best and how you brought it upon yourself anyway........ ???
Actually on the contrary, if the information coming out of the pilot DC's is the Pilot is going well, then I too think that is worrying, I had hoped that at least they had learned from their previous mistakes.
I have no faith in their ability to get anything right the first time. So if they are saying all is going well and to plan, it isn't really a pilot is it.
As for anyone Bringing it upon themselves, very few deserve compulsory redundancy. Although I can think of two in particular at the moment who warrent dismissal . Outright lying to the the media is actually gross misconduct. It would be so if anyone of us did so, but that's another discussion.
I do not support what the company are doing, I had brief hope that it would be done in the best way possible.
The plan for Distribution looks bleak if the operational side of management being done by other work levels is not done correctly.
To me a redundancy is a redundancy is doesn't matter what work level it is, it's still a person with commitments. I dislike in particular a compulsory situation. Really speaking with a company size it is doesn't need to happen.
I would like to have seen a compromise, a plan based on an offer of voluntary redundancy, then structure and action a plan based on the numbers that are to remain.
Quote from: snowyowl on 24-09-16, 08:09PM
On a personal level I will be pleased when it gets to the Depot I work. I do have some sympathy for the wives and children of the affected but I can't bring myself to have any sympathy for the spineless bunch who will say and do anything to suck up to senior Management whilst not giving a sh*te about the colleagues who's lives they are messing around with to the point of causing physical and mental illness. Have any of them shown any remorse for their actions, have any of them shown any consideration for the colleagues livelihoods. NO! So for me it would be a stretch to expect anybody to feel sympathetic. >:(
Snowyowl, that kind of attitude is just nasty. Some managers do actually care and will do that little extra to help colleagues
I can only speak considering my experiences and at my place of work and in my experience what are classed as Team Managers are not actually managers at all because they are not allowed to manage. They simply follow direction from senior Management and if that direction includes stitching a colleague up then so be it. This because they appear petrified of repercussions, hence spineless. You're right they are I'm sure genuinely nice guys amongst them but none of them seem to have the integrity to stand up to these Senior Management and say, "sorry I'm not doing that, because it's wrong" :-X :-X :-X
Livingston depot is in a bad enough state just now,dread to think what it will look like without experienced managers running the warehouse operation.
Extremely short-sighted view to gloat at others misfortune especially as its been alluded to that the changes to Distribution wont stop there :(
I'm not gloating, just emphasising that I find it hard to feel any sympathy for these people. 8-)
Perhaps you should have some empathy then, I actually received some empathy from managers in a previous similar scenario I found myself in even though I had more options available to me.
Rest assured if they get this pilot wrong, we will all suffer. If they fck it up, who is going to pay for the mistake?
Who are paying for the previous mistake at director level, it isn't directors is it!
Snowyowl, your are so right, reading you I thought for a moment we worked in the same store 😉
I wonder sometimes if SM are aware of what goes on when they are on day off as Senior managers seem to run the place as if no one can touch them, bulling and forcing team managers into detrimental actions towards GA.
I'm sure not all of them are like this (hopefully )
And try saying something!!! 😡
I think as in all DC's there will be good & bad managers but anyone being treated like this is horrible, Really all manager are now fighting for their jobs over the xmas period.. This wouldn't be nice for anyone not knowing if they are going to have a job come the new year...As Iv seen before in this great company they will do this & loss a lot of experienced managers & leave DC's being run by the new breed of company micro chipped clones...This dosn't look good for any DC in my view....For people to say they cant wait for it to come to their DC is awful & I really hope they are never in the same situation over the next months & years, because were all only 90 days away from being sent down the road if the great company can find a way of doing it...
Firstly not all managers are bad. :thumbup:
But there are many managers who would actually go to the trouble of manufacturing reasons for sacking people or making people worry about losing their jobs, these managers are without empathy, they completely dehumanize their employees and wallow in the fear (in the employee) that they create as a mere pass-time. How many times have you seen employees being forced to just give in working and look for another job, just because their face doesn't fit and a manager wants to get their jollies.
For these managers I feel ZERO, ZIP, NOTHING, NADA, I hope that these mangers lose their jobs and end up in the gutter somewhere, and hope that their families (if they are aware of this behavior) disown them or that the same fate happens to them, they are after all living on the proceeds of the misery that said managers create for others. THEY DO NOT CARE ONE JOT ABOUT US AS LONG AS THEY ARE OK.
There are of course those managers (some of whom frequent this forum) that I do feel for and hope that they are the ones that keep their jobs. I feel just as much for them as I do for my fellow GAs.
Sorry about the negativity, but I have witnessed the misery that can be caused (just on a whim) to employees AND their families by managers who are s*** and not human beings in any real sense of the word. :thumbup:
I'm saddened to see that their are so many short sighted bitter and twisted sad individuals on this site (snowyowl, nolotil ...et al) who can see no further than there nose and try to impose their bigoted views on others
Let's put this in to context , managers are only imposing Tesco policy and procedures i.e. SYA, SYP (my performance) etc.
The union has allowed the company to introduce two tier pay and performance structures
The company is in the mess it is in because of decisions made by the board of directors
The current board of directors lack the ingenuity vision and foresight to compete with the discounters , if Aldi, Lidl Iceland etc can negotiate to sell products at price x , then so should tesco - of course that would mean the buyers would have to lose their backhanders
"managers are only imposing Tesco policy and procedures i.e. SYA, SYP (my performance) etc"
There's an old saying speak as one finds. While I would not use all encompassing language there are certainly some MM who are on power trips, and some who would go out of their way to help their staff.
Would you believe this website came into being partly because a manager wanted a 1mtre square piece of cardboard moved, and throw his toys out of his pram when he lost the 'battle'.
Most of us have witnessed or been subjected to disgraceful treatment from many Tesco managers in our time so I understand some people's first instinct to be unsympathetic at the prospect of those managers being made redundant. In a sense, however, for those managers there is a greater tragedy than redundancy - it is realisation the company they sold their souls to will just as readily show them the door as anybody else when it suits. It's not even as if Tesco's box-ticking will have equipped them to be a good manager anywhere else. I think there is room for sympathy for them.
Quote from: Nomad on 26-09-16, 09:11AM
"managers are only imposing Tesco policy and procedures i.e. SYA, SYP (my performance) etc"
There's an old saying speak as one finds. While I would not use all encompassing language there are certainly some MM who are on power trips, and some who would go out of their way to help their staff.
Would you believe this website came into being partly because a manager wanted a 1mtre square piece of cardboard moved, and throw his toys out of his pram when he lost the 'battle'.
Nomad
It is irrelevant why or how this site came in to existence , it supposed to be a medium for people to air their views, perhsps the manager should have reacted differently , but tesco has clear has you go policy , if you threw a piece of rubbish in street and was caught , you would be fined.
However, that's not the point , the point is that the company is taking short sighted and I'll thought measures to reduce costs
Example
Resent restructures resulting in redundancy or reduced hours /pay
Team Leaders (store)
Night Replenishment (store)
Hygiene (Depot)
Staff Restuarant (Depot)
Managent Restructure (Depot)
And if we had a union with any kind of backbone or we had any kind solidarity with in our workforce this wouldn't,t be allowed to be happening , but instead we have all bought in to the Tesco ideology of I'm alright jack so **** you mate.
There is also an old "saying is don't tar everybody with the same brush" and the sad fact is that people / managers that you speak ill of are the ones who will most likely keep ther jobs, so all I can say is be careful what you wish for .
Anyone heard of further store 'restructure' in stores my service manager reckons they are all going 25 hours he's gutted, getting no cushion pay either.
[admin]Your question maybe answered if asked in one of the many threads in the 'Stores' section of VLH.[/admin]
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 26-09-16, 02:16AM
I'm saddened to see that their are so many short sighted bitter and twisted sad individuals on this site (snowyowl, nolotil ...et al) who can see no further than there nose and try to impose their bigoted views on others
Let's put this in to context , managers are only imposing Tesco policy and procedures i.e. SYA, SYP (my performance) etc.
The union has allowed the company to introduce two tier pay and performance structures
The company is in the mess it is in because of decisions made by the board of directors
The current board of directors lack the ingenuity vision and foresight to compete with the discounters , if Aldi, Lidl Iceland etc can negotiate to sell products at price x , then so should tesco - of course that would mean the buyers would have to lose their backhanders
Short sighted bitter and twisted sad individuals on this site!!!
Wow that's a harsh statement
Quote from: Dontbelieveaword on 26-09-16, 11:33AM
Anyone heard of further store 'restructure' in stores my service manager reckons they are all going 25 hours he's gutted, getting no cushion pay either.
[admin]Your question maybe answered if asked in one of the many threads in the 'Stores' section of VLH.[/admin]
. I've heard similar talk but I can't find any verification on any other thread.
This happened to the Customer Service Manager last year in the restructure,25hrs he was not happy this was in the South West
There are far too many managers as it is, and more are coming through Options, Graduate Entry etc. So a cull was long overdue. I sincerely hope it doesn't stop at Livingston and a lot of the deadwood is cleared from stores as well.
More work, more responsibility, and less money for the survivors.
Quote from: VladPutin on 26-09-16, 10:32PM
There are far too many managers as it is, and more are coming through Options, Graduate Entry etc. So a cull was long overdue. I sincerely hope it doesn't stop at Livingston and a lot of the deadwood is cleared from stores as well.
Vladputin
You really need to get your facts right , the options and graduate programme are not guarantees of a management position ( my site has 6 signed off options candidates still working on tools) - basically options is just a way that Tesco get people to take on extra responsibilities without the extra pay .
When this "pilot" is rolled out other DC, ask your self this - is there really any point of anybody actually being on the programme because there will be even less chance of the signed off candidates actually being appointed as a manager.
Three went through Options at my store in the last eight months. All signed off. All three at different stores.
Way to many chiefs, not enough Indians.
Quote from: fargone on 26-09-16, 11:40PM
More work, more responsibility, and less money for the survivors.
If they're looking for sympathy, it's in the dictionary. Between S**t and Syphilis 8-)
The direction Tesco is going they will be just a distant memory like woolworths.I give the 10 years max.
I think you're being very generous there Phantom :D :D
So getting back on track,
The pilot project hasn't started yet, so anyone saying its working at the moment is wrong.
The first part of the process, to have the managers in place has happened and all other have been told they are "at risk". So no manager has left the business yet so its still business as usual.
The strange part is that those "at risk" have been told they will have to work "lieu in notice", meaning its going to be business as normal over Christmas. Usually "lieu in notice" is paid up and an employee leaves the company straight away.
Quote from: snowyowl on 27-09-16, 11:53PM
I think you're being very generous there Phantom :D :D
very very generous!!
Quote from: VladPutin on 27-09-16, 04:44PM
Quote from: fargone on 26-09-16, 11:40PM
More work, more responsibility, and less money for the survivors.
If they're looking for sympathy, it's in the dictionary. Between S**t and Syphilis 8-)
:D :D :D :thumbup:
Quote from: lackofinterest on 28-09-16, 11:48AM
Quote from: VladPutin on 27-09-16, 04:44PM
Quote from: fargone on 26-09-16, 11:40PM
More work, more responsibility, and less money for the survivors.
If they're looking for sympathy, it's in the dictionary. Between S**t and Syphilis 8-)
:D :D :D :thumbup:
Whats that quote "s*** rolls down"
What a company, what have they achieved?
The classic divide and conquer
Apparently no one cares about the other, let the top team sit back and laugh at us!
And what do you suggest we do, comrade? Go on strike? 8-)
Tesco has always been every man and woman for themselves, from the s*** at Board level all the way down to the poor, bloody foot soldiers like me. The managers had the same amount of sympathy for us when we got screwed over as we have for them now.
VladPutin exactly what I mean, divide and conquer
No one cares about anyone.
The front line managers that want to sack everyone to the shopfloor staff that want to drop their "mates" in it and get them disciplined.
Not all are like that but lets agree the company has won.
So the simple northern guy is going to determine a lot of people mangers jobs tomorrow!
Quote from: VladPutin on 28-09-16, 04:21PM
And what do you suggest we do, comrade? Go on strike? 8-)
Tesco has always been every man and woman for themselves, from the s*** at Board level all the way down to the poor, bloody foot soldiers like me. The managers had the same amount of sympathy for us when we got screwed over as we have for them now.
Vlad this used to be a great forum, all the founding members have gone though,=,
Quote from: nolotil on 28-09-16, 04:26PM
VladPutin exactly what I mean, divide and conquer
No one cares about anyone.
The front line managers that want to sack everyone to the shopfloor staff that want to drop their "mates" in it and get them disciplined.
Not all are like that but lets agree the company has won.
You won't get any argument on that from me, unfortunately. :(
Nomad, think you may need to open a can of whoop ass on nolotil! :D
[admin]You think :-\ some days I just don't have the time 8-) Nomad[/admin]
Nolotil, this is still a great forum, hence why you have posted many times on here. Much love x
I too think it's a good forum, it gives you chance to vent your frustrations and I enjoy reading about others frustrations and now and again you learn something that might just come in handy. ;D ;D ;D
Next week in my ex store there is a meeting with the night managers. Not sure yet what about (-*-)
Quote from: nolotil on 28-09-16, 05:00PM
Vlad this used to be a great forum, all the founding members have gone though,=,
There was only every one founder to this site. Who is still here.
The moderators and Admin have changed a little, but some still remain.
Since the site was created before the Company's formal implantation of a Social Media Policy has happened , VLH being the first we saw, some initial members who may have been less than secretive about their participation with this site, since the introduction of the Company's SMP you may find that some of the early members have simply changed their identity to a less obvious one.
I personally think Overall VLH is currently at its best to date. :thumbup:
To cut to the chase
The at risk manager at the pilot sites have been asked to asked to work their notice period (to help protect xmas no doubt) , so effectively the scheme will prove absolutely nothing , for the cheek of it the company has offered them a loyalty bonus if they stay !!!!!
And as I understand it the "replacements " have been / will be offered a one-off lump sum payment and a salary which (in many cases) will mean they will in the long term end up earning less than a GA
Are you talking about Pilot DC's or Stores.
There seems to be some confusion going on in this thread.
The pilot and Business needs will be different for both, even though management restructures may be happening in both.
Quote from: Duracell on 29-09-16, 09:28AM
Are you talking about Pilot DC's or Stores.
There seems to be some confusion going on in this thread.
The pilot and Business needs will be different for both, even though management restructures may be happening in both.
The pilot hasnt even started but the the two pilot depots have failed, no one cares mr from the northen area but we all have a box at liverpool.
Are you for real.
You are contradicting yourself.
"The pilot hasn't even started"
After posting.
"The at risk managers have been asked to work their notice"
So which is correct.
Are they in consultation aware of the notice period, consulting over a loyalty bonus.
Or has the pilot not started.
After my motives and intergrity were questioned
Will all those who contribute to this thread remember it is in the 'Distribution Warehouse' section of VLH.
Quote from: Duracell on 29-09-16, 09:53AM
Are you for real.
You are contradicting yourself.
"The pilot hasn't even started"
After posting.
"The at risk managers have been asked to work their notice"
So which is correct.
Are they in consultation aware of the notice period, consulting over a loyalty bonus.
Or has the pilot not started.
After my motives and intergrity were questioned
Ok Duracell , you are now splitting hairs, it was a typo, you know the pilot has started and you know that the at risk managers have been asked to stay for the duration of their notice period , the "partnership" sanctioned it and once again sold there members down the river ... Long live the King , long live the partnership !!!!!!!!
I have learnt from experience of saying similar as you have and being corrected that the concept of "the partnership " or "The Partnership Agreement" as practiced in retail does not Exist in distribution.
Because of the fragmentation and different negotiating groups within distribution the a singular concept such as a partnership agreement can't be applied.
This is supported by people policies on the our site wherever they mention distribution which is very limited, they advise you to seek the context information from local consultative agreements.
In reaction to their grand plans this may be something worthy of further investigation. ;)
I don't get how there can be such confliction in approach.
When consulting with staff for reasons such as pay it is fragmented and can't be across all it has to be negotiated individual with the fragmented groups even though the proposal maybe the same
Yet when an operational changes are discussed which could still impact pay and conditions one size fits all is allowed.
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 29-09-16, 09:17AM
To cut to the chase
The at risk manager at the pilot sites have been asked to asked to work their notice period (to help protect xmas no doubt) , so effectively the scheme will prove absolutely nothing , for the cheek of it the company has offered them a loyalty bonus if they stay !!!!!
And as I understand it the "replacements " have been / will be offered a one-off lump sum payment and a salary which (in many cases) will mean they will in the long term end up earning less than a GA
No loyalty bonus offered
Lets get this right please, 30 day consultation period has started. At risk of no job managers have been told Pilot project means all managers working "lieu" till January.
No changes at the moment
So in short the "pilot project" at Hinckley and Lichfield running from now until January , aimed at proving reducing management numbers from 30 managers to 18, will not have an impact on the operation, is actually going to continue to run with 30 managers for the duration of the project !!!!!!!
Now the lunatics are really taking over the asylum !!!!
So with consideration to how things are happening.
Taking into account the principle of a pilot having a limited initial effect to the locations involved.
Also considering the approach to roll out to all other locations once the pilot is complete.
If we try to understand
http://m.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=4256 (http://m.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=4256)
Are the company failing in their obligations under the consultation guidelines?
Are they looking to fail their obligations to consultation, once they roll the process to all other locations?
In particular the lack of information which ACAS suggests must be disclosed during consultation.
Is any other location in consultation, have other location had notice of consultation period with a lack of this information.
If there is a true lack of detail and reasoning during any consultation period, regardless of its length, 30, 45 or 90 days, could it be deemed as insufficient to have such uncertainty and lack of information to a process that ultimately will affect over 100 employees. No they are not at a singular premises, but the ultimate roll out will be an approach which will be applied with a Collective group vision and objective.
The time frames and consultation we are seeing is in respect to a limited group, 30 days being 20 or less, yet the principle in approach is to realise an effect to several hundred staff on the basis of achieving a multi location objective.
So should it be 90 days for all, with clear information and reasoning for all?
Anybody who would like to complain about the union :question: Try here. :thumbup:
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/complain-to-the-certification-officer-about-a-trade-union-or-employers-association (https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/complain-to-the-certification-officer-about-a-trade-union-or-employers-association)
Quote from: Duracell on 29-09-16, 05:59PM
If there is a true lack of detail and reasoning during any consultation period, regardless of its length, 30, 45 or 90 days, could it be deemed as insufficient to have such uncertainty and lack of information to a process that ultimately will affect over 100 employees. No they are not at a singular premises, but the ultimate roll out will be an approach which will be applied with a Collective group vision and objective.
The time frames and consultation we are seeing is in respect to a limited group, 30 days being 20 or less, yet the principle in approach is to realise an effect to several hundred staff on the basis of achieving a multi location objective.
So should it be 90 days for all, with clear information and reasoning for all?
Sorry for posting a store related comment here but thought this might be relevant also to stores. With over 2000 jobs at risk in stores surely it should be 90 days consultation? Is the consultation period just a guideline or is this what they should be doing.
I understood that prior to having a conservative government the consultation period was always 90 days but during Cameron's reign it was lessened to 45 days!!!
It's also an opportunity to disinfect the culture of the organisation.
Quote from: fargone on 30-09-16, 12:01AM
It's also an opportunity to disinfect the culture of the organisation.
By this you mean exactly what ?
To change the culture of the organisation you would need to start at the very top i.e Dave Lewis , Matt Davies etc.
We are told (by our senior leadership) that the company has an open , honest transparent policy, but all I see is wall of lies and veils of secrecy.
Apparently Tesco's core purpose is serving Britons shopper a little better every day, can they really do this by reducing the number of staff, and replenish stock during normal trading hours.
Can they really do this when morale , in both stores and distribution is at an all time low
We are told we have a people first and safety first policy, really 2000+ staff face redundancy or reduced hours / pay cuts , all employees (apart from the privileged few) have had their pension benefits.
Does paying our agency colleague (in distribution ) actually create a safe and healthy environment, of course not people chasing bonuses will take risks and cut corners .
Does the Tesco USDAW partnership work cooperatively to benefit both parties , blatantly not , it (at the moment ) works only to satisfy the needs and desires of the company .
The fact that we have some Union reps more interested in taking selfies (at the exclusive national event) rather than protect the rights of their members speaks volumes for the culture with in the organisation.
@Arizonarugby
I totally agree with you, the company is build on lies and secrecy. If they told the truth about what was actually happening in the company, the shareholders would sell everything and run to the hills (as they should)and the share price would crash so hard the company would be unviable. It's all to sound happy and cheerful to appease the major shareholders, if the right words are being said then they are happy. Cuts are rebranded as efficency savings, range reductions as painted as focused lines for customers. Even down to the new 'Exceeding customer expectations everyday' which basically spits in the face of the operational side of the business. It's all lies, all talk, all a facade.
Let's wait and see what this rumoured 'Phase 3' brings in February.
Quote from: Duracell on 29-09-16, 05:59PM
If there is a true lack of detail and reasoning during any consultation period, regardless of its length, 30, 45 or 90 days, could it be deemed as insufficient to have such uncertainty and lack of information to a process that ultimately will affect over 100 employees. No they are not at a singular premises, but the ultimate roll out will be an approach which will be applied with a Collective group vision and objective.
The time frames and consultation we are seeing is in respect to a limited group, 30 days being 20 or less, yet the principle in approach is to realise an effect to several hundred staff on the basis of achieving a multi location objective.
So should it be 90 days for all, with clear information and reasoning for all?
I think the company is using the fact that its a pilot and will be rolled out to other DC's at a point. So at the moment only its only about 30 staff member's who will be made redundant but when they pick off all the DC's its going to roll into 100's made redundant.
So on that basis, outside of a "Pilot", when the company apply a structure change which on principle encompasses hundreds of staff over many locations. Are all those sites able to insist because of the nature and objective that the company actions, time frames and information meet their obligations laid down for the greater number affected by the change and objective overall rather than meeting the requirement for site specific numbers.
As I understand it the affected group outside of the pilot have been given notice of 90 day consultation, yet it would appear that the likelyhood is they will not know the actual detail relative to them very late in the 90 days probably even likely to be less that 30 days away before the effect happens, choices and detail are clear.
Would those concerned have a case to claim they haven't been fully consulted.
Surely the consultation period for other sites should not start until the realism of the pilot is known. So that during the consultation for the other sites the company can then meet their obligations in supplying the actual matter of fact detail that is required in the timely manner specified.
A consultation that specifies ifs and maybes doesn't meet the requirements and guidelines for the detail in a consultation period.
Totally agree with your post Equalizer87, whatever the top table are going to do now or in the future is never in a million years for the benefit of Tesco customers, this is the biggest shambles I have ever witnessed in all of my working life. Which may I add is in excess of 45 years. :( :( :(
Even though I have been with the company for over 20 years, the misguided management style is not the worse I have seen.
The company decision makers are seriously losing touch with the wealth of knowledge at their fingertips, they are simply not looking to or listening to experience they have, they are refusing that knowledge's reasoning of cause and effect.
We know the what's and why's, but even where we can make a difference we are faced with it not fitting in with their blinkered objectives.
How can you have a core purpose of serving Britons shoppers a little better everyday, when the Culture is generic which limits a reactions needs based approach.
How can individuals make a significant difference worthy of the effort when their opportunities to do so are seriously limited.
Quote from: mexicopete on 30-09-16, 07:40PM
Totally agree with your post Equalizer87, whatever the top table are going to do now or in the future is never in a million years for the benefit of Tesco customers, this is the biggest shambles I have ever witnessed in all of my working life. Which may I add is in excess of 45 years. :( :( :(
I will defer to your seasoned knowledge of the company. I myself only suffered 8 years of Tesco and can see everything wrong with it as veteran staff had concluded, in a shorter time frame. This shows how staff with two vastly different lengths of service can see the same problems, yet are ignored by idiots who probably can't move a roll cage without a confab.
@Durecell
We would never be listened to, we aren't lucky enough to have "Harvard Business School" stamped on our CV's like Drastic has.
@Equalizer87, I haven't worked for Tesco all of this time, but an array of cowboy outfits. Out of all of said outfits, Tesco is far and away the biggest Cowboy one lets just call it the Ponderosa.LOL. ;) ;) :D :D ;D ;D
@mexicopete
Tesco being the biggest cowboy outfit of all seems about right. If only we could have an undercover Panorama investigation about it all, would turn up a whole world of c**p.
Alas whilst I understand your sentiment. I can't help but feel that due to the size of the company and the wealth of untapped knowledge it has, because it is who it is, who we speak of, it compounds all concerns.
Because of the scope and size of the business it should have better facilities to cope with change and adversity. Yet it doesn't.
Why? Simply because the culture does not promote individual thought of application, the company in simple terms is to generic.
Yes the culture is the issue. But that's how they all think, it's almost like asking what Polmont cards someone has. If you have the right ones, you get to spout all the c**p you want.
So just one question, if the powers that be thinks it's possible to run an operation at peak time with less managers , then why are they asking for 10 managers to support a site during peak period !!!!!!!!!
So they are asking, the managers that are being made compulsory redundant to remain in the capacity that is being made redundant?
The redundancy process is clear in the company's obligation of detail, that they make clear during the consultation the business case.
Surely what you are saying, is contradicting of the detail.
It implies the business case is actually uncertain and even flawed.
They are saying
We have a plan.
We are giving you notice of that plan and intent.
Yet we can't apply the plan in the timeframe we intend because the business can't accomadate the plan.
If the business can't accomadate the plan then the business plan is seriously flawed.
To enter into a process which expects clear business needs and reasoning, with statutory timeframes, when it is known those time frames can't be met by the business need is actually quite outrageous.
If the business needs can't accept the change process and timeframes then the business need for the change is seriously flawed and should be in serious question.
I don't think there would be much scope for this reasoning to halt or reverse this decision.
What I would expect is the process not be delayed in its timeframe because the business can accomadate the plan.
You say 10 are being asked to stay and support because the business can't accomadate the process entered into.
If the 10 decline, what will happen? it seems from what you have said they are being asked not told.
If the operation seriously can't meet the plan at this time, and the 10 decline surely the process should can be questioned at least.
I hope Sata reps are all over this like a rash.
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 03-10-16, 09:45AM
So just one question, if the powers that be thinks it's possible to run an operation at peak time with less managers , then why are they asking for 10 managers to support a site during peak period !!!!!!!!!
You say 10 managers are being asked to help support a site during a peak period? Is this Hinkley or Lichfield. What managers are being asked? from what site?
Quote from: nolotil on 03-10-16, 11:12AM
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 03-10-16, 09:45AM
So just one question, if the powers that be thinks it's possible to run an operation at peak time with less managers , then why are they asking for 10 managers to support a site during peak period !!!!!!!!!
You say 10 managers are being asked to help support a site during a peak period? Is this Hinkley or Lichfield. What managers are being asked? from what site?
No it's not one of the "pilot" sites , but that irrelevant, "the partnership" have decided that depots can run with 50 % less managers , so then are they asking for support at this particular depot !!!!
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 03-10-16, 02:20PM
Quote from: nolotil on 03-10-16, 11:12AM
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 03-10-16, 09:45AM
So just one question, if the powers that be thinks it's possible to run an operation at peak time with less managers , then why are they asking for 10 managers to support a site during peak period !!!!!!!!!
You say 10 managers are being asked to help support a site during a peak period? Is this Hinkley or Lichfield. What managers are being asked? from what site?
No it's not one of the "pilot" sites , but that irrelevant, "the partnership" have decided that depots can run with 50 % less managers , so then are they asking for support at this particular depot !!!!
Its not irrelevant at all, sites will have clerks running the podiums at all sites. This thread is about redundancy
Duracell fancy being my rep for my one to one's?
I don't wish to sound callous or indifferent, but if you are an employee, and are let go, there's not much that you can do about it.
Night shift managers at my DC are stuck on podiums doing everything apart from actually 'Managing!'
They spend most of the night on the podiums reading the sports pages on MSN or on their phones checking Facebook! The shift managers spend more time out at the smoking zone than on the warehouse floor. But hopefully no more!
Clerks or warehouse staff could work the podiums and the managers that escape the axe can finally do the job they are highly paid to do...that is 'MANAGE' the distribution floor!!!
Hopefully the decent managers are retained to do this... :thumbup:
:'( Sadly I feel that any Team Managers with any Management talent at all will take the cash and run and we'll be left with the brown nosed urchins. Something to look forward to eh! :'(
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 03-10-16, 02:20PM
No it's not one of the "pilot" sites , but that irrelevant, "the partnership" have decided that depots can run with 50 % less managers , so then are they asking for support at this particular depot !!!!
So it's not one of the pilot sites, I assumed you had knowledge of either site or both.
Yet it isn't either.
The other sites apparently yet to be in consultation are going through xmas as normal with consultation periods starting after.
I am now lost in the point you are making.
Nobody within consultation is facing a delay because the business can't cope with it.
Other sites are yet to be in consultation until after the pilot has finished.
Where are have they started the process but asking those affected to remain in the business as you suggested earlier.
I thought it was outrageous. turns out now it's unbelievable too.
Quote from: nolotil on 03-10-16, 03:27PM
Duracell fancy being my rep for my one to one's?
.
I can't unfortunately, I haven't got the ability.
Even if I did, the invitation on here would make the oddness of it stand out.
my thoughts exactly snowy :( >:(
Quote from: Duracell on 03-10-16, 07:54PM
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 03-10-16, 02:20PM
No it's not one of the "pilot" sites , but that irrelevant, "the partnership" have decided that depots can run with 50 % less managers , so then are they asking for support at this particular depot !!!!
So it's not one of the pilot sites, I assumed you had knowledge of either site or both.
Yet it isn't either.
The other sites apparently yet to be in consultation are going through xmas as normal with consultation periods starting after.
I am now lost in the point you are making.
Nobody within consultation is facing a delay because the business can't cope with it.
Other sites are yet to be in consultation until after the pilot has finished.
Where are have they started the process but asking those affected to remain in the business as you suggested earlier.
I thought it was outrageous. turns out now it's unbelievable too.
Quote from: nolotil on 03-10-16, 03:27PM
Duracell fancy being my rep for my one to one's?
.
I can't unfortunately, I haven't got the ability.
Even if I did, the invitation on here would make the oddness of it stand out.
Duracell , the point I'm making is that you either can or you can't run a DC with less managers - the company and the union can't have both ways - in 6 months (maybe 12), there won't be enough managers (with any kind of experience ) to bail the company out.
All DC's would have (or should have ) received the same comms , regarding the support required, and the DC that requires it.
The cost of supporting this depot , week 37 - 42 with goods in, loaders, assemblers, and managers will cost a fortune, but then again closing this depot then having to reopen it again was another costly shorted decision by the partnership !!!!!!
What strikes me in all of this is that nobody really knows what's going on, what happened to "open and transparent" it's mainly speculation. We all think we know little bits, we all think we know what might happen but really we haven't got a clue. At a time when the company needs solid leadership and certainly needs its staff on board Drastic has managed to create an atmosphere of dread. Perhaps that's part of the plan to dishearten staff so they jump ship, although I think most will remain to see what they can get out of it first. On a serious note none of this is going to inspire anybody to work any harder or exhibit any loyalty to a company that is causing them sleepless nights. As an old gaffer of mine used to say "couldn't manage a f*cking tomato box"
No body seems to know what is going on, even those involved in it. How can you have a pilot project that keeps all managers on until after Christmas, so it appears to work? Lots of "yes" managers left though
Depots are falling now, so what will happen when it gets busy?, work will be moved to other depots? then thanks for the commitment but you are next to go.
Lets face it, this is spreading over all the network, so we have "over performing managers everywhere" trying to ensure they are the next one to go
When has this company not released redundant staff in the past? made them work the "lieu" time?
Union and the simple northern one?
Quote from: Billy Budd on 03-10-16, 06:06PM
Night shift managers at my DC are stuck on podiums doing everything apart from actually 'Managing!'
They spend most of the night on the podiums reading the sports pages on MSN or on their phones checking Facebook! The shift managers spend more time out at the smoking zone than on the warehouse floor. But hopefully no more!
Clerks or warehouse staff could work the podiums and the managers that escape the axe can finally do the job they are highly paid to do...that is 'MANAGE' the distribution floor!!!
Hopefully the decent managers are retained to do this... :thumbup:
Internet was taken away from managers many moons ago
From their own phones, wow that is truly amazing. The big T has come on leaps and bounds in technology, and it truly has the ability to stop mgrs from keeping their own tech from them !!!
Quote from: nolotil on 04-10-16, 09:36AM
Depots are falling now, so what will happen when it gets busy?, work will be moved to other depots? then thanks for the commitment but you are next to go.
I thought it already was busy .Our DC has had full OT since lat Christmas ,pre-shift,post shift ,full shift ,whenever you want .
Cannot get enough agency through the door . Management wise ,our shift consistently runs on 3 or 4 managers a night, even though there are 9 of them.
The company fail in my opinion at the people side of Managing.
I can see the logic in splitting the operational side of the role from the people side, to to target and focus with the people and raise the company's game in communication. It is a common well know failing the company has that is generally accepted.
The problem is, to remove half to replace them with the same number in newly created level one roles is a bitter pill to swallow.
You still have the same number of bodies doing the same amount of work which presents a cost cutting exercise.
The problem lies with the level of accountability in the New operation roles. The company can't expect these lower level roles to have the accountability that management had as when they do the operational side.
As we all know the salary drives the level of accountability, the newer roles can't be expected to exercise decision making and be accountable if things go wrong at Level one pay grade it just isn't right or fair.
The volumes and operation drive every decision made, how can you have level 1 pay grades affecting it, not to be accountable is wrong and to be accountable at that level for that pay grade is also wrong.
What is the performance management for these new grades going to look like?
I am not trying to play down the redundancy situation, but the company have to pay for operational accountability.
If people wish to take on such roles, then fine but to me that responsibility should not be at work level 1.
If we look at a manager role, we all understand some are stronger in the operational
side and are weaker at the people side and visa verse.
If the company embrace that, and don't remove roles but merely split and designated them to meet ability levels then surely that is better.
In team building exercises training advocates organising the team to meet the teams
Strengths whilst realising weakness, so split management to meet those strengths, put people skills with the people and put operational skills with the operation, keep people managing what they are good at whilst retaining pay grades across both managements styles that is a reflection of the accountability.
Operational Team Manager
People and Recources Team Manager.
Still all managers... Doing what they are good at.
Restructures don't have to be about reducing management.
Good leadership can be about exploiting strengths and not just cost cutting.
Very poor approach .
From what I understand clerks will run and manage the podiums ( at a slightly raised rate) whilst the remaining managers will manage the shop floor. As for accountability (measured work) I have no idea how this could be possibly achieved. 8-) 8-)
Pretty much going back to how the DCs were run in the 1980s and 1990s then . And ,the way the stores are changing ,they seem to be going back to the old srtuctures as well.
Back to the 1980's and 1990's isn't that when tosco had the reputation of being not a nice place to work, so the big chiefs decided to up the hourly rate make it the best in retailing give better benefits yearly pay rise including premiums, good shifts get rid of twilight fill over night, plenty of staff doing the job that they were interviewed and hired for. And let's not forget an explosion of senior management, mmm wonder what customers and potential employees will think of the company in 6 months. :'(
Quote from: snowyowl on 04-10-16, 07:26PM
From what I understand clerks will run and manage the podiums ( at a slightly raised rate) whilst the remaining managers will manage the shop floor. As for accountability (measured work) I have no idea how this could be possibly achieved. 8-) 8-)
I have heard the Term Team leaders being used, it may be down to individual opinions about choice of words.
However the point is you can't have the accountability for operational decisions at work level 1, it is simply to much accountability for that pay grade.
What happens if Goods in or loading go tits up in any given shift and chaos happens, it's simply not fair that a person, clerk or team leader what ever the title but more important work level 1 is held accountable for the chaos, if they are not accountable then that will in itself create its own chaos.
Operational organisation needs accountability that accountability can't come from work level 1s the pay grade does not warrent the accountability and responsibility.
Is this the plan we've all been waiting for, getting rid of team support??
Quote from: Duracell on 05-10-16, 12:16AM
Quote from: snowyowl on 04-10-16, 07:26PM
From what I understand clerks will run and manage the podiums ( at a slightly raised rate) whilst the remaining managers will manage the shop floor. As for accountability (measured work) I have no idea how this could be possibly achieved. 8-) 8-)
I have heard the Term Team leaders being used, it may be down to individual opinions about choice of words.
However the point is you can't have the accountability for operational decisions at work level 1, it is simply to much accountability for that pay grade.
What happens if Goods in or loading go tits up in any given shift and chaos happens, it's simply not fair that a person, clerk or team leader what ever the title but more important work level 1 is held accountable for the chaos, if they are not accountable then that will in itself create its own chaos.
Operational organisation needs accountability that accountability can't come from work level 1s the pay grade does not warrent the accountability and responsibility.
Team leaders isn't the job title, I believe its "Support Clerk". I think this role will be used as a route to "progress" within the company, even though now natural progression has basically ended.
Operational issues will now be sorted by these "want to be's", the kind that are are even worse that the worst manager currently. The type that will do, say or drop anyone it to make the progression to a "Bigger" role. Just my opinion.
Quote from: Doesnymatter on 05-10-16, 09:30AM
Is this the plan we've all been waiting for, getting rid of team support??
Team support? Please explain
Team support as in what the old front end team leaders are now known as
Quote from: Doesnymatter on 05-10-16, 11:14AM
Team support as in what the old front end team leaders are now known as
Never been team leaders in distribution?
Lets be honest in DC's Team Managers are really only Team Leaders as they certainly aren't allowed to manage anything >:( >:(
Distribution is not a very nice place to work at the best of times, it's a case of moving boxes as efficiently/cheaply as possible. Now the restructure is all the managers are talking about. Managers are trying to work out what the new job roles will look like and how they will work, but also keep thinking that the job will be the same, just with less managers, which is probably a very long way from being accurate. But when depots are quiet, and they have 2 managers stood on each podium not doing anything, with a total combined salary of at least 250k, it's easy to see why the company is looking at the re-structure.
Quote from: nolotil on 05-10-16, 11:39AM
Quote from: Doesnymatter on 05-10-16, 11:14AM
Team support as in what the old front end team leaders are now known as
Never been team leaders in distribution?
There have been, a while ago but there were Team leaders roles. Mid to late 90's.
As for Team support, distribution had something similar Ops Support.
And yes.
Quote from: nolotil on 05-10-16, 09:38AM
Quote from: Duracell on 05-10-16, 12:16AM
Quote from: snowyowl on 04-10-16, 07:26PM
From what I understand clerks will run and manage the podiums ( at a slightly raised rate) whilst the remaining managers will manage the shop floor. As for accountability (measured work) I have no idea how this could be possibly achieved. 8-) 8-)
I have heard the Term Team leaders being used, it may be down to individual opinions about choice of words.
However the point is you can't have the accountability for operational decisions at work level 1, it is simply to much accountability for that pay grade.
What happens if Goods in or loading go tits up in any given shift and chaos happens, it's simply not fair that a person, clerk or team leader what ever the title but more important work level 1 is held accountable for the chaos, if they are not accountable then that will in itself create its own chaos.
Operational organisation needs accountability that accountability can't come from work level 1s the pay grade does not warrent the accountability and responsibility.
Team leaders isn't the job title, I believe its "Support Clerk". I think this role will be used as a route to "progress" within the company, even though now natural progression has basically ended.
Operational issues will now be sorted by these "want to be's", the kind that are are even worse that the worst manager currently. The type that will do, say or drop anyone it to make the progression to a "Bigger" role. Just my opinion.
That's what ops support amounted to. They got rid of it for whatever reason they thought of, campaign to reduce unproductive hours I believe, hours not on the clock being timed.
If you read the press today regarding Tesco plans for the future, Dave Lewis quotes "This will be achieved through £1.5bn of further cost cutting" .
It's not hard to guess exactly what he means by this - more redundancies, a reduction hours / pay GA's , all tasks /hours that require a premium payment reduced /removed.
There is one thing for sure , if they could , the company would run distribution purely with agency staff - so everybody in distribution should be looking over their shoulders !!!!!
Or 3rd party running of distribution
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 05-10-16, 11:00PM
.............. There is one thing for sure , if they could , the company would run distribution purely with agency staff - so everybody in distribution should be looking over their shoulders !!!!!
Possibly ,but can they get enough agency staff in? The DC that I am at probably has the lowest % of agency staff compared to other DC s and over the last few months they are really struggling to get more agency staff in.
If someone offers them £1.00p per hour more, they are offski.
Quote from: picktocube on 06-10-16, 02:56PM
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 05-10-16, 11:00PM
.............. There is one thing for sure , if they could , the company would run distribution purely with agency staff - so everybody in distribution should be looking over their shoulders !!!!!
Possibly ,but can they get enough agency staff in? The DC that I am at probably has the lowest % of agency staff compared to other DC s and over the last few months they are really struggling to get more agency staff in.
No I am talking about a 3rd party taking over the whole of distribution, doesnt matter how many agency staff they can get in. If they have the whole contract it doesn't matter.
I can't see that happening either .Plenty of DCs have in the past been run by 3rd party operators ,but most came back in-house .
Some DCs have their transport run by 3rd party ,if this was totally successful then all of them would have been moved over by now .
Am i correct in thinking that if T***O were to reduce the numbers of WL1's in distribution through redundancies, that the agencies would have to be cut first? Surely it would be wrong to remove permanent staff in favour of retaining contractors?
Lichfield and Hinckley may be pilot schemes but with them actually cutting WL2's now it is inevitable that this pilot will be made to work in some shape or form. February is the end date for the scheme so the restructures throughout distribution will no doubt come in around this time after the 'successful' pilot.
The managers are starting to panic at our DC, they are trying to work out how many and who will be going, in my personal opinion there are only a few who are deserving of the word 'Manager' the rest have just been winging it and getting away with it for a long time. Its been a long time coming this restructure but as we've all seen what has happened in stores the last couple of years this was only a matter of time.
:'( I'm with Arizonarugby on this one I think Tosco would love to have a mainly agency staff for their DC's, think of the money it would save them. In saying that I think most DC's in their site agreement state that agency can be no more than about 30% of the workforce (i'm sure you'll let me know if I am wrong) So with that in mind I'm sure Usbore won't let them sneak that one in. :D
It's unlikely that you will see a reduction in warehouse numbers whilst agency hours increase, having said that if the workforce don't resist such an action, in terms of can they? That would be down to, the proposal, the reasoning, and the reception all of those required details would get.
Some DC's are Hiring full time staff so in terms of a generic plan to reduce full time warehouse numbers via redundancy very very unlikely, having said that a plan to reduce the Cost of full time staff could happen and the possibilities of what such a plan would look like ? How long is a piece of string?
A plan to reduce numbers in the warehouse... Not likely.
A plan to address multi tier pay in singular locations or across all sites ... The climate and company mentality suggests distribution in parts would be lucky if it didn't happen.
I'm sure if the DC I work at could get agency workers they would flood the place. The place has such a bad reputation (justified) they struggle to employ anybody. :'( :'( :'(
When the UK does eventually leave the EU, there won't be the freedom of movement policy.
Interesting to see how they find new staff when the brexit button is pushed.No more eastern Europeans to fill cheap labour roles.
This will depend on the brexit negotiation and how existing immigration status will be handled.
It definetly will impact on the ability to supply new staff, I don't think it will impact on those already resident in the Uk.
The only way current numbers will reduce is if those already working in the uk have apply to stay which then may involve a process where applicants are scrutinised which doesn't currently happen the EU free movement rules. Where applicants to stay could be checked, history may show a limited element that are undesirable, these applicants may be refused the opportunity to stay.
That scenario would be a lengthy, complex and expensive screening process which seems unlikely.
I agree I don't think how we brexit will impact on existing economic migrants (in no way racist, that's what they are) and I don't think that the Government will get involved in any expensive screening process. What I do feel lately at my place of work is that there is some form of change going on. The agency supplied staff we are getting don't appear to be staying long as there are new faces constantly. I don't know if these people are just acquiring the training and moving to pastures greener or simply don't want to work at Tosco. I have never witnessed a time when so many agency fail to attend. It is no doubt going to be an interesting couple of years.
Call me highly suspicious, but if the majority of the tesco distribution staff ended up being agency. Where, with regard to a successful outcome (for the Asda employees), would this leave any further similar claims for equal pay from tesco shop-floor staff?
To be honest, I couldn't give a flying f*** about Asda at the moment.
Also I don't understand the context of your post.
A majority of Distribution Staff as agency is not going to happen, impossible.
The only comparative for Distribution staff and shop floor staff currently.
Who they are employed by.
All have lost their handbooks as a point of reference, no longer valid... See WWW. Our....
Duracell "a majority of distribution staff as agency is not going to happen, impossible"
I wonder if you could explain this statement, do you have some insight into what Tosco's plans are? ???
No insight just common sense.
Even if you have a blinkered view that it's possible, take a look at the previous page in this thread, take into account how long it takes the company to action 1 structure change. Even if they wanted to.. The time frame required to tap the supply before the supply is cut, is impossible.
It's worth pointing out, even where Agency recruits non migrant workers they struggle heavily to retain them, common sense says they will not be able to get rid of 40% of the workforce and replace them with agency before the agency resource of labour is heavily depleted.
All this is assuming they have a wish to and they could take the negative impact and publicity.
It is factual that certain positions within some DC's have been taken from Tosco employee's and allocated on a permanent basis to agency, losing dozens of (non measured) Tosco employed full time positions. This is quickly eroding the gap between numbers of Tosco employed on a full time basis and agency. In recent times at the DC I work, it was suggested that there were more agency union members than there were Tosco union members. I believe that DC's will never be totally agency but it doesn't take a great stretch of the imagination to understand why Tesco would strive to have as many agency as they could. Financially it would be massive for them.
So why don't Waitrose and Aldi use 3rd party?
Maybe when they've had years of over stretching and mismanagement that has landed them in major financial trouble they will, all I was saying is it is happening to a degree and it would be of financial benefit to them. We have no insight into what their plans are as displayed by Duracell, it's only opinions. You know what they say about opinions, they are like ar*ehol*s, everybody's got one! >:(
Ok I'll correct my choice of words to something more Apt.
Agency majority in Distribution "Very Improbable" across all of Distribution but Impossible at the DC I work.
If you look at %'s, across most sites, 25-35% of warehouse staff are Agency, but as far as all staff all departments goes the % is less clear.. Probably 20-30% or less.
So for the agency to become a majority the company would have to manage AT LEAST 20% of full time staff out of the business and replace them with agency.
Very improbable.
Particularly as some are taking on full time staff.
With regards to the Depot I work it's difficult to get a definitive figure of what the % is, although I believe the site agreement states that agency should be no more than 30% (I'm sure that figure is being exceeded). In saying that both the new SYP and SYA policies being rolled out will clearly enable Tosco to manage as many people out of the business as they want. Just a thought, do you think that the cull of Management will stop with Management or will it then make it's way to the shop floor? :-\
With Regard to the Management "Restructure", it would be difficult to apply similar reasoning to a Multi Skilled warehouse roll, Unless they move away from Multi Skilling dedicated loaders, Flt, pickers etc, which would be an absolute nonsense foolish move.
Having said that, The new attendance policy for stores goes live on 18th.. Which excludes distribution, yet the new time off policy applies to All. The launch of the new absence policy for distribution is being put back. Which means they do view distribution as devision they have to treat differently, I say this because I wonder how long Distribution will sustain 100% premiums and double time O/T . It is that that will be the catalyst for distribution staff down the very slippery slope. One thing in distributions favour is we still have our right to need to agree to the changes. It can't be voted away by an elite few.
My worry is not Agency taking over, we will lose what we hold dear long before that happens. When you think about the proposed operational roles that will run operations for £20,000 per year anyone that takes on that role is going to take a pay cut, who is going to be interested in those roles for that money.
Considering what we see all around us in the network, they can't retain staff on new terms the turn over rate of staff is stupid.
The New Terms are not inspiring anyone to do extra, which is why I think the company are not tackling the More costly old T&C's.
The next thing I would expect to see, is some kind of reduction of cost to old T&C's, yet as I have suggested there is a reason why they are not tackling it, perhaps it is really difficult to achieve. More so than even I think.
We have to agree to whatever the change will be.
Different negotiating groups, means it can't be done like the current pilot is.
:-\ It is worrying,but we will just have to wait and see. If only we had a union or something to keep us all in the loop! :-\
now that is an excellent idea, do you think it will catch on (-*-)
One thing I am pretty certain of is USDAW N.O's know far more than the communicate, which makes it difficult for the genuine reps.
I couldn't agree with you more Duracell, it's for that precise reason "good reps" can't be as efficient and professional as they would like to be. And for me, withholding information only confirms to me that Usbore are closer to Tosco than they are to their members. >:D >:D
Duracell, as an 'insider' do you see this lack of communication as avoidable (being caused by the disinterest or bloody mindedness of AOs), Or do you think that it is part and parcel of the structure or administrative workings of the union and is something that is difficult to resolve.
"Insider" it's not the free masons!
To be fair to AO's they are not kept in the loop as much as they should be either.
With regard to the consultative process that's more N.O related as far as I see it, AO forward info, but they can't forward what they don't receive themselves.
the 'insider' bit was a bit tongue in cheek I must admit. ;)
But, anyway, any names of NOs, maybe our attention should be focused on these guys. It seems that they have avoided most of the attention (I rarely hear of them on this site for example). I take it that these NOs are also un-elected and extremely well paid?
Last I knew , Pauline Foulkes and Joanne McGuinness were NOs . They might have changed though.
Are they elected?
What is their pay?
What are they paid for?
How big is their effective influence on tesco policy and changes to contractual terms.
Maybe some of our disgust should be shared with them as they seem to be getting a free ride in all of this, so far.
Maybe we need a comprehensive list of their names and contact details?
Quote from: picktocube on 17-10-16, 02:00PM
Last I knew , Pauline Foulkes and Joanne McGuinness were NOs . They might have changed though.
Former is Now retail.
Later is Distribution.
I think both are recruited as a job role and not elected.
What is their pay? Probably too much.
Their accountability for consultative changes. Far less than it should be.
Contact details should be available via USDAW website. At least email.
I don't really understand why it's important to know who's who within the Usbore hierarchy, I don't think harassing them will do any good at all and would be a waste of anybodies time.
It's clear to me that you only have to look at the catalogue of deliberate "errors" they have been part of over the years and surely it tells you that you "the member" are of no great interest to them. They are playing in a bigger game.
Isn't this latest fiasco with the reduction of premiums simply down to them making decisions without consulting the members. Is there any other Union that has ever agreed to negatively change workers terms and conditions without consulting the workforce? I'll wager somewhere along the line some genuinely goodhearted union representative fought long and hard to get them terms and conditions agreed. >:D >:D >:D
Rumour is Express Management restructure in store away to be announced this week.
Conference calls for express SM's only no deputy or team leaders allowed on said call taking place across express this week, and I have no idea what the calls are regarding but makes one wonder if its some sort of restructure being announced as I've also been aware of a few rumours going around.
Apparently going to 3 shift/team leaders and store manager.
They cant find enough as it is,never mind 2 years plus down the line..
Over 1000 agency been and gone in less than a year at Livingston Depot.
The calibre of Agency we are attracting now is also way down on previous years....
Ffs some of them cant pick toilet roll on a level base never mind 6 cage multi express orders thru the warehouse...
So i cant see Agency taking over in the near future..
Heard rumours that the 2 sites that are piloting the new management restructure has now been upped to 4 sites?
Is there anyone on here from Hinkley or Lichfield who can give us numbers of managers on site/shift, before and during the pilot?
Hi guys , does anyone know the names of those 36 pilot convenience stores in which the new 3.5 shift leader plan is being applied ?
Don't know why there calling it pilot when we know it will be rolled out from week 1.
Kingsley park in northampton is one convenience that is going to the new structure trial and successful or not it is not reverting back
That's because it's not a trial, Tesco do not trial anything. They have an idea (number one priority to save money over increasing effectiveness), put it into a few stores, iron out the major problems (if they can be bothered to) and roll it out. They can't afford trials that may fail and lose money so they just stick with it.
Any stores within London which are amongst those 36 stores ?
Quote from: tornadotommy on 19-10-16, 04:21PM
Heard rumours that the 2 sites that are piloting the new management restructure has now been upped to 4 sites?
Is there anyone on here from Hinkley or Lichfield who can give us numbers of managers on site/shift, before and during the pilot?
Hi. 22 managers (roughly 7 or 8 a shift) were culled from Lichfield and replaced with "podium monkeys" that have had about a week's worth training to run the warehouse systems and operations. It's nothing but a cost cutting exercise due to reducing the cost from £20/hr to roughly £9/hr. How bad the remaining managers and their inflated egos will be remains to be seen. The 22 officially leave (or are reassigned) tomorrow.
I can't give you an exact number of managers per shift but I'd guess there is now less than 5 warehouse floor managers a shift, below the shift manager.
Thank you kind sir.
Nice to actually see numbers of what it could look like, we're currently running at 10 per shift, but often only run with 5 with absence and hols etc, so looks like this could be similar.
Love the name 'podium monkeys'.
from one set of "podium monkeys" too another set of "podium monkeys" you couldn't make this stuff up..next you will have out sourced cleaning companies doing accuracy checks on assembly (-*-)
Well bet at Middlesbrough you can guess who will be podium monkeys, it won't be the poor buggers who jobs depend on a competent person in charge. Hope girlfriend , AD, get bullet think staff should get to choose who goes payback for past actions :D :D :D :D :D
Quote from: Sarcinarous on 03-11-16, 04:42PM
Quote from: tornadotommy on 19-10-16, 04:21PM
Heard rumours that the 2 sites that are piloting the new management restructure has now been upped to 4 sites?
Is there anyone on here from Hinkley or Lichfield who can give us numbers of managers on site/shift, before and during the pilot?
Hi. 22 managers (roughly 7 or 8 a shift) were culled from Lichfield and replaced with "podium monkeys" that have had about a week's worth training to run the warehouse systems and operations. It's nothing but a cost cutting exercise due to reducing the cost from £20/hr to roughly £9/hr. How bad the remaining managers and their inflated egos will be remains to be seen. The 22 officially leave (or are reassigned) tomorrow.
I can't give you an exact number of managers per shift but I'd guess there is now less than 5 warehouse floor managers a shift, below the shift manager.
don't like to see anybody loose there job even this lot. But tosco have to many people in theses roles which in reality is a charge hand team leader role at best.
I presume the new podium monkey's get no more money than normal.
Good look to the managers who are leaving. You know you will never get easier money than this.
Quote from: tiptop on 04-11-16, 11:45AM
from one set of "podium monkeys" too another set of "podium monkeys" you couldn't make this stuff up..next you will have out sourced cleaning companies doing accuracy checks on assembly (-*-)
God forbid something like that would ever happen to accuracy! Oh wait, hang on a minute ... :D
Perhaps the title 'Podium Champion' would help the new monkeys believe they have a purpose? And will said 'Champions' be allowed the same amount of coffee and fag breaks that seem to be allowed for the current monkeys?
I've always believed a manager should first and foremost 'manage' which many seem incapable of doing. There are however a few good eggs on each shift and hopefully they will be the ones who stay.
I presume both tornadotommy and tiptop are from Teesport and that the cleaning company have been given the jobs on accuracy checks? Was there any training involved or where they just transferred straight from the brush to the cages? How on Earth did anybody dream that move up? What other tasks have they been given?, perhaps they'll get the jobs as "podium monkeys"
On a more serious notes more Tosco full time jobs given away, I think it's time we all joined a Union! >:(
At the DC that I am at ,it is the same with the accuracy checkers employed by the same company that cleans and dekits. They were employed specifically to accuracy check.
Unfortunately over the years more and more jobs have been farmed out to outside companies or agency .
Accuracy checking was originally part of GI checkers duty.
Nearly all unmeasured work at my DC has gone now apart from clerical and mmt and 50% transport.
:) It won't be long before David Attenbrough is brought down to study Tosco workers as an endangered species! You've got to wonder? :)
Quote from: ScotlandMRT on 04-11-16, 07:15PM
Snowy owl Dave will not find any management that's for sure.
They have all been caught out doing nothing.
So the reality is ScotlandMRT, that people in distribution are now losing jobs and lets not forget that store staff have lost jobs, premium etc, so coming to distribution.................
>:( It's not news nolotil! >:(
We are all under threat got numpties in charge aided and abetted my the Manchester Mafia a.k.a Usdaw , when the £100m law suit is won Tesco will make BHS look a success. Big gaffers will swan off in their yachts and we will be left with not even a pot to pee in.
[gmod] Quote removed. Do not quote the last post in a thread.[/gmod]
ScolandMRT you are a very bitter employee or a company monkey. I think you are a company person looking at your posts....
Personal attacks around weight etc are out of order, you should be ashamed and this site allowing such threads, should be ashamed.........
Quote from: nolotil on 04-11-16, 08:29PM
Quote from: ScotlandMRT on 04-11-16, 07:15PM
Snowy owl Dave will not find any management that's for sure.
They have all been caught out doing nothing.
So the reality is ScotlandMRT, that people in distribution are now losing jobs and lets not forget that store staff have lost jobs, premium etc, so coming to distribution.................
Didn't Dave Lewis say he wants to reduce distribution costs by a billion or something to that effect? Where do you think that money will be saved? I guarantee it's our wages he's talking about. He might need to be careful due to Brexit but if we stay with free flow immigration I reckon they'll force new contracts on us maybe in a few years or less. (i.e make warehouse employees redundant and give us the ability to apply for "new jobs")
What will happen is that they'll give us a tiny bump in basic salary and remove all premium pay except night shift bonus. All weekend premiums will go, bank holiday and overtime will go or probably reduced to .25%. All protected pay will go.
Sarcinarous.
"What will happen is that they'll give us a tiny bump in basic salary and remove all premium pay except night shift bonus. All weekend premiums will go, bank holiday and overtime will go or probably reduced to .25%. All protected pay will go."
Simple we don't let him! Firstly lick this so called Union into shape, get them doing what they should be doing "PROTECTING OUR RIGHTS" If they are not up to it replace them with one who will. Along side that fight every change they wish to make, collectively protect every contract that was ever written. Let's start using the powers that we still have left before they are eroded.
Sooner or later court costs and closed shop will help clear their minds. >:( >:( >:(
So the numbers made redundant
PMS from both sites redundant
H&S managers gone from both sites
OPS managers roled into one role a finance manager
Fout TM s from each shift redundant going from 10 to 6.
2 Transport managers redundant one days one nights.
18 new employed warehouse tits employed to do the job of board man;goods in and goods out but looks like that wont be enough and more likely needed.
Also these jobs were offered on lesser ts and cs with no uptake so hadto offer on original ts and cs.
Also original 4 shift managers reduced to 3
Project leader walked in depot took 2 shift managers to hotel asked who should stay and who should go and the 2.shiftys dutifully obliged.
Absolutley disgracefull behaviour.
Just to support this info no matter how many tms youre depot has it.will be cut to 6 a shift lichfield lost 23 managers thru redundancy to hit.the 6 on each shift.
Nxt phase i believe to be old big earning contracts in warehouse who are on 25k plus a year for pickin boxes.
Just to add pilon was granted last thurs and all left theyre jobs so no support for xmas.pilot starts officially 2day
Strange really as a few years ago at our DC ,they increased the amount of TMs to 10 a shift and took away warehouse ops booked off roles of boardman on goods-in ,goods-out.and now they are going back to it effectively. Plus everything ran better when it was a booked off role rather than a mmt duty.
:'( Incredible information Tasha66, what a cull, now we know what's coming our way. Although I won't lose sleep over all those losing their jobs, at this time of year my thoughts are with most. What a heartless sh*te company we all work for. Incidentally were where the Union when all this was going on? >:(
I didn't think that the union would have much say in a management restructure.
the union just agree with whatever tosco want!!!!
Sata union involved pretty much what picktocube said no real rights on negotiating it was done thro ernie empathy etc etc.
It was compulsory redundancy with no choices given.
However i dont think the effecred colleagues are takin this lying down theres a few challenging hard with possible tribunals going forward.
Job redundant not.the person but replacing with colleagues on less money.
One big money saving blag in my opinion.
Every depot getting this.its no pilot its happening else how can ya make people redundant.what ya gonna do reemploy the redundant if it doesnt work.dont make me laff.
North director has also said if it doesnt work ill strip volume out.
What an horrible company this is.sooner out the better i dont wanna work for this s*** any longer
Tasha, can you explain what you mean by the term 'board man'? I've never heard this term before, does this mean that these fellows will be running the operational side of goods in/out etc rather than the managers? at massively reduced wages of course!
yup
Quote from: picktocube on 07-11-16, 03:52PM
I didn't think that the union would have much say in a management restructure.
Even if the Union are tied with regards to the outcome they should be all over the affected members offering support,information and advice. After reading tasha66's post;
Quote from: tasha66 on 07-11-16, 06:09PM
However i dont think the effecred colleagues are takin this lying down theres a few challenging hard with possible tribunals going forward.
Job redundant not.the person but replacing with colleagues on less money.
Perhaps there was good reason for Usbore to be more active! >:( >:( >:(
Quote from: tasha66 on 07-11-16, 02:55PM
.......... Nxt phase i believe to be old big earning contracts in warehouse who are on 25k plus a year for pickin boxes.
Just to add pilon was granted last thurs and all left theyre jobs so no support for xmas.pilot starts officially 2day
Any further information on this ?? Is this speculation or was this discussed ? This would affect a couple of DCs where everybody is earning well in excess of £25k
Quote from: snowyowl on 07-11-16, 07:22AM
Sarcinarous.
"What will happen is that they'll give us a tiny bump in basic salary and remove all premium pay except night shift bonus. All weekend premiums will go, bank holiday and overtime will go or probably reduced to .25%. All protected pay will go."
Simple we don't let him! Firstly lick this so called Union into shape, get them doing what they should be doing "PROTECTING OUR RIGHTS" If they are not up to it replace them with one who will. Along side that fight every change they wish to make, collectively protect every contract that was ever written. Let's start using the powers that we still have left before they are eroded.
Sooner or later court costs and closed shop will help clear their minds. >:( >:( >:(
Snowyowl where the hell have you been for the last 7 years, this is exactly what had been happening in distribution, most depots now have a two tier pay and performance structure and if we're honest if Tesco was still successful all the old DC's would have been a distant memory AKA Chepstow , Middleton Harlow etc.
If Useless Seven Days A Week had any back bone none of this would be happening
So in fitting with this time of year "HE'S BEHIND YOU"
But let's face the facts, TOSCO isn't in the mess it's in because of work level 1 and work level 2 pay (at its height the company still managed to make billions is pound profit whilst paying decent wages ) , its in a mess because the desk jockeys made the wrong decisions and got rewarded generously for it then jumped ship
They don't think at all about how people pay their bills.
Good luck telling the Livingston staff on £25k who drive counter balance, LT's, etc, that
their wages could be cut!? Yes, Tenko don't make billions...it's now hundreds of millions,
not exactly scrimping, are they?!? Surely a tribunal would rule against fat cat Dave and his equally fat cat directors?! >:(
Arizonarugby;
Snowyowl where the hell have you been for the last 7 years, this is exactly what had been happening in distribution, most depots now have a two tier pay and performance structure and if we're honest if Tesco was still successful all the old DC's would have been a distant memory AKA Chepstow , Middleton Harlow etc.
If Useless Seven Days A Week had any back bone none of this would be happening
So in fitting with this time of year "HE'S BEHIND YOU"
But let's face the facts, TOSCO isn't in the mess it's in because of work level 1 and work level 2 pay (at its height the company still managed to make billions is pound profit whilst paying decent wages ) , its in a mess because the desk jockeys made the wrong decisions and got rewarded generously for it then jumped ship
Not sure I understand your point Arizona, if it's that you have had past successes in protecting your members rights that's great, but Usbore are still in place and Tosco continue to erode hours, wages and terms and conditions. My point was simply that we don't just stand and watch them do it. I certainly won't be. ;)
With regard to The posts of Tasha, are The decision makers aware that the Screening process "ERIC" for selecting managers is being monitored and scrutinised.
I believe I am right in saying there was concern that Performance RAG's had be changed.. Which sparked complaints which then led to Directors promising to investigate and scrutinise the screening process.
'ERIC' the process "already in place for some time" for the purpose of evaluating Personal ability is what I mentioned in earlier posts.
I stand corrected on believing it would actually be fair. It's seems the complete mayhem still continues even with the threat of scrutiny from the top.
@ Duracell
Erric or cerri as it's correctly referenced is a 5 part performance review which all levels apart from 1 are contractually measured or should be. It's the should be that is being questioned and the fairness of the application.
That said this contractually application is only a measure where there is a level score.
Quote from: Billy Budd on 08-11-16, 12:09AM
Good luck telling the Livingston staff on £25k who drive counter balance, LT's, etc, that
their wages could be cut!? Yes, Tenko don't make billions...it's now hundreds of millions,
not exactly scrimping, are they?!? Surely a tribunal would rule against fat cat Dave and his equally fat cat directors?! >:(
It's simple really. They'll make the position redundant and allow them to reapply for the same job under a new title at a reduced rate or give redundancy. They don't need to renegotiate a new contract.
Quote from: valleyboy on 08-11-16, 11:14AM
@ Duracell
Erric or cerri as it's correctly referenced is a 5 part performance review which all levels apart from 1 are contractually measured or should be. It's the should be that is being questioned and the fairness of the application.
That said this contractually application is only a measure where there is a level score.
So it is being formally Questioned, I was also informed that Previous RAG's had been changed at the pilot locations in an aid to protect under performers which was being investigated.
Not sure about Cerri being the correct reference as I am aware of them being very specific in direction at the time of implementation that E was the First Measure, very specific in conception and role out it was ERRIC, perhaps the CERRI you refer to comes from the preference of the application of Priority of Quality.
Quote from: Sarcinarous on 08-11-16, 06:16PM
Quote from: Billy Budd on 08-11-16, 12:09AM
Good luck telling the Livingston staff on £25k who drive counter balance, LT's, etc, that
their wages could be cut!? Yes, Tenko don't make billions...it's now hundreds of millions,
not exactly scrimping, are they?!? Surely a tribunal would rule against fat cat Dave and his equally fat cat directors?! >:(
It's simple really. They'll make the position redundant and allow them to reapply for the same job under a new title at a reduced rate or give redundancy. They don't need to renegotiate a new contract.
Not so sure that is possible, I have always believed that a redundancy situation could be applied to "A Contract" however after much research I find little to suggest the practice and belief is credible.
It seems that A redundancy situation is reliant on, restructer of role to be significantly different, a reduction in required numbers or both.
With regard to compulsory redundancy where retained employment changes the remaining contract, this couldn't be done via a reduction in numbers business case.
A reduction in numbers business case couldn't involve compulsory redundancy where Regular Agency Are used for the same role. This could throw up business case where staff rotas need to be more flexible to irradicate the need to use a more flexible form of labour.
Restructure of the Warehouse role, could this be done?
Without the role going backward and the devolution of multiskilled warehouse staff how could they restructucture the role, how could the role be significantly changed so that the current role as we know it is redundant.
Contract Change is more likely to come via negotiation which at present requires the agreement of the members for implementation a change to contracts can't be done on your behalf.
Duracell cerri is the term used in retail as the abbreviation for the leadership skills. As erric is the term used in distribution.
@ pictocube " the union wouldn't have much of a say in a restructure" I think different if sata organised itself and said all for one..... will that happen no! Why?
OK off topic and I'm probably displaying total ignorance of sata here and it's affiliations but should it show signs of growing a pair - what's to stop the rest of us joining. It's nothing other unions haven't done and more importantly its recognised by tosco. All for one could actually stand for something constructive
You do know that SATA is part of USDAW ???
tescopleb
Easy mistake if you haven't encountered them before? SATA is the managers part of USDAW. They are managers themselves and rep the managers in meetings. :)
Quote from: valleyboy on 09-11-16, 11:10AM
@ pictocube " the union wouldn't have much of a say in a restructure" I think different if sata organised itself and said all for one..... will that happen no! Why?
Yes ,I agree ,but from what I had heard ,the union were there for more of a consultative role rather than to negotiate . Similar to how the Pensions were done .
Thanks guys I knew it was the managers union but wasn't sure how tied to Useless it was. to be honest I was thinking along the lines of pcs which was the result of a merger.
:'( Sata representatives, (when there is a crisis) are harder to find that Usbore reps. They should be all over the members affected, these pages are full of enquiries,what?, when? why? when in reality these Union representative should from start to finish be guiding their members through every step. They don't give a sh*te, if you are facing redundancy your going to be off their books soon so why bother, just another £10 a month loss, never mind lets do some more recruiting. B*st*rds! >:( >:( >:(
Management Restructure, TOSCO S EXCUSE FOR GETTING RID OF expensive, OLD CONTRACTS.
Nightshift closure, TOSCO S EXCUSE FOR GETTING RID OF, expensive, OLD CONTRACTS.
Attendance Review Process, TOSCO S EXCUSE FOR GETTING RID OF YOU!!!!!
BEWARE
, NO ONE ON AN OLD CONTRACT ISCSAFE, THEY ARE COMING TO GET YOU, !!
DONT BE FOOLED BY THE REDUCED HOURS OPTION, YOU WILL BE EXTERMINATED EVENTUALLY.!!!
TAKE REDUNDANCY, TAKE THE MONEY AND RUN, THEY ARE LOSERS, GOING DOWN THE PAN,
SOON TO BE TAKEN OVER BY ALDI..........watch this space.
:'( The previous post on this subject was on 10/11/16 and I sort of remember agreeing with sinderella, well sadly he was right to a point and as predicted it's starting to spread. The Depot I work, the tm's have been notified of numbers and options and I believe are just waiting for consultations to begin. What a lovely Christmas present. :'(
What site are you in , on a recent conference call our leader(DAVE)stated no one else would be affected before new year.?
Quote from: whiterabbit on 05-12-16, 12:05PM
What site are you in , on a recent conference call our leader(DAVE)stated no one else would be affected before new year.?
whiterabbit this suggests that after the new year will be a different story.
Do you know if all cuts to be made to a store generally happen at one time.
Do they just focus on a department or a few at a time?
Quote from: snowyowl on 01-12-16, 08:03PM
:'( The previous post on this subject was on 10/11/16 and I sort of remember agreeing with sinderella, well sadly he was right to a point and as predicted it's starting to spread. The Depot I work, the tm's have been notified of numbers and options and I believe are just waiting for consultations to begin. What a lovely Christmas present. :'(
Hi, may I ask which site this is please?
Quote from: I wish i knew why on 05-12-16, 09:45PM
Quote from: snowyowl on 01-12-16, 08:03PM
:'( The previous post on this subject was on 10/11/16 and I sort of remember agreeing with sinderella, well sadly he was right to a point and as predicted it's starting to spread. The Depot I work, the tm's have been notified of numbers and options and I believe are just waiting for consultations to begin. What a lovely Christmas present. :'(
Hi, may I ask which site this is please?
This has happened at Livingston :(
Talk in Belfast and Antrim is that the cull starts after the new year. Time will tell.
Quote from: Billy Budd on 06-12-16, 12:45AM
Quote from: I wish i knew why on 05-12-16, 09:45PM
Quote from: snowyowl on 01-12-16, 08:03PM
:'( The previous post on this subject was on 10/11/16 and I sort of remember agreeing with sinderella, well sadly he was right to a point and as predicted it's starting to spread. The Depot I work, the tm's have been notified of numbers and options and I believe are just waiting for consultations to begin. What a lovely Christmas present. :'(
Hi, may I ask which site this is please?
This has happened at Livingston :(
What predictions have been correct?
What numbers and options have the TMs been notified of?
If the Livingston depot is hit it looks as if my store will have a few late deliveries. :thumbdown:
Everything has gone quite on this topic, but the death knell is tolling and Dave Leis and his cronies are wearing the "black cap" as they pass sentence .......
Has the pilot been successful, what were the benefits / pitfalls, guess we will never know , because the Tesco / USDAW PR machine will go in to full flow proclaiming the trial a resounding success ....
All we ask for is the OPEN HONEST and TRANSPARENT policies and procedures and ADULT CONVERSATIONS that we have been promised since Dave Lewis's appointment..... but I won't hold my breathe !!!!!!!!
A pilot in Tesco isn't a pilot or a study. It's a directive where they are being told make this work for this amount of funding they are willing to throw at it.
The sad facts are those that steered the ship on to the rocks were the first to man the life boats and left the sinking ship with all they could plunder, and those left have been left bail out the sinking sink , with leaky buckets
even sadder is that the company is beset by bounty hunters crawling over the wreckage and claim salvage rights on anything of value left ......
Very true, Arizonarugby.
But the current direction of things isn't shaping things up any better. Operationally, a lot of the stores where I live are suffering, lack of staff coverage, shelves not filled, equipment being worked to destruction, the list goes on.
It's a a ticking time bomb just waiting to go off.
We all know there are too many managers on the shop floor. Same amount of work is completed if 1 or 30. Probably would get same amount of work done if there was a 1 SL on a reduced rate replacing the DM too.
If all the night team which is meant to be over hours was moved onto day shift they would need to spend more on storage space as same work would not get done.
The directors are not interested in anything other than fulfilling a mandate they have set to ensure they get there next 20-30 million at the least. They will pretend they are looking closely at each store but what they are really doing is ripping the fking arse out of it as when all is done they will be on the Options. With all the money they have already how can they sleep at night burning people who earn £7-£10 per hour and have arthritis for their efforts.
Why anybody from nights would take a day job I do not know to potentially go through all this again.
The only Pilots at Ts are Kamikaze.
JL
'The only Pilots at Ts are Kamikaze.'
;D ;D ;D ;D ;D nail on head.
The clock is ticking at the Depot I work, it's obvious that the TM's have been informed of what is about to happen but they are saying very little. There is understandably a horrible atmosphere at work and I have heard the odd comment "why should I give a sh*te, I might not be here in three weeks" amongst other little slip ups. What a nasty position to be put in. Don't get me wrong I will be happy to see some of these arrogant misfits go but I think because of the way Tosco have handled this situation they will never be forgiven. >:D
How are the podium monkeys going. Clear at my depot the tm are aware it's coming soon. Will never get can't put earn easier money.
Well hear you can be a podium monkey for £5/ wk more than an ordinary pleb.the ordinary members of staff think that we should get a big brother type vote for who goes from the managers a chance of pay back for all the c**p we have had to put up with.
Quote from: snowyowl on 05-01-17, 09:35AM
The clock is ticking at the Depot I work, it's obvious that the TM's have been informed of what is about to happen but they are saying very little. There is understandably a horrible atmosphere at work and I have heard the odd comment "why should I give a sh*te, I might not be here in three weeks" amongst other little slip ups. What a nasty position to be put in. Don't get me wrong I will be happy to see some of these arrogant misfits go but I think because of the way Tosco have handled this situation they will never be forgiven. >:D
The clock is certainly ticking, but the TM's haven't been informed of anything yet, the announcement is going to be made today 9/1/17.
This is again a prime example of how Tesco treat their people ..... you promised us the earth on People's Roadshow ... shared you vision and got on bus the bus only to find the destination had changed for utopia to oblivion....
[gmod] edited to remove name of an individual[/gmod]
Genuinely, good luck today Arizonarugby, I understand the next step is that you find out if you're on the "at risk list" Not definitively whether you are going or not, just if you are "at risk" or not.
It's not enough that in the recent past, they have told you that TM's will be going, they now intend to torture you further by informing you if you are or are not on an "at risk list"
I find it difficult to imagine a more moral destroying, humiliating, embarrassing way to treat staff. They have already ruined your Christmas and now they are happy to ruin your New Year.
The people responsible for this need some education in humility, they are a disgrace. Lastly where are the Union, I know there is little they can do but they should be all over these sites supporting their members to the end. Conspicuous by their absence again, again disgraceful. >:( >:( >:(
Well had the brief and still no wiser to what's happening other than "30 days consultation starts on Friday 13/1/17 .... all we ask is for honesty, but that yet again is in short supply... in the words of MD thank you for delivering a brilliant Christmas for our customers now @@@@ off >:( >:( >:(
Arizonarugby
So all that was said about the management restructure at the depot is consultations would start for them on the 13 January?
What happened to the 45 day consultation?
If there are less than 100 redundancies then only 30 days consultation is required.
That's Livi started handing out the 30 days notification letters, I knew something was up when you see the GM hurrying in at 6am in the morning.
Happy New Year my Ar😡E
Pickbycube
The 30 day 45 day argument is irrelevant, because there certainly won't be any consultation taking place, we will be given the numbers and told to go and make them work ... ST and the simple one should be hanging their heads in shame. They sold a vision of the "people first" policy at Tesco and them sold us all down the river.... Tesco not a great place to work..... and for those of your lording over other people's misfortunes all I can say is watch your backs
I don't think its time to Lord it over anyone at this time, the managers are being treated like s**t around this, & don't for 1 min think that it wont come to most of us in some way in the near future & you will be treated no different... You may have views on managers but they have family's homes etc just the same as you & I wouldn't wish this treatment on anyone...
Chesterfield dc to close.
Is that correct? If it is, they're not hanging about are they :( How many jobs would that entail ?
Welham green to close
A message from Matt
QuoteOver the past couple of years we have been taking steps to transform our business and set up Tesco for the future. As the retail sector and the needs of our customers change, it's vital we make sure every part of our business is set up in a way that best serves our customers.
Making sure food and other products are delivered to our stores on time is a key part of this, and so today we are announcing some changes to our distribution operation which will help us run that part of our business more simply.
As part of these changes, we are proposing:
To close our Welham Green Distribution Centre and move its grocery operations to our Reading site.
To close our Chesterfield Distribution Centre and bring the majority of general merchandising into one site at Middlesbrough.
To withdraw from the shared hanging garments distribution centre in Daventry which is currently operated by third party DHL. Its clothing operations will move to nearby Tesco Daventry Distribution Centre.
To bring all our warehouse operations that are currently carried out by DHL and Wincanton in house.
To simplify our management structure across all distribution centres.
These changes are about improving the way we operate and ensuring the best use of our existing sites, as well as removing unnecessary complexity from our current distribution operation.
We have been speaking to colleagues from all sites about what these changes will mean for them, and we will continue to do all we can to support them at this time.
Matt Davies
CEO UK & ROI
Re the last paragraph, Snodland were informed at 15.00 hours today. Not much talking there then.
"These changes are about improving the way we operate and ensuring the best use of our existing sites, as well as removing unnecessary complexity from our current distribution operation"
So let's remove all the bulls@@t from the above statement from MD... this basically means running the operation for less money and getting us all to work harder for our crust of bread...
No doubt come the end of the very MD and DL and their cronies will have nice big bonus cheques ..... let's not forget that this year DL got the equivalent of a 12% pay rise will telling us the company couldn't afford more than 1.5% - talk about lining your own pockets ....
So that's the stores been messed with ,now the distribution ,what next.
It's not over for any part of Tesco, stores or distribution.
Convenience next ,,,
Quote from: tasha66 on 09-01-17, 04:53PM
Welham green to close
Yep ,got my phonecall this afternoon......freedom :)
Picktocube
You got your redundancy call then??
Oh yes countdown starts now ,have to wait til June.
Plenty of time to pick a holiday then ;D
Best wishes Picktocube, how are you going to contain yourself for five and a half months?
If depots are losing 50% of their managers would it be wrong to assume that this will also be applied to large superstores and extras in the not to distant future.
Quote from: dilligaf on 09-01-17, 03:42PM
I don't think its time to Lord it over anyone at this time, the managers are being treated like s**t around this, & don't for 1 min think that it wont come to most of us in some way in the near future & you will be treated no different... You may have views on managers but they have family's homes etc just the same as you & I wouldn't wish this treatment on anyone...
I'm sorry to say, but I feel NOTHING for the team managers at my Depot, especially my shift manager!!! These past couple of weeks, our managers have walked about in groups sniping and ignorant, their anger mostly fuelled towards agency and Occupation health workers...Its been nothing short of disgraceful! Perhaps a couple I could mabey show positive regard, but they have showed virtually No grace or empathy towards the guys on the shop floor!
Good bye and good riddance!!! :thumbdown:
Drastic is aping the German model to ensure his survival. multi-layered management at store level will be stripped out to mirror those he sees as competition. the 'heirarchy system' in store will be decimated in my view.
Customers will walk into stores with an android device, scan their goods, walk out without needing to 'checkout' and get billed accordingly. How many store management types will you need?
Their app will advise them the item they are purchasing is short-dated so it's up to them to proceed with the purchase (non-refundable. Any complaints will be dealt with central intelligence at the Distribution Points.
Shopping will become a purely functional operation.
Aldi/Lidl model of running stores is exactly What Tesco are wanting, they are making solid profits margins on a far smaller structure compared to the big four. Tesco will try to create a bigger profit margins using this structure.
Tesco current structure is not pushing the margins they want, hence the cost savings exercises to make all seem as if it's working.
Even the statement about the DC job losses was described by Matt the tw*t as " simplifying our distribution", paint a pretty picture and hope the markets like it, that's all they are doing.
Let's face it Tesco is not Aldi or Lidl and not natter
how much spin DL and MD put on it , the operation of the "big four" is far more complex than the discounters.
Firstly , there's the product range 5000+ compared with less than 500 .
Secondly, there's secondary operations (OTB, Express, Seasonal, horticulture ) being pushed through fresh DC's
On top of there's the impact changes to there store delivery schedule, forced on to depots by replenish being moved from the nightshift to twilight fill.
So DL and MD In the words of Edward Smith and William Murdoch , icebergs , I see no icebergs, and no matter how try to paper over the cracks with the promises of the creation "new roles" you are undoubtedly steering this ship in to oblivion
Quote from: Billy Budd on 09-01-17, 08:16PM
Quote from: dilligaf on 09-01-17, 03:42PM
I don't think its time to Lord it over anyone at this time, the managers are being treated like s**t around this, & don't for 1 min think that it wont come to most of us in some way in the near future & you will be treated no different... You may have views on managers but they have family's homes etc just the same as you & I wouldn't wish this treatment on anyone...
I'm sorry to say, but I feel NOTHING for the team managers at my Depot, especially my shift manager!!! These past couple of weeks, our managers have walked about in groups sniping and ignorant, their anger mostly fuelled towards agency and Occupation health workers...Its been nothing short of disgraceful! Perhaps a couple I could mabey show positive regard, but they have showed virtually No grace or empathy towards the guys on the shop floor!
Good bye and good riddance!!! :thumbdown:
Billy Budd
Now let's put your whole childish and immature outlook in to prospective, the job losses won't end with the management restructure and the closure of the 2 DC's, the wording of the announcement (should you read it properly) indicates further changes are to follow i.e. wave 1 , phase 1/ phase 2 , so don't think for a moment you're safe .
If Tesco really want to emulate, the German discounters model, then they will be looking at introducing zero hour flexible contracts, i.e. there's no work for you here today, but we want you to go and work in the store 25 miles away , there is also likely to be a reduction in the Tesco headcount at every dc .
The company undoubtably will be looking at ways of cutting all DC's across to the "new" t&c - which will be ably abetted by the "partnership" - see you in a few months time , when you appear on the should have gone to spec savers advert ....
Quote from: snowyowl on 09-01-17, 09:46AM
Genuinely, good luck today Arizonarugby, I understand the next step is that you find out if you're on the "at risk list" Not definitively whether you are going or not, just if you are "at risk" or not.
It's not enough that in the recent past, they have told you that TM's will be going, they now intend to torture you further by informing you if you are or are not on an "at risk list"
I find it difficult to imagine a more moral destroying, humiliating, embarrassing way to treat staff. They have already ruined your Christmas and now they are happy to ruin your New Year.
The people responsible for this need some education in humility, they are a disgrace. Lastly where are the Union, I know there is little they can do but they should be all over these sites supporting their members to the end. Conspicuous by their absence again, again disgraceful. >:( >:( >:(
we all know where usdaw are. in tescos back pockets >:( >:( >:(
Quote from: picktocube on 09-01-17, 03:08PM
If there are less than 100 redundancies then only 30 days consultation is required.
says who? fuckin tesdaw no doubt >:( >:(
Quote from: baldeagle on 09-01-17, 05:01PM
Re the last paragraph, Snodland were informed at 15.00 hours today. Not much talking there then.
the snivelling lying scumbag makes my skin crawl >:( >:( >:(
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 09-01-17, 08:58PM
Let's face it Tesco is not Aldi or Lidl and not natter
how much spin DL and MD put on it , the operation of the "big four" is far more complex than the discounters.
Firstly , there's the product range 5000+ compared with less than 500 .
Secondly, there's secondary operations (OTB, Express, Seasonal, horticulture ) being pushed through fresh DC's
On top of there's the impact changes to there store delivery schedule, forced on to depots by replenish being moved from the nightshift to twilight fill.
So DL and MD In the words of Edward Smith and William Murdoch , icebergs , I see no icebergs, and no matter how try to paper over the cracks with the promises of the creation "new roles" you are undoubtedly steering this ship in to oblivion
:thumbup: :thumbup:
I was a union rep when they made the night shift redundant. I had no info or any communication from them until the last two weeks of consultation. Absolute disgrace. Am out now good ridence .
"We have been speaking to colleagues from all sites about what these changes will mean for them, and we will continue to do all we can to support them at this time."
More lies from MD
he's an immoral scumbag >:( >:D
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 09-01-17, 11:04PM
Quote from: Billy Budd on 09-01-17, 08:16PM
Quote from: dilligaf on 09-01-17, 03:42PM
I don't think its time to Lord it over anyone at this time, the managers are being treated like s**t around this, & don't for 1 min think that it wont come to most of us in some way in the near future & you will be treated no different... You may have views on managers but they have family's homes etc just the same as you & I wouldn't wish this treatment on anyone...
I'm sorry to say, but I feel NOTHING for the team managers at my Depot, especially my shift manager!!! These past couple of weeks, our managers have walked about in groups sniping and ignorant, their anger mostly fuelled towards agency and Occupation health workers...Its been nothing short of disgraceful! Perhaps a couple I could mabey show positive regard, but they have showed virtually No grace or empathy towards the guys on the shop floor!
Good bye and good riddance!!! :thumbdown:
Billy Budd
Now let's put your whole childish and immature outlook in to prospective, the job losses won't end with the management restructure and the closure of the 2 DC's, the wording of the announcement (should you read it properly) indicates further changes are to follow i.e. wave 1 , phase 1/ phase 2 , so don't think for a moment you're safe .
If Tesco really want to emulate, the German discounters model, then they will be looking at introducing zero hour flexible contracts, i.e. there's no work for you here today, but we want you to go and work in the store 25 miles away , there is also likely to be a reduction in the Tesco headcount at every dc .
The company undoubtably will be looking at ways of cutting all DC's across to the "new" t&c - which will be ably abetted by the "partnership" - see you in a few months time , when you appear on the should have gone to spec savers advert ....
Arizonarugby,
You're one to talk about badmouthing work colleagues, just look back to some of your postings....you really need to polish the brass on your neck!!! (sniggers)
you've sniped and looked down your nose at some of the posters on here, and quite
frankly old boy, you should wind yer neck in!
Yes, I've been harsh in my criticisms of team managers on my shift, and I stand by what I say...no question. Any I not allowed to voice my opinion without wee Harpies like you fluttering about the forum?! And I must empathise that I only stated managers on 'My Shift and DC'
I would NEVER criticise the personnel at the two depots who are to lose their jobs and livelihood...Why on earth would I!??
And yes, my DC's terms and conditions could change (although, according to you we're already doomed!) and if my heads for the guillotine, then so be it! But in the mean time, I'll enjoy my t' & c's...(mon-fri, three breaks, retained pay, overflowing overtime, etc!)
Over twenty years service and counting....💰💰💰
Quote from: lackofinterest on 09-01-17, 11:28PM
Quote from: picktocube on 09-01-17, 03:08PM
If there are less than 100 redundancies then only 30 days consultation is required.
says who? f***in tesdaw no doubt >:( >:(
nothing to do with Tesco or Usdaw . Check the link on the right hand side of the VLH homepage ,takes you to Gov .uk. Just standard redundancy regulations.
Billy Budd
I won't wind "my neck in" but I will bite me tongue!! The following phrase / quote by the "little princess "clearly displays your perspective on life
"Enfin je me rappelai le pis-aller d'une grande princesse à qui l'on disait que les paysans n'avaient pas de pain, et qui répondit : Qu'ils mangent de la brioche" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Let_them_eat_cake)
I wish you a long and happy career with Tesco !!!!!!!
[admin]A reminder that posts must be in English.[/admin]
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 09-01-17, 11:04PM
If Tesco really want to emulate, the German discounters model, then they will be looking at introducing zero hour flexible contracts, i.e. there's no work for you here today, but we want you to go and work in the store 25 miles away , there is also likely to be a reduction in the Tesco headcount at every dc .
I doubt they will need to go to zero hour contracts but there can be no doubt about the direction of travel where full-timers are being phased out and replaced by flexi-contracts. Full-timers are often loyal, long-serving colleagues and while most businesses would praise and respect such employees, Tesco want the exact opposite because full time + long service = expensive to make redundant. And full-timers are more likely to be able to afford the 7.5 per cent pension contributions that the company is obliged to match. But of course, the less loyalty the company has to its workforce, the less loyalty the workforce has to the company. Terms and conditions are now in a race to the bottom - as close to the legal minimum as they can get away with - so it won't be long before almost any other job is better than at Tesco, if not in terms of pay, at least in terms of more sociable hours. Drastic underestimates the stability provided by full-time staff and conversely the potential for a mass exodus of staff on flexi-contracts wherever local job vacancies are good.
Has anyone heard any feedback from the express trial, what's working, what's not etc?
Anyone heard how many are to go at Belfast and Antrim Dc,s? All seems to be hush hush.
Quote from; blutopia
I doubt they will need to go to zero hour contracts but there can be no doubt about the direction of travel where full-timers are being phased out and replaced by flexi-contracts. Full-timers are often loyal, long-serving colleagues and while most businesses would praise and respect such employees, Tesco want the exact opposite because full time + long service = expensive to make redundant. And full-timers are more likely to be able to afford the 7.5 per cent pension contributions that the company is obliged to match. But of course, the less loyalty the company has to its workforce, the less loyalty the workforce has to the company. Terms and conditions are now in a race to the bottom - as close to the legal minimum as they can get away with - so it won't be long before almost any other job is better than at Tesco, if not in terms of pay, at least in terms of more sociable hours. Drastic underestimates the stability provided by full-time staff and conversely the potential for a mass exodus of staff on flexi-contracts wherever local job vacancies are good.
I am curious with regards to your comments about loyalty, I am a DC worker and in all my years working for Tosco I have never witnessed any loyalty to Tosco at all. It's my belief that a vast majority of colleagues have been the subject of a bullying regime for so long they have no loyalty for Tosco whatsoever. I honestly believe that this vast majority would take redundancy tomorrow should it be offerred.
At present, with changes to SYA and SYP it is clear and without doubt that Tosco are trying desperately try to deplete their workforce and if they can't do it legally they have been proven to be quite happy to do this otherwise. Due to this there is no respect or trust at this Depot with regards any level of Management. People clock in, do their bit and clock out. >:(
Snowyowl
I agree with you. I don't believe their is any real loyalty to the company, especially now after all they have done.
Certainly everyone I know still with Tesco are waiting for a redundancy offer and they are quite open about it. And anyone I have spoke to that had been affected by redundancy, took the offer without question.
Snowyowl/Equalizer87
Strange though it may seem, I do know several colleagues who I would describe as loyal. Many are seeing the light, of course, but only because of how dire things have become in the last couple of years. I am aware there are others who have long since had their spirit trampled into the ground by idiotic and bullying managers and so do the bare minimum they need to in their jobs. Personally, I tend more towards the latter - I just don't go so far as joining the awkward squad. While I would jump at the chance of redundancy, I do feel sorry for those who are worried about their jobs.
Blutopia
I too feel for those with jobs possibly on the line. They shouldn't have to work in an environment of uncertainty of security being it redundancy or "managed out of the business" through accelerated dismissal procedures.
The push towards part time colleagues will have long term effects on the company. Most options candidates come from full time or virtually full time staff. A large proportion of management come via options.
In 5 or so years very few people will want to develop and the company will be forced to hire more and more external managers (who often can't hack Tesco Retail).
Full time staff are often loyal; dedicated and will go the extra mile. Someone on 15hrs a week with 2 jobs can't give you that and will jump ship as soon as anything better turns up.
The only option is redundancy or a using. The options is used to get Tescos finest to work extra hours for nothing and take the flack for LMs. Who can hack the place just now it's a joke. Someone on 15 hours will just wait on the next round of redundancy which the company is famous for and cash out and move on to the next place as no matter where you go you will get the same or better money. Rumour is that people join them for the redundancy alone. :)
:)Having just read my local evening news paper I am pleased to report that our CEO has stated that;
"our priority throughout this process has been our colleagues and we will continue to do all we can to support them at this time"
There, that should reassure you.
Sadly he goes on to say "these changes will help to simplify our distribution operations" and "Management structures will be simplified as part of the overhaul"
Well, we know how they intend to simplify the Management structure but I haven't seen any evidence of them continuing to support them.
There is also reference to creating additional jobs at both Reading and Middlesbrough, I know both Reading and Middlesbrough and one thing I can tell you is that they may be able to employ people at Reading but they will struggle at Middlesbrough. The Depot there has a terrible reputation locally (no offence) and they struggle even to keep agency workers.
They continue to amaze me with b*llsh*t they continue to announce to anybody stupid enough to listen to them >:( >:( >:(
Quote from: londoner83 on 10-01-17, 06:29PM
The push towards part time colleagues will have long term effects on the company. Most options candidates come from full time or virtually full time staff. A large proportion of management come via options.
In 5 or so years very few people will want to develop and the company will be forced to hire more and more external managers (who often can't hack Tesco Retail).
Full time staff are often loyal; dedicated and will go the extra mile. Someone on 15hrs a week with 2 jobs can't give you that and will jump ship as soon as anything better turns up.
The idiots pushing forward these changes won't be here in 5 years, so they will not have to deal with the fallout from it. They are just vultures, here to collect what they can before they disappear.
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 10-01-17, 09:13AM
Billy Budd
I won't wind "my neck in" but I will bite me tongue!! The following phrase / quote by the "little princess "clearly displays your perspective on life
"Enfin je me rappelai le pis-aller d'une grande princesse à qui l'on disait que les paysans n'avaient pas de pain, et qui répondit : Qu'ils mangent de la brioche" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Let_them_eat_cake)
I wish you a long and happy career with Tesco !!!!!!!
[admin]A reminder that posts must be in English.[/admin]
What a truly awful comeback..That the best you can do!?? (sniggers)
Away to do my 12 hours overtime shift!
Translate for me please, I don't speak German? :D
It's basically a quote from French philosopher Jean - Jacques Rousseau reflecting on some people have a scant disregard for other people's suffering as they are ok themselves and relates to an alleged quote by Marie Antionette, who when told the peasants were starving because they had no bread, responded with " let them eat cake "
Unfortunately, such a this I'm alright jack attitude is not confined to history
The full translation is
Finally I recalled the stopgap solution of a great princess who was told that the peasants had no bread, and who responded: "Let them eat brioche."
Whilst there is no record of her actually saying this, but she showed a scant disregard for those less fortunate than herself . The moral of the story is don't kick people when they're down, because it could be your turn next - Marie Antionette was trialled and convicted of treason and subsequently beheaded in 1793.
Thank you Arizonarugby :D
Quote from: Billy Budd on 11-01-17, 10:36AM
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 10-01-17, 09:13AM
Billy Budd
I won't wind "my neck in" but I will bite me tongue!! The following phrase / quote by the "little princess "clearly displays your perspective on life
"Enfin je me rappelai le pis-aller d'une grande princesse à qui l'on disait que les paysans n'avaient pas de pain, et qui répondit : Qu'ils mangent de la brioche" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Let_them_eat_cake)
I wish you a long and happy career with Tesco !!!!!!!
A reminder that posts must be in English.
What a truly awful comeback..That the best you can do!?? (sniggers)
Away to do my 12 hours overtime shift!
Clearly you have missed the moral and context of the quote ?
[admin]snowyowl & Arizonarugby the topic is "Management Restructure?", thank you. Nomad.[/admin]
It appears the cull is not over they're coming back to do some more at distribution to go with what they've already done.
Management are being culled more, another 1 off each shift by looks of it.
My has (finally) been given the numbers , 4 shift managers cut to 3, team managers cut to 15 (reduced by over 50 %) .
Clearly Tesco are trying to build the structure of both the DC's and the stores on the German Discounter Model - perhaps if Tesco sold 2 brands of beans , cornflakes etc , but they don't - the question I'd like to ask Drastic Dave & Matt the T@@t , if yours going to adopt the Aldi / Lidl Structure when are they going to adopt their pay structure ( they pay a whole lot money than Tesco).
The frustrating thing is that all the paraphernalia now has the tag tag line " look after your people, and they'll look after the customer, who'll look after Tesco ..... Joke
It's been quite clear Tesco have been wanting to implement the Discounters structure since Drastic took over. It the only real way they can make money now and after the shrug that Tesco got for the Xmas trading I'd say it's going to come think and fast now.
Perhap if Tesco hadn't wasted millions of pounds on trying to break in to the US market, they wouldn't have to be taking such drastic action.
Perhaps if some clever @@@t hadn't tried to inflate Tesco profits (for their own benefit) the DD and MtT wouldn't have to treat thief employees like s@@te
I dont think tesco failing in USA was our downturn although it did cost us money. That was just one stupid decision. Phill clarkes idea of buying up home stores , coffee shops , bakeries and other stuff was the cherry on the cake. A waste of money. None of them made any money
May be not but it was the start of the decline in the business, the powers that be lost focus and concentrated more in loss making ventures as opposed to concentrating on the core uk business.
However, the point I was trying to make is that the people at the bottom of the pile are paying for the mistakes made by those at the top - many who have left the company with multimillion pound pension pots
True. Thats always the case with any business. The fat cats will look after themselves and we pay the price for it. Hopefully karma will come around to bite them
Arizonarugby & kurious1234 :thumbup:
I think restructure is good if it means getting rid of the rude vile bullying people they call managers. Why in all the tesco stores are they all like this, maybe there training (cough) is all wrong, maybe they are all like this NOT. TESCO stop thinking about changes to management and start thinking about your staff, we are all human beings not cattle for you to herd around. Actually talk to staff and HEAR there problems, work with them see the problems for yourself. Also Sick days are sick days for most people only a few abuse it so don't tar us all with the same brush, drop your percentage rubbish and be understanding.
Instead of worrying what the HQ have to say invite them to see for themselves. Just remember no staff no Tesco 8-)
Unfortunately Baileynead the Managers you are describing are more than like to be the ones that survive - why ,because they are the ones that toe the Tesco line , follow rigidly the polices and procedures
brainwashed jobsworth twats you mean :-X
Maybe so , but point I was trying make is that the managers who cared about and looked after their people will be gone..... those that treat you like t@@ts will still be there but with twice as must power and influence.
influence my arse!! who do they influence?
The people that will score them high on ERRIC which means they get to keep their jobs
The biggest disappointment with this whole situation is that there are no voluntary redundancies. In my dc you either meet their criteria, which is dependant on the ERRIC score as well as other aspects, take a coordinator role at a much lower wage, or compulsory redundancy.
I agree with what was said earlier, if the powers that be want to adopt the structures of the discounters the pay structure should match as well.
if they don't want a night shift they should open 8.00 till 22.00 hours like the discounters. having to work till midnight without unsociable hours allowance is an absolute disgrace >:(
Honestly I can understand the reasoning behind no voluntary redundancies from Tesco's point of view. In any business why would you let people go who you like and keep those you don't, also at the risk of losing the few who are good at their jobs, because of this I can see why . Saying that it doesn't mean I agree with the way they are doing it.
I disagree. I think voluntary redundancies should be 100% considered. In my DC, we have a fair few management that would like to take redundancy but are unlikely to be able to. If it was my/your company, why would you keep someone there that doesn't actually want to be there, and get rid of people that are passionate about doing a good job that want to stay?
in my opinion, it makes no sence
I am sure that those who are good at their jobs will be the ones who choose to stay. After all those who are good at their jobs (and go the extra mile) are obviously going to be the ones who are respected and valued by their managers and happy in their work.
I can't see a logical reason for not allowing voluntary redundancies across the board if we want to keep the best staff.
There are many at my dc that want to go, the new roles are not what they signed up for and to be forced into them with no choice other than take it or resign is just ridiculous.
Although this could potentially a nice cost saving measure for those that would cost a lot on redundancy, either take it, resign, or we'll manage you out when you can't do the new role.
That sounds reasonable enough, optout. However, I would like to think I'm good at my job and I'm on good terms with my current manager so you would expect me to want to stay, wouldn't you? But I don't!
I am planning a career change (after all, no career prospects any more at Tesco) but I'm also hanging on in the hope of a nice big redundancy as reward for putting up with this garbage company for so long. If only Drastic would just get on with what he's planning so I know how soon to escape! My current manager may be OK, but as we all know, that can change at the drop of a hat and the next one is likely to be one of the idiots. I could write a book about the frustrations that cause me to feel this way, but many examples have already been posted by myself and others on this site so I think most people would understand without me having to add any more!
You are (in my opinion) absolutely correct johntjenarsteward, the new roles are significantly different to the old ones and some of the managers won't want to do
them , but will forced to and end up
leaving.
Optout I disagree when you say those that are good at their jobs, go the extra mile etc. the ones that stay will be the one that are buddies with the person who scores them on ERRIC and about those fighting for the dual role position ?
Does anybody really believe that "ERRIC" is the guiding tool in deciding who goes and who stays. This is simply a cost cutting exercise, nothing else. :-\
Quote from: snowyowl on 19-01-17, 08:45AM
Does anybody really believe that "ERRIC" is the guiding tool in deciding who goes and who stays. This is simply a cost cutting exercise, nothing else. :-\
It is the only part that senior management can have influence on. It will be a case of if your face fits unfortunately, and how valuable you are to them, read that as how much of a 'yes' man are you. Hopefully there will be an appeals procedure put in place if you do not agree with your score, dependant on the outcome you want.
That's interesting,
QuoteIt is the only part that senior management can have influence on.
If that's the case what would happen in a case where a Senior Manager didn't acquire enough points?
Quote from: snowyowl on 19-01-17, 08:45AM
Does anybody really believe that "ERRIC" is the guiding tool in deciding who goes and who stays. This is simply a cost cutting exercise, nothing else. :-\
Perhaps if ERRIC was conducted objectively, them it may be useful , but unfortunately it is being judge (subjectively )based on the opinion of of how the senior team think you measure against each of the criteria.
This clearly is wrong and immoral , and without even looking at ERRIC I know the managers that will definitely staying and those that won't , purely based on their relationship wish the decision makers
Quote from: snowyowl on 19-01-17, 10:09AM
That's interesting,
QuoteIt is the only part that senior management can have influence on.
If that's the case what would happen in a case where a Senior Manager didn't acquire enough points?
The scoring mechanism is being used in this way the number of roles are being reduced i.e. 4 shift Mangers reduced to 3.
The with the 3 with highest scores would stay, the 1 with the lowest score would "be under threat (made redundant)"
It has been mentioned to me that those That are being categorised as at Risk are not suitable for the New Roles.
Those that are suitable are not in an at risk redundancy position so only have New role or leave on their own accord.
If Suitable people leave because they don't wish to have a "newly defined role" and the company don't have enough suitable candidates for the number of positions then the at risk individuals won't necessarily be able stay in the newly defined role as they have been categorised as at risk/ not suitable, is this correct?
As ultimately suitable people may leave reluctantly of their own accord, unsuitable people made redundant and then New people that are not even part of this process will be employed to the Newly defined roles, who ? Signed off options candidates?
I don't understand how it would be possible that those who are suitable to the Newly defined Manager role should not have a redundancy package because they are suitable and not in the at risk category.
The company can't have it both ways surely, if they deem the new roles as significantly different from the current role that some doing the current role can be deemed as not suitable and therefore at risk then the new roles are significantly different enough for the current role as it is now to be redundant and therefore all in that current role are eligible for redundancy because their current role will no longer exist.
By saying to a manager you're not apt for the newly defined position and the old doesn't exist so Redundant.
Even if the suitable managers are apt for the newer defined role but don't want it they to should have redundancy because the company are defining the roles as significantly different enough to deny people the new different roles so even the suitable category should be able to refuse the new position and take redundancy because their current position will no longer exist, redundant.
Is the above correct are suitable managers who do not wish to take on the new role being denied redundancy?
this is the problem, firstly Tesco are saying there are no fundamental changes to the role - clearly there are. The scoring system is pure based on whether you meet the certain aspects of ERRIC and not on the ability to do the job, there are people who Would score low on the criteria if it was done objectively, but because they are drinking or golf buddies with the person who will score their ERRIC they will get to keep their jobs.....!
If ERRIC was applied scientifically, then there would be some surprises on those keeping their jobs ..... I guarantee that there will be no surprises at my depot.,,, !!!
Quote from: Duracell on 19-01-17, 12:03PM
It has been mentioned to me that those That are being categorised as at Risk are not suitable for the New Roles.
Those that are suitable are not in an at risk redundancy position so only have New role or leave on their own accord.
If Suitable people leave because they don't wish to have a "newly defined role" and the company don't have enough suitable candidates for the number of positions then the at risk individuals won't necessarily be able stay in the newly defined role as they have been categorised as at risk/ not suitable, is this correct?
As ultimately suitable people may leave reluctantly of their own accord, unsuitable people made redundant and then New people that are not even part of this process will be employed to the Newly defined roles, who ? Signed off options candidates?
I don't understand how it would be possible that those who are suitable to the Newly defined Manager role should not have a redundancy package because they are suitable and not in the at risk category.
The company can't have it both ways surely, if they deem the new roles as significantly different from the current role that some doing the current role can be deemed as not suitable and therefore at risk then the new roles are significantly different enough for the current role as it is now to be redundant and therefore all in that current role are eligible for redundancy because their current role will no longer exist.
By saying to a manager you're not apt for the newly defined position and the old doesn't exist so Redundant.
Even if the suitable managers are apt for the newer defined role but don't want it they to should have redundancy because the company are defining the roles as significantly different enough to deny people the new different roles so even the suitable category should be able to refuse the new position and take redundancy because their current position will no longer exist, redundant.
Is the above correct are suitable managers who do not wish to take on the new role being denied redundancy?
That's right. Those 'lucky' enough to be selected have the choice to accept the role or resign. No redundancy option. I know some managers are considering constructive dismissal cases already
I did wonder about that possibility, based on the info I have been told being correct cases of that nature do seem compelling and strong.
It does make you wonder how much discontent, bad publicity and tribunal cases it will take before the Major Share holders realise the Driver is not worth the money they are paying him.
Quote from: Duracell on 19-01-17, 11:52PM
I did wonder about that possibility, based on the info I have been told being correct cases of that nature do seem compelling and strong.
It does make you wonder how much discontent, bad publicity and tribunal cases it will take before the Major Share holders realise the Driver is not worth the money they are paying him.
Unfortunately, Duracell, our Driver has been very clever in his approach to "streamlining the business " done it by stealth , and if we just look at the share price, it clearly indicates that shareholders are happy with the route the "bus" is taking .
:thumbup:
Is there any update what is happening with the management restructure in express and stores?
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 20-01-17, 06:39AM
Quote from: Duracell on 19-01-17, 11:52PM
I did wonder about that possibility, based on the info I have been told being correct cases of that nature do seem compelling and strong.
It does make you wonder how much discontent, bad publicity and tribunal cases it will take before the Major Share holders realise the Driver is not worth the money they are paying him.
Unfortunately, Duracell, our Driver has been very clever in his approach to "streamlining the business " done it by stealth , and if we just look at the share price, it clearly indicates that shareholders are happy with the route the "bus" is taking .
The whole restructure is about appeasing the shareholders, if he can make the share price look good, appear to be making profit ( by cutting and subsidising what goes through the till), then he gets his bonuses and disappears in a few years. Tesco would have no comeback if it all collapsed after that as he fulfilled his contract, by making profit in whatever way he achieved it.
He will get his bonus regardless off what happens to the share price . He's been very clever ,in his 1st year he posted losses of £6.4bn and still got a huge bonus. He also wrote off all the surplus land land Tesco owned to £0, but even if it's not worth what they paid for it, it is worth something, so at some point he will liquidise the asset and declare it as profit.
Right guys....a quick update regarding management redundancies at the Livingston DC.
All 7 shift managers at Livingston have had their one to ones, and 4 are to be made redundant!!!
Team managers have had their 30 Days notice increased to 60 days...The shift manager cull has caused great fear for their own futures.
The personnel manager and personnel staff given 30 days notice
Health & safety manager given 30 days notice
Site services manager and staff given 30 days notice
IT managers given 30 days notice.
Basically 51% of all management at Livingston are going.
Absolute bloodbath!!!
:thumbdown:
IT managers ?
Would that be Systems Managers.
Site Services Managers?
Facilities are contractors aren't they?
The same situation at my DC
Shift Manager reduced to 3
Team Managers reduced to 15
System Managers reduced to 1
Finance Manager to oversee 2 sites
Personnel Manager to oversee 2 sites
Health and safety Manager and Training Manager role merged
So in short 18 Managers will lose their jobs
Not entirely.
I will check the detail and with the rep concerned.
There is a potential error with Billy Budd's post.
Either they have Made it or their GM has.
Quote from: Duracell on 21-01-17, 11:28AM
Not entirely.
I will check the detail and with the rep concerned.
There is a potential error with Billy Budd's post.
Either they have Made it or their GM has.
My apologies....Systems Managers, not IT Managers
But Livingston does has its own Tesco Site Services Manager and staff.
[admin]Edited. When using the quote function do not put your own text in the quoted section.[/admin]
Our dc is to be as follows apparently
1 DM
3 SM - one less
18 WSTM - 21 less
18 WSCO - new role
1 Stock and systems - 2 less
24 potential losses
Then there's training manager at
Very messy
Does anybody know the redundancy package if I'm going ?
What is the redundancy package as a team mgr in distribution?
Still unsure as I've heard conflicting packages.
Quote from: Billy Budd on 21-01-17, 12:28PM
Quote from: Duracell on 21-01-17, 11:28AM
Not entirely.
I will check the detail and with the rep concerned.
There is a potential error with Billy Budd's post.
Either they have Made it or their GM has.
My apologies....Systems Managers, not IT Managers
But Livingston does has its own Tesco Site Services Manager and staff.
So where you say Livingston has its own Site Services staff, you mean Hygiene staff? That role was supposed to have been TUPED out to contractors years ok.
I thought site services was maintainece???
Definitely not those guys, they went through a restructure of sorts in September, they are no longer controlled by Distribution so shouldn't be part of a Distribution Restructure, stranger mistakes have happened though.
Blutopia and ArizonaRugby
I was being sarcastic (although admittedly in a very dry way). In a fair and reasonable world what I said is logical, BUT we are talking about tesco, and I am afraid that your experience is probably the tesco standard. :thumbup:
Reading Alwaysthevictim's post, this is exactly what I mean, a Team Manager under threat of redundancy and not knowing what his/her redundancy package will be? Where are the Union? In this life changing environment Alwaysthevictim finds him/herself in, through no fault of their own he/she should know of every penny they are entitled too and how it's calculated. Him/her should also be getting advise from the Union on a life after Tosco.
What do this Union get paid for? >:( >:( >:(
In some sites site services is still controlled locally and has a maintenance manager, although this area is not affected by this structure change.
A manager that is not successful and declines the offer of a warehouse coordinator role will the offer statutory redundancy, additional service payment and possibly a pilon payment. The calculator on here seems to include all aspects.
So with Site Services ( Maintenance), as Livingston were part of the former change and they are not part of the Distribution Restructure, I think it is important to find out whether Billy Bud's post is indeed correct and that they have been put on 30 days notice.
With such a big mistake that will have to be reversed it does make you wonder if anymore are being made.
I would personally like to thank, the main board of directors, the Distribution Leadership Team, the Senior Team ant my depot and senior organisers at the union for the sleepless nights and weekends that they have inflicted on everyone effected by theses changes - I guess the bus they told us to get on has either broken down or got lost along the route....!!
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 22-01-17, 11:32AM
- I guess the bus they told us to get on has either broken down or got lost along the route....!!
I've always hated public transport
site services have been Tesco maintenance for several months,7 shifties now meant to be 4 but 4 have gone
, 32 team managers are being axed ,3 systems team managers going.all training and people managers are leaving even though there is one role avail,7 clerical roles being done away with and new people roles made with the usual reduction of 50%.transport still to come,where does it end.
Tesco are desperate increase profits, but unfortunately their is no forward thinking or innovation and the only way can do this is take short term measures and cut cost - which can only mean one thing, job losses, reduced hours, reduced premiums and changes to contracted hours.
The frightening thing is that st the moment the company is based on rumours, hearsay and lies - for f@@@sake just tell us the truth no matter how how painful i is
Tesco cant be that bad given they are spending over 3 billion on Booker (http://www.verylittlehelps.com/index.php?topic=15802.msg188537;topicseen#new).
Nothing surprises me anymore, but Tesco one the onestop convenience store group and have been trying to integrate the stores in to Tesco's delivery network , but have wasted a fortune in trying to do so.
Purchasing Booker (http://www.verylittlehelps.com/index.php?topic=15802.msg188537;topicseen#new) will enable them to close the onestop distribution centres and supply the stores (and probably some of the express stores) through booker - resulting in more job losses
I'm not suggesting for a moment that there is any connection but this Booker deal will certainly take the spotlight off how Tosco and their partners Usbore are cheating and mistreating employee's with regards to these current redundancies. >:( >:( >:(
just watching dispatches on channel4 featuring warehouse working conditions I hope Tesco head office are paying attention (-*-)
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 27-01-17, 10:55AM
Nothing surprises me anymore, but Tesco one the onestop convenience store group and have been trying to integrate the stores in to Tesco's delivery network , but have wasted a fortune in trying to do so.
Purchasing Booker (http://www.verylittlehelps.com/index.php?topic=15802.msg188537;topicseen#new) will enable them to close the onestop distribution centres and supply the stores (and probably some of the express stores) through booker - resulting in more job losses
Well that's Likely to happen as far as the One stop part goes,, Not sure about the Express, But don't you think that is part of the cost savings they have talked about ?
Heard on the grapevine that there has been a few curveballs thrown in regarding the redundancy process.
jonthebarsteward
Like what?
Don't keep us waiting ;D
Don't mean to keep going on but does anyone know or heard any update on the express deputy manager role going ? Is it this week? Next week? Next year? After a zombie apocalypse???
bensonbest week 1 / 2 consultations to begin.
Yes that's what I got told too ...
Quote from: notsofunny on 30-01-17, 10:01PM
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 27-01-17, 10:55AM
Nothing surprises me anymore, but Tesco one the onestop convenience store group and have been trying to integrate the stores in to Tesco's delivery network , but have wasted a fortune in trying to do so.
Purchasing Booker (http://www.verylittlehelps.com/index.php?topic=15802.msg188537;topicseen#new) will enable them to close the onestop distribution centres and supply the stores (and probably some of the express stores) through booker - resulting in more job losses
Well that's Likely to happen as far as the One stop part goes,, Not sure about the Express, But don't you think that is part of the cost savings they have talked about ?
In the case of one stop and the express Tesco have tried to implement several solutions in to their existing network to service the convenience market, firstly to better utilise the fleet more effectively, secondly to intrigrate one drop in to Tesco's network to allow them to close the onestop ageing distribution centres but failed miserably
Quote from: JL on 06-02-17, 04:21PM
jonthebarsteward
Like what?
Whether it's a change of role or not
Of course it is ... lol ... pay drop is enough to secure that
Quote from: Cheekymonkey007 on 07-02-17, 10:30AM
Of course it is ... lol ... pay drop is enough to secure that
There is no pay drop for those that meet the criteria of the new role
Are we talking about Dm in express here ?
No about the management restructure in distribution, as per the title.of thread and forum board
Title of this thread is management restructure, not only for distribution.
Aye but its on distribution/warehouse forum.....
As pretty as your are Cheekymonkey007 he's got you by the Albert Halls there. ;D ;D ;D
Guilty as charged :-X
Quote from: Jonthebarsteward on 07-02-17, 02:49PM
Quote from: Cheekymonkey007 on 07-02-17, 10:30AM
Of course it is ... lol ... pay drop is enough to secure that
There is no pay drop for those that meet the criteria of the new role
In reality, there is a pay drop, those that stay will have to cover the duty Manager role, so effectively they will be doing the shift Managers job for less money. Furthermore, were is the development with in Tesco... in short non existent , what is the point of the options program, because at the end of it there's no where to go, add to this the graduate program and throw into the mix that the shift manager role down to the people advisor roles, everything is cut to the bare minimum with no contingency built in , it all adds up to one hell of a shortsighted mess.
There's already rumours on this site about the express duty Managers role being cut , and I'm sure that DD will have further plans to reduce Managers in the stores i.e. one manager in charge of multiple departments/ as will shortly be the case in distribution.
[admin]Remember this is Distribution Warehouse section of forum.[/admin]
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 07-02-17, 07:47PM
Quote from: Jonthebarsteward on 07-02-17, 02:49PM
Quote from: Cheekymonkey007 on 07-02-17, 10:30AM
Of course it is ... lol ... pay drop is enough to secure that
There is no pay drop for those that meet the criteria of the new role
In reality, there is a pay drop, those that stay will have to cover the duty Manager role, so effectively they will be doing the shift Managers job for less money. Furthermore, were is the development with in Tesco... in short non existent , what is the point of the options program, because at the end of it there's no where to go, add to this the graduate program and throw into the mix that the shift manager role down to the people advisor roles, everything is cut to the bare minimum with no contingency built in , it all adds up to one hell of a shortsighted mess.
There's already rumours on this site about the express duty Managers role being cut , and I'm sure that DD will have further plans to reduce Managers in the stores i.e. one manager in charge of multiple departments/ as will shortly be the case in distribution.
You are correct, any that are left will be in essence doing the shift/duty manager role on a regular basis for no financial gain. Something that holds a significantly greater amount of responsibility than the current role.
We've already had guys on options at our place drop off, all of them saying whats the point in continuing, usually we all know that the goal posts are moved for those on options but this time the goal posts have been taken away, can see exactly why they have had enough.
I think we are all missing the point. Yes it's all about cost cutting without a doubt. The fact is they honestly believe by way of not offering voluntary redundancy as they're own written policy states they think they will retain the best managers by way of they're new policy scoring procedures. No they won't. This whole procedure is flawed from start to finish and there is solid proof of that. They live in a bubble believing it's right, it's not. Many of the managers you keep with the flawed scoring system want out. Bite the bullet for God's sake, you got Hinckley and Lichfield wrong. It's still not right as you well know. Offer voluntary to remaining sites, keep the right managers with devotion to the company, not the green performers who want out.
Your choice, damage limitation.
How are hinkley and lichfield coping with less managers?
What pay are the podium monkeys on, how are they coping with the pressure of the podiums?
Quote from: Deal Or No Deal on 15-02-17, 09:35PM
I think we are all missing the point. Yes it's all about cost cutting without a doubt. The fact is they honestly believe by way of not offering voluntary redundancy as they're own written policy states they think they will retain the best managers by way of they're new policy scoring procedures. No they won't. This whole procedure is flawed from start to finish and there is solid proof of that. They live in a bubble believing it's right, it's not. Many of the managers you keep with the flawed scoring system want out. Bite the bullet for God's sake, you got Hinckley and Lichfield wrong. It's still not right as you well know. Offer voluntary to remaining sites, keep the right managers with devotion to the company, not the green performers who want out.
Your choice, damage limitation.
I agree the scoring process is completely flawed, it is based on the opinion of the senior team who decide on how you score on each category, which clearly subjective and open to cronyism and nepotism . I can name 90% of the managers who will be staying at my depot, based on their relationship with the senior team ( without even considering ERRIC)
Quote from: Dip and drive on 17-02-17, 07:26AM
How are hinkley and lichfield coping with less managers?
What pay are the podium monkeys on, how are they coping with the pressure of the podiums?
I can't speak for Hinckley, but the podium monkeys at my depot are being offered an extra £6 a week (the same premium as a trainer) .
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 17-02-17, 08:37AMI agree the scoring process is completely flawed, it is based on the opinion of the senior team who decide on how you score on each category, which clearly subjective and open to cronyism and nepotism
Crooked Senior Managers choosing crooked sidekicks, what could possibly go wrong. Tosco, wake up. >:( >:( >:(
Thank you arizonarugby, exactly how much is £6 per week converted to an hourly rate ?
£6 per week is a massive 16p per hr
How many warehouse managers have Hinckley and Lichfield actually got now? 6 per shift?
Yes I believe both these depots have 6 manager per shift, but all the depots in next phase have been reduced to 5 per shift, so it's safe to assume that they will be reviewing the numbers at both Hinckley and Lichfield.
At my DC the changes take effect from june and we are going from 16 managers per shift down to 10. I believe it was to be reduced by more than 6 but as we are getting work from welham they had a change of mind. As regards to podium monkeys we are to have 8 per shift possibly more.
The more I hear/read about this the more it seems like they are making it up as they go along, at our expense.
We were told a fresh dc would be 5 per shift as that's what worked at the pilot sites.
The duty manager cover and Rota examples have all been based on the pilot sites.
There's also the fact that MyPerformance isn't in at these sites either so the workload from that has not been accounted for.
To be honest it's all a bit of a joke , rumour has that all not going we at Hinckley, but it would be good to hear it from the horses mouth .
It's not a nice place to be in at the moment , the decision about who's going and who's staying has already been made , but they're not telling anyone, there having to much fun watching everyone jump through hoops !!!!!
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 17-02-17, 10:34AM
Yes I believe both these depots have 6 manager per shift, but all the depots in next phase have been reduced to 5 per shift, so it's safe to assume that they will be reviewing the numbers at both Hinckley and Lichfield.
My depot reduces to 7 per shift.
Dont quote me on this but i believe it varies by site.
I would think it should vary by site due to sites be different sizes and having different staff levels and volumes. Even though we don't find out who's going and who's staying at my DC, I know that some managers have basically been told they are staying.
The atmosphere here is horrendous....nothing but rumours, backstabbing and gossip.
Goes without saying but the way its being managed beggars belief, told one thing one day, then the next its totally changed. Cant understand how it is being handled so badly. If it has already been piloted at 2 DCs surely they should know exactly what happens and when? Absolutely no understanding of peoples feelings...
For example, a WL1 who gets one of the new roles as a service co-ordinator will keep there old Ts and Cs, yet a TM who steps down goes on new Ts and Cs, effectively then being paid less than the guy stood alongside them! 4 systems roles initially all in one pot for 3 jobs....then to be told the nights role will be unaffected and the nights system TM will now be safe, while the other 3 are not.
Cant understand how they can treat the managers on nights differently either? We will end up seeing managers on nights who score less than managers on days staying. If the whole idea was to keep the best managers on, this defeats the object completely in my eyes. For it to be a fair system it should be everyone in one pot and graded from 1 to 40....clearly not the case. To say nights is different because its a 'lifestyle choice' is ridiculous, given the 'lifestyle choice' of working nights or not working at all i'm sure there would be people who would choose the former.
The future does not look bright...
keokrusader
Is this turning into a advert for Orange.
Wrong company!
More of a statement of fact than an advertising slogan...
Glad to see you took you in the facts... ???
Quote from: keokrusader on 17-02-17, 12:47PM
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 17-02-17, 10:34AM
Yes I believe both these depots have 6 manager per shift, but all the depots in next phase have been reduced to 5 per shift, so it's safe to assume that they will be reviewing the numbers at both Hinckley and Lichfield.
My depot reduces to 7 per shift.
Dont quote me on this but i believe it varies by site.
Yes there is a variance from site to site , but the standard fresh sites, are all to have 5 per shift
Quote from: keokrusader on 17-02-17, 01:20PM
The atmosphere here is horrendous....nothing but rumours, backstabbing and gossip.
Goes without saying but the way its being managed beggars belief, told one thing one day, then the next its totally changed. Cant understand how it is being handled so badly. If it has already been piloted at 2 DCs surely they should know exactly what happens and when? Absolutely no understanding of peoples feelings...
For example, a WL1 who gets one of the new roles as a service co-ordinator will keep there old Ts and Cs, yet a TM who steps down goes on new Ts and Cs, effectively then being paid less than the guy stood alongside them! 4 systems roles initially all in one pot for 3 jobs....then to be told the nights role will be unaffected and the nights system TM will now be safe, while the other 3 are not.
Cant understand how they can treat the managers on nights differently either? We will end up seeing managers on nights who score less than managers on days staying. If the whole idea was to keep the best managers on, this defeats the object completely in my eyes. For it to be a fair system it should be everyone in one pot and graded from 1 to 40....clearly not the case. To say nights is different because its a 'lifestyle choice' is ridiculous, given the 'lifestyle choice' of working nights or not working at all i'm sure there would be people who would choose the former.
The future does not look bright...
We are told by those who haven't got a clue, that to change somebody for days to nights would be a fundamental change to their job role and that's why the night team is being treated differently from the double days team
Quote from: JL on 17-02-17, 02:37PM
keokrusader
Is this turning into a advert for Orange.
Wrong company!
JL so glad that you are taking this subject seriously
Arizona might as well say what i like now as we are all going to be hammered regardless.
Feb 27? April? When does not matter it's happening.
Nothing we can do!
What i can not understand is them stating the addition of making us duty managers doesnt constitute enough of a change to make us redundant. Let alone all of the additional changes to the role by them restructuring h&s and training.
I dont want to be a duty manager with responsibilities for the whole depot!
I can never understand why people become managers then don't want responsibility. However they are quick enough to b........K staff for excessive breaks when managers spend a lot of time in the smoking shelters and they wonder why they're in firing line now.
Welsh-high there's a whole world of difference between managing a department and managing a shift in the same way that's there's a whole world of difference between driving a car and driving a bus .
It the hierarchy think that a depot can be run by duty managers approximately 50% of the time them why just take them out of the equation and run 100 % of the time
This was meant to say why not take shift managers out of the equation and purely run depots with duty managers
I'm still not with your thoughts. In our DC managers fight over who is to be shiftys right hand man. Often doing the role to make them look good and better than other managers and mere mortals on shop floor. Now when the company want managers to step up there is uproar. Managers in DC are often seen to abuse breaks themselves and at the moment there is little symphony for them at floor level. Most managers are either lazy or bullies. If the company want to half the numbers then so be it. Managers will now have to work for a living . That's what they don't like. At least you don't have syp on pick to worry about
From my point of view i have quite a bit of sympathy for 90% of the managers at my DC, they have been nothing but fair and decent to me and most colleagues who do the job and do it well. Most of our managers see their role as managing and looking after their crew but a few do not seem to understand the "looking after" part of the job.
We are due to lose 6 managers per shift and so far at least 2 are leaving for new jobs, some that want redundancy ain't getting it and the rest who knows
In the next few months we are losing managers, being replaced with pod monkeys and getting loads of work from welham. We have been recruiting now for a couple months, standards are beyond shocking.
Quote from: babymetal on 18-02-17, 03:28PM
We are due to lose 6 managers per shift and so far at least 2 are leaving for new jobs, some that want redundancy ain't getting it and the rest who knows
Quote from: Welsh-Hugh on 18-02-17, 02:51PM
I'm still not with your thoughts. In our DC managers fight over who is to be shiftys right hand man. Often doing the role to make them look good and better than other managers and mere mortals on shop floor. Now when the company want managers to step up there is uproar. Managers in DC are often seen to abuse breaks themselves and at the moment there is little symphony for them at floor level. Most managers are either lazy or bullies. If the company want to half the numbers then so be it. Managers will now have to work for a living . That's what they don't like. At least you don't have syp on pick to worry about
Welsh-Hugh you are still missing the point , the shift manager won't be able to have a right hand man , and SYP have been replaced by my performance and the policy for that is that everybody regardless of performance has a review at least once every 4 weeks which effectively is more work, especially when you consider the manager will have twice as many people in their team
If they have twice as many in team then they will have to work. They won't be able to have as many smoking breaks. Hours on PlayStation or playing table tennis. My heart bleeds for them. They have had it easy too long and now the company have caught up with them. This should have happened years ago
Where is this magical land of PlayStation and table tennis?
Will see how you feel when your pay and holidays are wrong because your manager hasn't had time to code workforce.
Your empathy astounds me....we are talking about people's livelihoods and mortgages.
Don't you have Playstation in canteen and table tennis in your site? Your missing out .
Managers in our site don't key holidays now. We have a clerk for that. Managers are always too busy to look at holiday availability let alone book them. Your right though. I don't have emphathy. Managers have had the easy life for too long.
I disagree....being contracted to 36 hours a week yet working upwards of 45 is hardly the easy life.
Can only assume this clerk must work 7 days a week then?
My DC managers work 8 hours max. You really are loosing out
M1lktrayMan
you may find this interesting (note especially the last two paragraphs of the page). BUT do not just read them in isolation, read them as part of the whole article.
https://www.harpermacleod.co.uk/hm-insights/2013/october/when-should-a-refusal-be-viewed-as-unreasonable/ (https://www.harpermacleod.co.uk/hm-insights/2013/october/when-should-a-refusal-be-viewed-as-unreasonable/)
Quote from: Welsh-Hugh on 18-02-17, 10:14PM
My DC managers work 8 hours max. You really are loosing out
Which is still almost an hour a day more than they are contracted to....
Many thanks for that link optout...
What we are being told though is if we are matched to the new roles we are not in a redundancy situation and also not elligible for any trial; despite the substantive changes to job descriptions and duties. It is basically take it or **** off.
Quote from: Welsh-Hugh on 18-02-17, 10:14PM
My DC managers work 8 hours max. You really are loosing out
Welsh-Hugh you really do need to get your facts right, managers are contracted to work 36 hours , but the shift are 7.5 hours on top of this there's a 30 minute shift 'handed over' at the start of shift and 30 minute (minimum) shift debrief at the end of shift
Don't make me laugh. In our DC. 5 mind most handover. Managers walk into work and go home with workers in my DC. But don't worry if you ever need to find a manager first place to look is smoking shelters or coffee machine. They have had it too good too long and I stand by my words . Last post on this from me
Quote from: M1lktrayman on 18-02-17, 03:31AM
What i can not understand is them stating the addition of making us duty managers doesnt constitute enough of a change to make us redundant. Let alone all of the additional changes to the role by them restructuring h&s and training.
I dont want to be a duty manager with responsibilities for the whole depot!
It is my belief if challenged it would be successful.
The Scoring Process can't be Relative to the current Role, regardless of the Selection method Suitability is to the New Management Role, there is no Credability in any claim that the current role plays a part in the selection process is a nonsense, which is why the criteria and selection is based on personal attributes of the individual, they would never be able to make people redundant based on their performance in the current role, as it it will cease to exist, you can't lay off a person saying " you can't do a role well enough even though that role is going", Nonsense.
Hence scoring on Personal Attributes, the only role that then becomes relative is the New One.
If the company can lay off, due to the fact that an individual doesn't have the personal attributes for the New role and New tasks then the New Role is Significantly Different, Ergo also different enough for someone to not want to do it and their current role is redundant and should be granted an exit Package.
It needs challenging, those that leave with nothing because they do not wish to continue in the New Role should explore constructive dismissal in my opinion.
Business Moving with the times and needing to become leaner is Credible, Manipulating restructures to avoid redundancy rights is very Naughty.
The New Management Role is Significantly Different not least having increased responsibility. If people do not wish to take on the role and can't stay as they are, then they are redundant to the Business, the company should give them an exit package.
Even P Clarke got one of those and look at the mess he made.
M1lktrayMan
...maybe. BUT, who is it that decides (or has already decided) that it is a 'matching' role?????????????
and exactly what Duracell says,
I can't see tesco wanting to get into a fight over this, and even if they did they must know that their chances of winning are not the best, and what have you got to lose by pushing??????
..if you or anybody else does 'push' let us know the response (taking care over anonymity issues).
Bear in mind you will (in all likelihood) have to push to the point at-least to where their legal department becomes involved.
I think what needs to be done is ask them to put it on paper to say that it is not a redundancy situation , This at least will make them think,
I don't think they will come out with saying this them self with out being pushed,
Can see them placing some options on the table that they like, and hoping most will take them up , with out having to show there hand,
so none of this is in writing anywhere yet???????
Quote from: Duracell on 19-02-17, 04:53PM
Quote from: M1lktrayman on 18-02-17, 03:31AM
What i can not understand is them stating the addition of making us duty managers doesnt constitute enough of a change to make us redundant. Let alone all of the additional changes to the role by them restructuring h&s and training.
I dont want to be a duty manager with responsibilities for the whole depot!
It is my belief if challenged it would be successful.
The Scoring Process can't be Relative to the current Role, regardless of the Selection method Suitability is to the New Management Role, there is no Credability in any claim that the current role plays a part in the selection process is a nonsense, which is why the criteria and selection is based on personal attributes of the individual, they would never be able to make people redundant based on their performance in the current role, as it it will cease to exist, you can't lay off a person saying " you can't do a role well enough even though that role is going", Nonsense.
Hence scoring on Personal Attributes, the only role that then becomes relative is the New One.
If the company can lay off, due to the fact that an individual doesn't have the personal attributes for the New role and New tasks then the New Role is Significantly Different, Ergo also different enough for someone to not want to do it and their current role is redundant and should be granted an exit Package.
It needs challenging, those that leave with nothing because they do not wish to continue in the New Role should explore constructive dismissal in my opinion.
Business Moving with the times and needing to become leaner is Credible, Manipulating restructures to avoid redundancy rights is very Naughty.
The New Management Role is Significantly Different not least having increased responsibility. If people do not wish to take on the role and can't stay as they are, then they are redundant to the Business, the company should give them an exit package.
Even P Clarke got one of those and look at the mess he made.
Duracell, without wanting to be critical of the unions part in this whole process , is that (challenging) what the company are proposing to implement.....all we get back from the "consultation " meeting is a endless stream of frequently asked questions (which are always balanced in the favour of the company) i.e. Question Will there be workshops to write CV's / interview skills Answer no job centre plus provide this service .... Question, will voluntary redundancy be offered Answer no we want to retain the best managers and the challenge from the union to these derogatory response were in the words of Uriah Heep were
"keep yourself down." I am very umble ...., Master Tesco" ....!!!!
Chapter XXXIX
It will be interesting to see who stays and goes in my DC. Some managers are good. Some just drink coffee and smoke all day. It will be good to see who stays. If the company say they are keeping the best then surely that's good. The bad ones need to go. Maybe the company have finally listened to what matters to you results. Time will tell
Quote from: Welsh-Hugh on 19-02-17, 10:43PM
It will be interesting to see who stays and goes in my DC. Some managers are good. Some just drink coffee and smoke all day. It will be good to see who stays. If the company say they are keeping the best then surely that's good. The bad ones need to go. Maybe the company have finally listened to what matters to you results. Time will tell
Welsh-Hugh , the whole point that I and others have been trying to make is that the process of deciding who stays and goes is based on the opinion of the "senior team" and If were being honest these are the very people who are more likely than not going to be working "shoulder to shoulder" with the managers you speak ill of, (in either the smoke shed or at the coffee machine )!!!!
Quote from: optout on 19-02-17, 08:21PM
M1lktrayMan
...maybe. BUT, who is it that decides (or has already decided) that it is a 'matching' role?????????????
and exactly what Duracell says,
I can't see tesco wanting to get into a fight over this, and even if they did they must know that their chances of winning are not the best, and what have you got to lose by pushing??????
If whether a new role matches is disputed, ultimately it would be for an industrial tribunal to decide. Duracell makes a very good point that the company could be manipulating restructuring to avoid redundancies. We should beware of them pushing the 'reasonable alternative' (be it contracted hours or role) to the limit and scaring those affected into a take it or leave it choice. The company is likely to bank on no-one going to the trouble of a tribunal claim and those that do would need to have real justification that the change is unreasonable - not just that they don't want to do it.
Shouldn't the union be challenging this issue in our behalf ? for example you wouldn't employ an account and expect ( put simply) add up your own sums !!!!!
Alli bloody looya, somebody gets it. This is what I've been saying for months, it's the Union that should be forcing the issue with Tosco with regards to these enquiries not the members. If they are not doing what they are paid to do get rid of them. >:( >:( >:(
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 19-02-17, 10:31PM
Duracell, without wanting to be critical of the unions part in this whole process , is that (challenging) what the company are proposing to implement.....all we get back from the "consultation " meeting is a endless stream of frequently asked questions (which are always balanced in the favour of the company) i.e. Question Will there be workshops to write CV's / interview skills Answer no job centre plus provide this service .... Question, will voluntary redundancy be offered Answer no we want to retain the best managers and the challenge from the union to these derogatory response were in the words of Uriah Heep were
"keep yourself down." I am very umble ...., Master Tesco" ....!!!!
Chapter XXXIX
So if a Manager wants to go, but has scored well and has no Redundancy option, but doesn't want to stay with the added responsibilities, why can't a Grievance be put in, I realise that AO or Sata rep support may be scarce, but some are adamant that the Union are useless anyway get rid of them, union support is not a grievance criteria. You have a a Grievance. It is a credible one in my opinion.
Obviously though those affected have to follow that process. You would have to if you pull out of or get rid of the Union.
If I am deemed "at risk" after my 1-1 will i be allowed to go immediately if I'm offered another job elsewhere or would I be expected to stay and train the new podium monkeys up which could be quite long winded ?
Any info much appreciated.
Alwaysthevictim....you would be expected to work your full notice. They will probably give you a minimum number of weeks that they expect, however if you want to leave after the minimum or sooner you will be expected to put it in writing as a 'counter offer'.
Obvious danger here is loosing out on PILON. Although if that were to be the case nothing to stop you going sick as this would count as your notice...
You can't lose out on PILON as PILON isn't being paid.
In fact as you have already said, you would be expected to work your full notice.
PILON was paid at Lich and Hinkley...
My point was if you were to request early release after 4 weeks for example and request the remainder as PILON, you may lose out depending on what sort of mood the powers that be are on that particular day.
Apparebtly there is an expectation that if the depot is safe after 4 weeks then they will look at pilon.
One ground for grievance could be that the company have failed to follow their own 'guidelines for redundancies'. In this document it states that voluntary redundancies should be offered to affected staff and the criteria must include absence. This can be found on the internal company website
If you really didn't like the new.role and chose to resign I'd say you'd have a good chance at a constructive dismissal case.
What is written with the Heading of the Partnership Agreement does not apply to distribution unless it says so and it doesn't it applies to Stores and Fulfilment Centers.
There is grounds as you say though as the Gov and ACAS guidelines say so.
I wouldn't recommend people don't challenge and resign to then claim Unfair Dismissal, I would challenge during the consultation and get the response in writing.
Any Alternative Employment should not be Conditional, it would be interesting to see a tribunals understanding and scope of conditional,
In my view Giving up service related elements that will be continued to be paid to others is a condition.
Just in case some of those at risk are considering a Podium role.
I think they will trip up by not gauging the voluntary option, it could quite possibly have the desired effect.
They can still vet and choose the candidates also.
No consideration to voluntary may prove problematic for the company, most guidelines expect it to be thoroughly explored, if they haven't engaged the possibility with individuals concerned then it's a guess at best. It could prove more beneficial all round.
Quote from: Duracell on 21-02-17, 04:39PM
What is written with the Heading of the Partnership Agreement does not apply to distribution unless it says so and it doesn't it applies to Stores and Fulfilment Centers.
There is grounds as you say though as the Gov and ACAS guidelines say so.
I wouldn't recommend people don't challenge and resign to then claim Unfair Dismissal, I would challenge during the consultation and get the response in writing.
Any Alternative Employment should not be Conditional, it would be interesting to see a tribunals understanding and scope of conditional,
In my view Giving up service related elements that will be continued to be paid to others is a condition.
Just in case some of those at risk are considering a Podium role.
I think they will trip up by not gauging the voluntary option, it could quite possibly have the desired effect.
They can still vet and choose the candidates also.
No consideration to voluntary may prove problematic for the company, most guidelines expect it to be thoroughly explored, if they haven't engaged the possibility with individuals concerned then it's a guess at best. It could prove more beneficial all round.
It doesn't have any heading relating to the partnership agreement. This is a company document available through the my dc page. It applies to distribution.
It was last updated April 2015 (just after the last reshuffle)and is the latest available guideline.
I agree people should challenge as much as possible and my suggestion was made more of a last resort example.
The role should have been made redundant and those wanting the new one should have to apply. That way they can vet who they want for the new role and then people actually want to be there.
Ah ok I see yes I agree.
After having to deal with all my DC's screw-ups on a daily basis- deliveries hours late or early, cages so poorly stacked they fall apart as the come off the ramp, missing stock etc etc - it's hard for me to have much sympathy for any DC managers who get made redundent.
And by, "much" I really mean, "any".
I'm pleased that was directed at the Depot Managers and not the level 1's, although I'm not sure it's they who are getting made redundant that are responsible. I think the real blame belongs to the pr*cks above them who crave their K.P.I. fix. With no regards to Health and Safety or Duty of Care they bully their way from one shift to the next.
I wish there was a rule that they had to make one Shift Manager redundant for every five Team Managers made redundant, that would make ours the happiest Depot in Britain. >:( >:( >:( b*st*rds >:( >:( >:(
If you think it will get better after they have gone Mr Putin you are sadly mistaken
Quote from: VladPutin on 24-02-17, 07:40PM
After having to deal with all my DC's screw-ups on a daily basis- deliveries hours late or early, cages so poorly stacked they fall apart as the come off the ramp, missing stock etc etc - it's hard for me to have much sympathy for any DC managers who get made redundent.
And by, "much" I really mean, "any".
So they should spend more time disciplining staff for poor standards? Interesting viewpoint...
It's not TMs who stack cages and load trailers...and if you think it's going to get better after the cut, think again.
The only reason you get poor standards (didn't think I'd have to spell it out) is because of the pressure and constant threats of disciplinary action put on pickers and loaders to complete their work in unrealistic times is unacceptable. Couple this with an unfathomable layout and p*ss poor Management this all leads to an unhappy workforce,but who gives a sh*te as long as the figures are right eh! Perhaps a bit more thought next time Vlad. :-*
I call B/S. With performance combined people cheat the numbers easily on loading/marshalling and FLT to hide p##s poor performance/standards elsewhere. Loaders who achieve 160% by double scanning and abusing AMC functions then pick at 50% for example. Got to ask what they do with all this extra time cos it doesn't improve loading or stacking standards does it?
No the problems you describe are caused by bone idleness of people who think they are owed a living and should get 100% wages for 80% or less of a days work...
When was the last time anyone was disciplined over poor performance in your DC? Must be 2 years or more in mine. We have women of 50+ years of age who do the job with no issues....why is it so hard for a 20 year old man? Every DC covers poor Tesco performance with additional agency staff. Tell me another company that accepts that?
Agree that some TMs are poor....however you are living in a dream land. (But thanks for spelling it out....very enlightening)
keokrusader you do sound like a disgruntled Team Manager from your post, if so and you are made redundant don't spend your enforced early retirement blaming pickers and loaders, think about who is really responsible. Before that happens can you post the details of your DC so I can apply for a transfer, sounds like the level of work would fit right in with the dream land I frequent. ;)
Nice guess but not correct.
I did come perilously close to caring for a second I must admit.
Give it a few years and Tesco will have been run into the ground. You can blame management as much as you like (from TM level right up to Dave Lewis himself) but not to accept that a portion of the blame lies with WL1s (Not all) is very short sighted. Tesco doesn't owe anyone a living...
Carry on living in dream land and you'll be scratching your head when it rolls down.
At the end of the day it's business and that means profit. Can't make profit without performance targets can you. If you can find a successful business that does I'll be impressed.
Just think it's a very sad state of affairs to see people on here revel in others misfortune. God forbid you find yourself in the same position one day.
DL is not doing anything other CEOs have not done in other organisations. Tossco just seem to get more coverage due to it being a main employer. Staff in least profit departments and middle management will always be first to be attacked as well as those where mergers are taking place ie Tossco DC with Booker. The CEO knows alot of GAs would do anything for a extra £/hour. The express SM could be based in his house spending an hour in any shops in his/her charge only when need be. The Runners should be looking after the GAs the rest of the time on there extra £. If he/she cannot manage half a dozen GAs it should be a disciplinary issue. Large stores should be run on an SM and 3/4 managers to cover a 24/7 operation. Night fill should be scrapped in every store and staff should be put on the floor when customers are about. GAs might have to slow down but more could be employed with all the SMs LMs and premiums which have been scrapped. Low hours should be put in place to p**s people off so that no one stays too long suing the company for manual labour ailments. If you don't like it go to private businesses they may care more about colleagues but you wont get away with standing doing nothing for the last hour of your shift and queuing to clock out 2 minutes early. There I have said it. >:(
Quote from keokrusader;
QuoteI call B/S. With performance combined people cheat the numbers easily on loading/marshalling and FLT to hide p##s poor performance/standards elsewhere. Loaders who achieve 160% by double scanning and abusing AMC functions then pick at 50% for example. Got to ask what they do with all this extra time cos it doesn't improve loading or stacking standards does it?
No the problems you describe are caused by bone idleness of people who think they are owed a living and should get 100% wages for 80% or less of a days work...
Silly me,see I saw that as a direct attack on all level 1's, particularly on flt's and loaders,quite a nasty one at that. Reading this it seems they are entirely to blame. Why I say "silly me" I didn't realise that in your next post you would express you only meant they should take "
a portion" of the blame and "
not all" of them anyway.
Quote from keokrusader;
QuoteYou can blame management as much as you like (from TM level right up to Dave Lewis himself) but not to accept that a portion of the blame lies with WL1s (Not all) is very short sighted.
Lastly the reasons I thought you must be a Team Manager was (a) because of the bleating in your tone and (2) Because of that 80% work 100% wages b*llsh*t you came out with. I came across a Senior Manager who used to come out with that sh*te when dealing with DISCIPLINARY cases, your seemingly not familiar with them. Again what DC where you at?
At no point In either post did I blame WL1s as a collective. How you choose to (mis)interpret my post however is none of my concern.
As for what I do and where, that is irrelevant. Keep on fishing tho....makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside.
With regards to picking and loading standards, I think having managers on the floor in our DC(READING DC) will make all staff, both agency and Tesco work as they should be. Inorder to hit % and cph without cheating on any skill is not hard, if people put the effort in. The problem is that lots of people just do not work very hard, I both load/marshal & pick & have no problem hitting % and loading 40/50/60 cph. The stacking of some pickers at READING DC is frankly unbelievable. I think the operational changes are a good idea, but the management cull maybe not.
Quote from: keokrusader on 24-02-17, 11:11PM
Quote from: VladPutin on 24-02-17, 07:40PM
After having to deal with all my DC's screw-ups on a daily basis- deliveries hours late or early, cages so poorly stacked they fall apart as the come off the ramp, missing stock etc etc - it's hard for me to have much sympathy for any DC managers who get made redundent.
And by, "much" I really mean, "any".
So they should spend more time disciplining staff for poor standards? Interesting viewpoint...
It's not TMs who stack cages and load trailers...and if you think it's going to get better after the cut, think again.
So what are they good for? Might as well get rid of them if they have no effect on the deliveries we get in store.
The days of getting a nice wage for a worthless non-job even a woman could do are coming to an end. If you're willing or able to do some real work - don't let the door hit your arse on the way out. 8-)
Top bit of sexism there. Very modern...
Don't worry about me. I am definitely not afraid of work....and my future is very rosy indeed Thank you. More to life than Tesco.
They way people moan about it makes me wonder why anyone works there at all?
Quote from: Jonthebarsteward on 21-02-17, 03:10PM
Apparebtly there is an expectation that if the depot is safe after 4 weeks then they will look at pilon.
One ground for grievance could be that the company have failed to follow their own 'guidelines for redundancies'. In this document it states that voluntary redundancies should be offered to affected staff and the criteria must include absence. This can be found on the internal company website
If you really didn't like the new.role and chose to resign I'd say you'd have a good chance at a constructive dismissal case.
All the briefs that we've had are all very clear, all those being made redundant, will be expected to work their full notice period. Leaving before will put the redundancy payment at risk i.e. leave with nothing
If managers had actually managed over the years and done a brilliant job then perhaps there would not be the cuts. Yes stacking is bad. Loaders cut corners etc etc. But who is to blame. Loaders and pickers get away with it because they can. Managers should be walking in lanes checking quality. Managers should be on bays checking quality of loaders. Reality is that never happens. When managers should be managing they don't. They manage from a comfy desk in office normally drinking endless coffee. I said it before and I will say it again. Managers have had it to easy too long and their time is up. Good riddance to they're laziness.
Quote from: keokrusader on 25-02-17, 05:27PM
Top bit of sexism there. Very modern...
Don't worry about me. I am definitely not afraid of work....and my future is very rosy indeed Thank you. More to life than Tesco.
They way people moan about it makes me wonder why anyone works there at all?
Trump is the most powerful man in the world. Sexism is cool again >:D
My site is down in Kent about to be taken over by Tesco. We had the visit early in January to tell us they was taking us in house since then not a word!
The redundancy numbers and positions has obviously leaked out and still not a word from Tesco's Senior Team" nice work guys great way to treat your new staff"
Can anyone tell us what process, facts and figures they have been using at your sites for the elimination of Team Managers. I have seen ERRIC mentioned but don't know the fella! Can anyone fill us in please?
Can anyone at Hinckley tell us what the shift pattern is for the Team Managers kept on? as I'm guessing they are not the best with the numbers you have left
My Denver and admin colleagues I believe are at risk of redundancy as well and are not aware of this can any share information on his please.
Regarding no voluntary redundancies for Team Managers how many sites are challenging the legality in relation to the new title created which is a totally new role?
Any other information on what is coming our way would be much appreciated.
Hey cabbagepotchschill, why don't you come clean and post as a nosey freaking journo?
For me at least, you come across as a noobbbb :-X
Thank you tesco,for ripping the heart out of Magor managers,the best bunch of guys and girls i work with.
Hi Opshunned
Not a journalist maybe a noobbbb depending on who you speak too! Not sure whether to be offended or to take it as a compliment.
If I was a journalist wouldn't I be writing a negative story against Tesco and the redundancies?
All I am asking is for any possible information which can help us at Snodland to prepare for what is coming our way and any options we have as we have been left in the dark by Tesco's.
I can confirm that Snodland staff have not been given any info about Tesco,s plans since the announcement this year.Managers and admin staff are aware of what,s happening at other DC,s and are concerned for there future.I think it reasonable that somebody should ask for advise on this site as I have in the past,I would hope that such info is forthcoming.
Thanks baldeagle for the comment any info would be much appreciated we know the numbers of Team Managers and Shift Managers they want and what the roles going forward are but no info how they will action the redundancies other than what we have read on this forum.
Just want to say, I hope those affected get the outcome they hope for tomorrow
Quote from: Jonthebarsteward on 26-02-17, 05:27PM
Just want to say, I hope those affected get the outcome they hope for tomorrow
My DCM say that a great deal of "EMPATHY" has been shown at his DC and those who have been job matched (i.e. Got a future) have been relieved but flat b......s they known they've been safe for weeks and anybody else who tells m otherwise is deluded...,
Quote from: Welsh-Hugh on 25-02-17, 06:55PM
If managers had actually managed over the years and done a brilliant job then perhaps there would not be the cuts. Yes stacking is bad. Loaders cut corners etc etc. But who is to blame. Loaders and pickers get away with it because they can. Managers should be walking in lanes checking quality. Managers should be on bays checking quality of loaders. Reality is that never happens. When managers should be managing they don't. They manage from a comfy desk in office normally drinking endless coffee. I said it before and I will say it again. Managers have had it to easy too long and their time is up. Good riddance to they're laziness.
Actually Welsh-Hugh if actually took time to understand what the new structure involves, you would see that Tesco don't want managers checking the lanes for quality , they want poor deluded souls like your self selling their colleagues down the line for 30 pieces of silver , so here's s very apt adage that typifies you down to the ground "yes:sir,no sir 3 bags full sir, baa , baa .....
Quote from: Cabbagepatch on 26-02-17, 08:08AM
Hi Opshunned
Not a journalist maybe a noobbbb depending on who you speak too! Not sure whether to be offended or to take it as a compliment.
If I was a journalist wouldn't I be writing a negative story against Tesco and the redundancies?
All I am asking is for any possible information which can help us at Snodland to prepare for what is coming our way and any options we have as we have been left in the dark by Tesco's.
Cabbagepatch I for one would welcome it if you were a journalist, and we could get our stories out to the public about what Lewis and Davies are really all about.
Unfortunately, the national press don't seem interested (I've written to several tabloids without reply)
In answer to your question, if you bow down to everything your shift managers says, or if you play golf /drink with the DCM or sleep with the PM then your job is safe, if not you're F....d, good luck for the future, but you'll probably be the person stood behind me in the dole queue !!!!!!!
Our night shift managers got told last night. Mood isnt good. I take it all dcs are being told at the same tim?
Quote from: Dip and drive on 28-02-17, 07:17AM
Our night shift managers got told last night. Mood isnt good. I take it all dcs are being told at the same tim?
Yes 30 days consultancy started yesterday so everyone will be told around the same time.
Not sure what they (Tesco) aim to achieve by making managers work their notice, but as you can imagine, being told you aren't good enough and that no longer have a job, isn't going to motivate the effected people to walk around with smiles on their faces.
I agree with the above post, knowing g you have no job at the end of the notice isn't going to fill you will drive to work your arse off. I would certainly be doing the bare minimum in such a position.
wow- what a morning at Magor! a massive cull of managers with a few huge shocks along the way ! Hell only knows what the PM shift and night shift have got coming but this was brutal...some very good experienced managers gone so far...time will tell if errors have been made but I am not alone in thinking that some of these were " safe as houses " ..sad times at TESCO
Sorry I'm lost :-[
Aswell as the two Depots closing in June have they now done something to the rest of the Depots with regards to manager culling :question:
No this is in the Express format.
No, this is in depot's as its in the distribution forum.
Expresses are also having a cull as well though.
With the title "Management Restructure" it's a broad ranging title. Seen as BOTH are going through a "restructure"
Ok still lost ;D
I know Deputy Managers in Expresses have been given consultations & the two depots mentioned in January which are to close around June.
But what is this about Night shift managers etc
Was this part of the plans in January with the two depots to also look at other depots & restructure those to?
Tom, in answer to your question, team managers are being halved across all sites. The managers that are going were all told yesterday.
This is the restructure for distribution. Started back in September.
55% reduction in manager population at my Dc. My 30 days started yesterday.
Quote from: bluebird1234 on 28-02-17, 02:57PM
wow- what a morning at Magor! a massive cull of managers with a few huge shocks along the way ! Hell only knows what the PM shift and night shift have got coming but this was brutal...some very good experienced managers gone so far...time will tell if errors have been made but I am not alone in thinking that some of these were " safe as houses " ..sad times at TESCO
It's a very sad fact that the ERRIC the company's savour, is not based on any scientific reasoning (i.e. Psychometric testing), but on the basis of how the senior team feel you meet the criteria, do basically nepotism and cronyism are rife, with in Tesco , is the GM doing to sack his drinking buddy, is the PM going to sack her toy boy , is the shift manager going to sack his brother etc. clearly not , with this in mind, there's only been one surprise at my depot and I would wager that gets over turned at some point .
Yes I gave Erric way to much credit.
Some staggering shocking decisions.
I suspect some serious backlash to follow.
How can a Senior Team who have been shown in the past to be corrupt and who in reality should be spending time at Her Majesty's pleasure have the moral authority to make any decisions with regards to anybody's future? >:( >:( >:( B*st*ards >:( >:( >:(
Quote from: Shiiiitinit on 28-02-17, 04:41PM
Tom, in answer to your question, team managers are being halved across all sites. The managers that are going were all told yesterday.
Quote from: Shiiiitinit on 28-02-17, 04:41PM
Tom, in answer to your question, team managers are being halved across all sites. The managers that are going were all told yesterday.
Thanks & good luck to those involved :(
With DCs and Express now effected all that is left is the large stores, goodbye 20-40K shelf fillers. They could replace all the LMs with a Shift Runner on £1 more per hour in fact give them £2 so they will run faster. I would do the trial no pay to see some of them getting the boot. It is hard to find a LM who does not disappear is interested and knows what is happening on the shop floor at all times.
Quote from: snowyowl on 01-03-17, 07:12AM
How can a Senior Team who have been shown in the past to be corrupt and who in reality should be spending time at Her Majesty's pleasure have the moral authority to make any decisions with regards to anybody's future? >:( >:( >:( B*st*ards >:( >:( >:(
Unfortunately it's the way the toilet and the simple one want it , Tesco are building a house of cards.
ERRIC would be a great tool if used correctly , but when's it's based on subjective opinions, then ifs totally inappropriate, for example a vegetarian would never score sirloin steak high, so some managers were doomed from the very start .
I think Middlesbrough got told yesterday, or could be today. Either way I'm sure it will be a wonderful working atmosphere in the Depot today. Good luck to them all. :thumbup:
I think most managers in phase 1 will now know their fate, despite what some people think, there are a hell of a lot of good people being throw on the scrap heap to pay for the mistakes of others higher up the food chain- the majority who have left the company with very handsome remuneration packages .
The one thing that surprises me though, is considering the number of people involved, how few have posted on here , even if they're happy to leave Tesco, I would have thought there would have been a bigger backlash against the company.
Agree 100% with all of the above...still early days regarding a backlash as there are still a few to be informed ...the ones " at risk " are starting their one 2 ones now and there are bound to be a few fireworks during the next 28 days...still think there's going to be a few more twists
What is the toilet and the simple one.......not sure I follow?
Surely the DCM would want to keep the best Managers and get rid of the not so good?
Call me naive but that what I would do if I had to make difficult decisions, makes no sense to get rid of the best and keep the worst. I've no problems with what I've heard so far in my DC.
It's not about capability, it's about cost.
Sorry about my last post, load of b*ll*cks, misinformed. ???
We are way behind you down in Kent we finally had a visit from a couple of Senior Tesco managers who held a couple of sessions with some of our Tm's. The feedback we got back from them was all's rosy at your sites, that help will be given to people unsuccessful in keeping there jobs and that the new structure is a success!
Apparently Tesco talking to our management next week until then we still have no real info on what is coming other than the carnage of cuts!
Good luck to everyone made redundant hope it all turns out well for you!
Quote from: Wonderwoman on 02-03-17, 12:13AM
What is the toilet and the simple one.......not sure I follow?
Surely the DCM would want to keep the best Managers and get rid of the not so good?
Call me naive but that what I would do if I had to make difficult decisions, makes no sense to get rid of the best and keep the worst. I've no problems with what I've heard so far in my DC.
The toilett is the distribution personnel manager (you just need to replace one of the letters) but the name as it reads is very apt cause she's full of s**t. The simple one is the distribution stream director for the north "I'm just a simple lad from ..." is how he likes to introduce himself
If you read my post correctly, it's about ERRIC being applied on the basis of opinion, as opposed to fact and that clearly is wrong , if tesco believe that ERRIC is the way forward then they would have used psychometric tests to determine a persons score in each category.
Quote from: Cabbagepatch on 02-03-17, 10:37AM
We are way behind you down in Kent we finally had a visit from a couple of Senior Tesco managers who held a couple of sessions with some of our Tm's. The feedback we got back from them was all's rosy at your sites, that help will be given to people unsuccessful in keeping there jobs and that the new structure is a success!
Apparently Tesco talking to our management next week until then we still have no real info on what is coming other than the carnage of cuts!
Good luck to everyone made redundant hope it all turns out well for you!
Yet more lies, only Litchfield and Hinckley have new structure, all the other DC's are currently in the process of 30 days consultation. There is absolutely no help being given to the unsuccessful people- other than being given the opportunity to step down in to a coordinators role or given a list of the vacancies in stores.
This is what your new structure will look like
1 Depot Manager
1 people manager overseeing 2 sites
1 safety and people manager ( training manager and health and safety manager role combined)
1 OSM (finance manager) overseeing 2 sites
3 shift managers
5 team managers per shift (15 in total) - all to cover the duty manager role
1 people clerk per shift (3 in total)
6 (work level 1 ) warehouse coordinators per shift (premium of £6 per week)
Slightly different for some sites...dependant on size/volumes/location.
Goole for example will have 21 TMs, 7 on each shift.
Not all site will be doubled up either, livingston for example remains standalone for geopraphical reasons.
I agree, there will be a small variance from site to site, but the reduction in terms of percentage wil be roughly the same - the management team will be reduced by around 55 %.
All fresh sites will be broadly similar, with the numbers 3 shift managers and 15 team managers
personnally,im devastated,what the hell have they done,some of our best managers at Magor,,going.defies beliefe. >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:(
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 02-03-17, 03:54PM
Quote from: Cabbagepatch on 02-03-17, 10:37AM
We are way behind you down in Kent we finally had a visit from a couple of Senior Tesco managers who held a couple of sessions with some of our Tm's. The feedback we got back from them was all's rosy at your sites, that help will be given to people unsuccessful in keeping there jobs and that the new structure is a success!
Apparently Tesco talking to our management next week until then we still have no real info on what is coming other than the carnage of cuts!
Good luck to everyone made redundant hope it all turns out well for you!
Yet more lies, only Litchfield and Hinckley have new structure, all the other DC's are currently in the process of 30 days consultation. There is absolutely no help being given to the unsuccessful people- other than being given the opportunity to step down in to a coordinators role or given a list of the vacancies in stores.
This is what your new structure will look like
1 Depot Manager
1 people manager overseeing 2 sites
1 safety and people manager ( training manager and health and safety manager role combined)
1 OSM (finance manager) overseeing 2 sites
3 shift managers
5 team managers per shift (15 in total) - all to cover the duty manager role
1 people clerk per shift (3 in total)
6 (work level 1 ) warehouse coordinators per shift (premium of £6 per week)
No help is being given to DMs in Express as well,
Not a word from the Union,
And to top it all the list of vacancies given had DC jobs in them as well,, It had to be pointed out to them that our DC is Under 45 days as well ??? yep they had to look at each other wondering what was going on 8-)
Think its a case of get it over with , get them out and who cares sad :( but the truth
To be honest it's a total joke, the press release says that they will be working with all the effected people to help than secure new jobs . This is a blatant lie, i asked if the company would support with CV and interview skills work shops and was told to go to Job Centre Plus .... in other words you've served us well for the past 25+ years now **** off
Complete shambles. The whole point of the new structure was its based on ERRIC....i am not witnessing much empathy from anyone WL3 or above.
I have asked for early release as i have another job to go to. Been told that i can leave early but will lose out on the remainder of my notice as they wont pay PILON.
Wouldnt be so bad if they hadnt paid it at Lichfield/Hinkley/Chesterfield/Welham Green and head office when they were restructured.
Historically we have paid people off due to them being problem causers or unmanageable...so you get 6k for being a pain in the a**e, yet 10/15/20 years service and they'll screw you out of a few grand.
Totally disgusting way to behave....and its not a cost saving!
Personally, very happy to be leaving and dont think it could have worked out any better for me. But the way they are carrying on now leaves a very sour taste.
Keokrudader I agree 100% with you this whole sorry episode has been a disgrace.
The ERRIC scores has totally been manipulated too ensure that certain people got the jobs and certain people didn't.
it's not only the work level 3 'stagy should be hanging their heads in shame (at my depot at least) there's quite a few work levels 2's who should take a long hard themselves and their actions in the mirror , and reflect on what could have been.
I am saddened to see how people who I have know, worked alongside and supported over the past 10 -15 years , now don't speak to me, whether that's because they're embarrassed , I can't say but none the less , it doesn't make it any easier .
What is even more disgusting, is that I had to sit through the lies about " the vision of Tesco of the future " broadcast at at the People First Roadshow by our fantastic Distribution Leadership Team ...
Agreed. Nothing but lies for years.
Remember the one about improving communication and getting a list of all managers together for regular updates etc? I haven't heard a thing funnily enough...
Boils my p**s that all the while they were spinning us these yarns at the roadshows they knew full well what was in the pipeline.
Also been disappointed by some of the behaviour I've seen over the last week. However some of the guys are showing real character in the way they have acted. Sad to see what is being lost.
What even p****s me off even more, is that my people manager, who is the self proclaimed " queen of the people" hasn't given me a second thought over the past 4 or 5 weeks, whilst telling DLT how she and the DC's senior team have acted with the utmost empathy... in the words of Jim Royle .... empathy my a***
Was hinkley a trial site? The reason im asking is because there are vacancies for team managers on the notice board in work.
Yeah Hinckley is one of the pilot sites
How can they make managers redundant and advertise so soon for managers?
How are the podium people coping with the pressure of controlling the work stations?
The law says that you can't replace the role made redundant within 6 months of the role they was deemed no longer to be required, in the same sense anybody made redundant, can not apply to work for the company they have been made redundant from for 6 months.
So my guess , is that this vacancy is to replace one of the "chosen few" who has decided that the job is not for them and found work elsewhere?
Quote from: Dip and drive on 07-03-17, 09:02AM
How can they make managers redundant and advertise so soon for managers?
How are the podium people coping with the pressure of controlling the work stations?
You will probably hear very little from either of the pilot sites , it seems that they have all signed the official secret act!!!!!
I haven't even been told there wuz any help with writing CV's. Where did you hear about the job centre - do t*sco arrange it if you ask? I haven't wrote a CV in years!!!!!
Its another let down from Tesco that they have not even made any effort to help those that are being made redundant , Not a work of help has been given to D/Ms since they got told 10 days ago >:( but that's Tesco..............
Quote from: lachicaverde on 07-03-17, 06:41PM
I haven't even been told there wuz any help with writing CV's. Where did you hear about the job centre - do t*sco arrange it if you ask? I haven't wrote a CV in years!!!!!
It was on the list of frequently asked questions that were asked by the various depots at the consultation meetings, but if you ask your people manager they should be able to get you the answers.
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 06-03-17, 10:49AM
To be honest it's a total joke, the press release says that they will be working with all the effected people to help than secure new jobs . This is a blatant lie, i asked if the company would support with CV and interview skills work shops and was told to go to Job Centre Plus .... in other words you've served us well for the past 25+ years now **** off
Unfortunately Tesco ask for companies ,and jobcentre plus and other agencies to come in to affected DCs etc ,but,it is down to those companies and Jobcentre plus if they choose to come in .
Quote from: lachicaverde on 07-03-17, 06:41PM
I haven't even been told there wuz any help with writing CV's. Where did you hear about the job centre - do t*sco arrange it if you ask? I haven't wrote a CV in years!!!!!
Don't expect any help from Tesco - easy to blame them for lack of support, but in all honesty what does anyone in Tesco know about CVs and interviews? Most CA interviews are embarrassing - 5 minutes, tops! PMs would probably rather you believe they were being unsupportive than admit their ignorance about CVs and interviews - most of them only got their jobs by sucking up to senior managers (it would be a laugh to watch them coaching a redundant colleague in that technique!)
It probably is best to ask for advice from the Job Centre. They do have workshops for such things - although more usually for long-term unemployed, they may also support people who haven't had to look for a new job for a long while. The best advice I can give with CVs is to break down your experience into skills (rather than just job titles) and include those acquired running a home, hobbies, etc. It can be surprising just how much you have to offer a new employer.
At the DC that I am at they held CV workshops (approx 2-3 hours) over the course of 3 weeks ,but this is not run by Tesco. Also as this DC is closing totally ,there were about 440 people being made redundant ,so a totally different situation to where there are 10-30 people. All Tesco can do is invite them and offer rooms,equipment etc.
Now the dust has settled and managers know if they are staying or going .....is it too much to ask for a decent pay rise (1st decent rise in years)if staying as the company has admitted your the cream of the crop in what you do.
Just a thought
thank you for the advice Arizonarugby, Blutopia and Picktocube. its hard to know where to start sometimes!
Let's see what's coming now I guess.
Dear colleagues,
I would like to invite you to attend a call where I will brief you on an important business update that I will need your help on communicating with colleagues tomorrow.
Please make every effort to attend the call. The dial in details will be issued to you on email 15 minutes before the call as well as in a calendar invite. Please do not forward this email on to anyone else, or share details of the call in advance. Thank you.
The call will start promptly at 8:30am so please join at 8:25am.
Tracey Clements
Thats for Convenience stores as she is director of convenience. Interesting email. Might be better to move this thread to stores forum
I'm in an extra and my store manager has had the same email
Even more interesting then
I'm convenience not large format, might not be linked.
I hope that Dave Lewis or Matt Davis read this - Unbelievably , I've seen an email from our so called support manager / who supposedly is there to help and guide the at risk managers through the redundancy process ridiculing a manger (who was told he longer had a future at Tesco) because he had to go home upset.
Not much empathy or compassion at my depot !!!!
But this thread is in the distribution warehouse sub forum
There is no empathy towards the 'at risk managers. Shocking really when some have been with the company 28 years
Any idea what this call tomorrow is about?
Quote from: Jonthebarsteward on 08-03-17, 08:17PM
But this thread is in the distribution warehouse sub forum
There is no empathy towards the 'at risk managers. Shocking really when some have been with the company 28 years
Exactly, it's so frustrating, and demoralising not being able to do anything about it. If I hadn't seen the email (shall we say) unofficial, I would report it to protector line - not that would do any good
It doesn't say who the email is for so as a deputy do i log on in SM absence :o
And how many DM's will log on in silence and listen in 8-)o
Quote from: Bleh on 08-03-17, 07:08PM
Let's see what's coming now I guess.
Dear colleagues,
I would like to invite you to attend a call where I will brief you on an important business update that I will need your help on communicating with colleagues tomorrow.
Please make every effort to attend the call. The dial in details will be issued to you on email 15 minutes before the call as well as in a calendar invite. Please do not forward this email on to anyone else, or share details of the call in advance. Thank you.
The call will start promptly at 8:30am so please join at 8:25am.
Tracey Clements
She could be announcing
They are not going ahead with dropping DM roll
They are extending the consaltation time.
They are going to increase the cushion payment
Or that they have purchased the Bugens stores that have or are shutting down.
That's all I can think they will say.
UNLESS someone has got the chop :D
I'm in an Extra store and my store manager has been told to attend a call at 8.30am tomorrow morning, seems every store manager and express shop in the country is to be on the calls, this has caused all sorts of rumours to start circulating as to what is actually going to be announced tomorrow morning.
Quote from: Spartacus77 on 08-03-17, 10:21PM
It doesn't say who the email is for so as a deputy do i log on in SM absence :o
And how many DM's will log on in silence and listen in 8-)o
don't do that the email we got said Only s/m s .as it is you will find out within half hour what it was about
was thinking the same,
But hoping a bid had been made ,, ;)
Quote from: notsofunny on 08-03-17, 11:59PM
Quote from: Spartacus77 on 08-03-17, 10:21PM
It doesn't say who the email is for so as a deputy do i log on in SM absence :o
And how many DM's will log on in silence and listen in 8-)o
don't do that the email we got said Only s/m s .as it is you will find out within half hour what it was about
email never said it was for only SMs and all stores got same email believe it could be to do with the financial scandal and they have decided what is happening....
Dear colleagues,
I would like to invite you to attend a call where I will brief you on an important business update that I will need your help on communicating with colleagues tomorrow.
Please make every effort to attend the call. The dial in details will be issued to you on email 15 minutes before the call as well as in a calendar invite. Please do not forward this email on to anyone else, or share details of the call in advance. Thank you.
The call will start promptly at 8:30am so please join at 8:25am.
An invite has also been sent.
Tracey Clements
Let me know !
We asked and we got told that it was for S/Ms only,
Our group has a few S/Ms on holiday,
Another Group got Messege on Whats up saying only S/Ms,
Quote from: notsofunny on 08-03-17, 11:59PM
Quote from: Spartacus77 on 08-03-17, 10:21PM
It doesn't say who the email is for so as a deputy do i log on in SM absence :o
And how many DM's will log on in silence and listen in 8-)o
don't do that the email we got said Only s/m s .as it is you will find out within half hour what it was about
My SM not in so will be long half hour lol... Do I, don't I ? Lol ... I'm actually scared to incase I hear the redundancy offer has been removed and I have to stay :D
What would be important enough that it needs to be communicated the same day and more importantly what is this word communicated not something we'recommend familiar with in our store that's for sure.
Quote from: Spartacus77 on 09-03-17, 06:16AM
Quote from: notsofunny on 08-03-17, 11:59PM
Quote from: Spartacus77 on 08-03-17, 10:21PM
It doesn't say who the email is for so as a deputy do i log on in SM absence :o
And how many DM's will log on in silence and listen in 8-)o
don't do that the email we got said Only s/m s .as it is you will find out within half hour what it was about
My SM not in so will be long half hour lol... Do I, don't I ? Lol ... I'm actually scared to incase I hear the redundancy offer has been removed and I have to stay :D
that's my worry as well as them extending th e 60 days.. no like someone said it's even the large stores that will be on the call.so it's got to be something else.
Takeover or someone getting the sack..well 1 hire to go lol
Perhaps drastic is leaving 😄😄😄😄
Is it significant it's being held before stock market opens?
Got to be the fraud office investigation
Anyone know what it was about yet?
No but the Distribution Centre Managers were asked on to a conference call at 08:30 by Tony Hoggett , so must be a relatively big announcement
Any details yet?
Someone posted on good things at Tesco thread 100,000 staff may have been underpaid including leavers. No more details.....
Hope I'm one of them lol
That would not warrant a company conference call would it??
If it is that then someone's really messed up ...
?
Tesco has underpaid up to 100,000 staff. Payments will be made to all affected staff. Payments likely to be betweeen £27-£40. An update will be released to the press shortly. Tesco wanted to make it clear that this was discovered by themselves and not by any outsider or external auditor as previous companies like Argos have been exposed in the past.
Anyone know why they were underpaid? Or how the figure is calculated?
In my experience, £27-£40 inaccuracies in my pay are a regular occurrence!
They have looked at the payroll going back 6 years. A full brief will be emailed to SM's today and briefed to all staff.
So they looked back 6 years and found people underpaid £27.....or roughly just over £4 a year?
Official statement: "At the end of last year as we began implementing a new payroll system we discovered an issue with the way some of our colleague benefit schemes have been processed – specifically our 'salary sacrifice' benefits, including SMART pension contributions, childcare vouchers and cycle to work. This resulted in their pay after salary sacrifice not reaching required National Living Wage levels for some colleagues".
Lol a little bit annoyed with myself that I stayed up after nightshift just to see what this was about .very disappointed now , but will I get briefed about it tonight ????8
Actually, this shows how little Tesco pay their staff, it only effects people who (after salary sacrifice) fall below the national minimum wage.. so 40000 former employees and (up to) a third of existing colleagues earn less than £7.20 an hour
140,000 staff x £40 =£560,000 , So some people will get more if 10 million pound is the underpayment figure. As it's people on below the living wage how many people are going to owe tax credits back and have redundancy figures been miscalculated?
Think you've missed a zero off that. More like 5.6 million as a conservative estimate.
So I have sorry.
Not very clear the way they have worded the statement. 1 third of current employee's is about 158000 people by my reckoning. Plus 40k former employees.. ..takes the figure closer to 8 million quid!
The statement given to sky news quoted 9.7 million.
Would this time period be about the same time period all that other skulduggery went on?
I've just seen the MtT's (pointless) thought for the week and his belief is offering people a hand up (rather than a hand out) and saying yes instead of no.
Well perhaps he should practice what he preaches , because the only hand up he has given me is the directions to the job Centre , so Matt here a little prom
Of my own, for you to reflect on
The past
Blood sweat and tears
Back sore from the toil of a hard days labour
Loyalty, commitment and enthusiasm
Living the values
Happy and content that my efforts will be rewarded
Job security, good prospects bright future
The present
Whispers in the corner
Dishonesty, lies and , deceit
Silence when I enter the room
Empty promise that can't and won't be kept
Fear , uncertainty , worthlessness
The future
Dole queue
Food bank
Repossession
Homelessness
Big Issue Seller
A fair few of the managers who have been told they are 'at risk' have gone on the sick at my DC. Has the same happened elsewhere?
Yeah, we've had a few on the sick at Reading and a couple have left for pastures new
Quote from: grim up north on 24-03-17, 03:24PM
A fair few of the managers who have been told they are 'at risk' have gone on the sick at my DC. Has the same happened elsewhere?
A few have also go sick at my DC , but can you blame them
No, you can't blame them. But if T*sco turn around next week and say too many are going won't those on the sick be harming their chances of keeping their jobs? This isn't the first, and won't be the last big T balls up.
There's a couple left our DC after finding alternative employment and I am genuinely pleased for them but it does p*ss me off that this is exactly what Tosco want that's why they have tortured them for months. >:( >:( B*st*rds >:( >:(
Quote from: grim up north on 24-03-17, 06:18PM
No, you can't blame them. But if T*sco turn around next week and say too many are going won't those on the sick be harming their chances of keeping their jobs? This isn't the first, and won't be the last big T balls up.
Firstly I genuinely believe there's more chance of me winning the lottery tonight, than Tesco changing their minds. Secondly until they are actually served their notice or been paid PILON , then they are still an employee, they may be placed on a monitoring stage, but that's all - attendance wasn't part of the selection criteria, so why should it be used if there is a change if mind .
To be honest , I have served this company well for the past 25+ years and the reward I have got is to be s**t on from a great height - I'm lucky, if my People Manager and my Shift Manager (both of whom I've dug out of many a hole) acknowledge my presence when I enter the room, may be I need to contact Doris Stokes to act a a medium !!!!
Can anyone give me the link for a copy of the managers/team leader redundancy booklet please
Phase 2 of the management restructure is being announced on Tuesday.
Good luck to the at risk managers, but don't expect and help from Tesco, DLT, your DCM, PM, support manager or the union, at the someone may hold the door open for you when you have your 1-2-1 , but other than that it's sink or swim.
Any idea what the phase 2 management restructure is?
Phase 2 is the second part of distributions restructure, reducing the management team by 60% and I don't expect it to end there.
The Line Managers I know are basically doing a TLs job on an over inflated salary. :thumbdown:
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 14-04-17, 06:29PM
Phase 2 is the second part of distributions restructure, reducing the management team by 60% and I don't expect it to end there.
Transport Management is the next phrase at our Livingston Distribution Centre. I have to say, I never had much regard for the Team Managers at our DC, but the way the GM treated those poor Managers who he told we're going was brutal an utter disgrace....Totally degraded each one of them and stripped them of the dignity. More than twenty of them are signed off work with stress and depression......If any of our Tesco Directors are monitoring this page, then I ask you to bring that GM to account for what he did. Is this the type of management we want at Tesco in 2017??....😔
Transport Management or none of it, does this mean no deliveries will be on time if they come at all. F Sake!
Quote from: Billy Budd on 14-04-17, 09:06PM
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 14-04-17, 06:29PM
Phase 2 is the second part of distributions restructure, reducing the management team by 60% and I don't expect it to end there.
Transport Management is the next phrase at our Livingston Distribution Centre. I have to say, I never had much regard for the Team Managers at our DC, but the way the GM treated those poor Managers who he told we're going was brutal an utter disgrace....Totally degraded each one of them and stripped them of the dignity. More than twenty of them are signed off work with stress and depression......If any of our Tesco Directors are monitoring this page, then I ask you to bring that GM to account for what he did. Is this the type of management we want at Tesco in 2017??....😔
I guess it's the same at all depots, my GM talks the talk, and promise me the world and everything in it , but these are hollow words , the only help I've been given is a list of jobs to apply for most of which won't exist in the next 12 months i.e. compliance manager, night manager etc.
It's a lot like being in the playground waiting to be picked for the football team, only difference is you never get picked for anything and I'm lucky if anyone actually speaks to me .
Unfortunately Arizonarugby hollow promises are in all walks of life. Managers sometimes tell their staff black is white just to get the job done quicker. WL 2's do it to WL 1. WL 3's do it to WL 2 and so on. At the time the managers see it as 'just doing their job'. Then when it happens to them, it's not right or moral. It seems to be the way T work.
Hopefully the next morons to get the chop include the genuises at Head Office who decided to move Fresh Counts to Easter Weekend Saturday... 8-)
did you mean to say 'fresh counts' then?
Has there been any news on PILON being offered yet?
Our DC has the coordinators trained and they go live next week apparently
I hope so, I've nearly run out of sick pay!!!
Another prime example of Tesco's people first and open and honest policies.
All the "safe" managers have week given new shift patterns starting week 10 (28/4/2017)
The "at risk " managers now don't get copied in on emails etc and there's been more secret meetings and whispers in corridors, either my shift manager is Kim Philby or the fat lady has started to sing.
Not sure why they can't be honest with us , not exactly a shining example of how to engage your people ...
Message to the DLT (if any of them actually read this forum) it's now been almost 12 months since the "people first roadshows) and there's still no sign of "the bus" !!!!
LMAO ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
PILON is being paid at our site, this is the last week for the team managers at risk.
Same at every site, so much for MtT statement about there being a job for everybody if they want it !!!!!!!
Nice to see the boys and girls form a guard of honour at magor today for the managers that are leaving, shunters beeping there horns,some great managers have gone.
Nice gesture trig,well done to magor colleagues.
Wish I could say the same for my site, the people manager and my shift manager (who I have worked with for over 10 years (and foolishly considered as friends) thought it was more important to leave site early (to avoid traffic)rather than stay behind for a few minutes to wish the departing managers well and wish the all the best for the future - I have nothing but distain for these people - what a great advertisement for the future of Tesco and its people first policy !!!!!!
People first policy = my are.
Well this former Tesco employee would like to thank DD, MtT the DLT, my depots senior leadership team and the managers that are safe, for all the care , compassion, and empathy they gave shown me during this difficult, uncertain and worrying time .... Oh hang on a minute , that's right, they didn't ... I didn't even get a leaving / good luck card for f**ksake - am I bitter HELL YEAH
When will you all ever realise we are all being used we are just a number, like it said in the press they will dump you at the drop of saving a £, get real the lot of you, play the game for your own interest if it suits you like it suits me or get the hell out.
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 28-04-17, 11:54AM
Well this former Tesco employee would like to thank DD, MtT the DLT, my depots senior leadership team and the managers that are safe, for all the care , compassion, and empathy they gave shown me during this difficult, uncertain and worrying time .... Oh hang on a minute , that's right, they didn't ... I didn't even get a leaving / good luck card for f**ksake - am I bitter HELL YEAH
Agree with you
So glad to be out of this shower of sh*te company!
Glad they let us go this early.
Heard avout what the colleagues at Mayor Mayor, that's a brilliant thing to do
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 28-04-17, 11:54AM
Well this former Tesco employee would like to thank DD, MtT the DLT, my depots senior leadership team and the managers that are safe, for all the care , compassion, and empathy they gave shown me during this difficult, uncertain and worrying time .... Oh hang on a minute , that's right, they didn't ... I didn't even get a leaving / good luck card for f**ksake - am I bitter HELL YEAH
Some of our staff got managers who were leaving cards and gifts as a thank you but as they were on the sick, the managers never came in to receive them or say goodbye to their staff.
The same scenario is being played out across the United Kingdom and will continue Depot by Depot, Store by Store but don't worry I have yet to meet anybody who following leaving Tosco was not over the moon to have done so. The shame of it is if we had a Union to speak of we might at least left with a modicum of dignity. B*ST*RDS >:(
The union is in the pockets of Tesco, I know for a fact that senior Tesco managers attended the USDAW ADM and plied them with copious amount if free alcohol - and we wonder why our reps agree to everything Tesco ask !!!!!
It's time to set Usbore free. >:(
Quote from: grim up north on 30-04-17, 12:24PM
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 28-04-17, 11:54AM
Well this former Tesco employee would like to thank DD, MtT the DLT, my depots senior leadership team and the managers that are safe, for all the care , compassion, and empathy they gave shown me during this difficult, uncertain and worrying time .... Oh hang on a minute , that's right, they didn't ... I didn't even get a leaving / good luck card for f**ksake - am I bitter HELL YEAH
Some of our staff got managers who were leaving cards and gifts as a thank you but as they were on the sick, the managers never came in to receive them or say goodbye to their staff.
It probably does seem very selfish of them to do that, but remember these managers have probably had enough just as the rest of us. Certainly I can understand why they may have just thought "f*** it" and not bothered returning. Nice gesture by your staff but the manager wasn't to know and I'm pretty sure if you caught up with them afterwards they could well give you those reasons.
I would like to like to wish all those managers and Clerk who are currently undergoing wave 2 of the restructure, please do not think that this will be last job losses, the next people to hit will be the clerical team, which will be reduced by 50 %
Clerical reduced by 50?!?.....Is this 100% true???
Wouldnt be surprised about the clerical after the delay with the bonus letters etc.
Has the second wave now started?
Quote from: JL on 18-05-17, 12:53PM
Wouldnt be surprised about the clerical after the delay with the bonus letters etc.
I believe Arizonarugby is referring to the clerical staff at DCs. They would of had absolutely nothing to do with the bonus letters.
When is the next management restructure for nights my store is a mess. They are not replacing any management who leave and some departments are left without any staff. It is now the managers decision every night what work to leave. My hope is more of my LMs go and it is only the assistants. Then we will see if the place shuts or they give us a day manager temporary. None of them want to do nights though.
Quote from: Billy Budd on 18-05-17, 11:51AM
Clerical reduced by 50?!?.....Is this 100% true???
Yes Billy Budd, I believe this to be 100 % true, with in the next 12 months, the clerical teams will
Be reduced by 50, when the me booking in and gatehouse systems are introduced
Hi Arizona, what is the ME Booking in and gatehouse restructure
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 18-05-17, 03:19PM
Quote from: Billy Budd on 18-05-17, 11:51AM
Clerical reduced by 50?!?.....Is this 100% true???
Yes Billy Budd, I believe this to be 100 % true, with in the next 12 months, the clerical teams will
Be reduced by 50, when the me booking in and gatehouse systems are introduced
Very sad to hear this Arizona...Some of my friends are clerical and they are unaware this grenade is gonna being thrown at them...:(
Can anyone give a rough guide as to what this ME gatehouse thing is please??
Basically, the suppliers / hauliers will key or scam their booking reference and the barrier , the system will then direct the vehicle to a bay, the driver will back on to a bay and put his keys in a traka cabinet, this will then release the bay for unloading / in short the this will replace the booking in clerks job.
There is also an enhancement in TIMS that will replace the exceptions clerks role i.e. If over delivered the system will advise the grid : floor walker what to do with the stock - as opposed to the grid walker checking the stock printing the exception report and passing in to the exceptions clerks - making these 2 roles / task redundant.
There are also plans to automate some of the system clerks role as well i.e. Running HI reports etc.
So the likelihood is that the clerical team will be reduced to 1 Clerk per shift in the near future
A big drop from 6 a shift,as there were at my DC before it closed,plus a team manager in charge of clerical team per shift.
The numbers will be slightly different in pick by store warehouses because of the different processes in stocked (grocery) warehouses and stockless (fresh) warehouses , but none the less, expect the clerical team to significantly reduced
Key or Scan booking reference at the barrier?
The company will need a shed load of luck with that process and task, it will be a far from a slick process that it would need to be to succeed especially without the back up of people in seats to adapt when problems arise.
Well it's goodbye to B Shift as we know it here at Boro Dc all but 2 managers have been told services are no longer required ,some good people losing jobs god help us when A Shift take over we will then realise what we have lost .Good luck to all concerned sure there will be better things in the future
I'll second that Jetplane, there has been some strange decisions made across all three shifts but then again look at the people who have made them? There's not an ounce of dignity, discretion or honesty between them. As somebody stated earlier "the lunatics are in charge of the asylum" God help us all. >:(
(incidentally not a sniff of the Union, the Managers where representing each other. F*ck*ng disgraceful) >:(
Also think decisions maybe not made by a very desperate GM but a certain double act whispering in his ear who stays and who goes
Unfortunately that's the same across all distribution, the company are hiding Behind flawed process (ERRIC) and pretending that decision on who stays is based on ability , but the truth is scores have been (or can be) manipulated to keep the people they want ..,cronyism and nepotism still rule at Tesco
Just one word of warning , please be careful that your comments don't identify you because Tesco Senior Management (at board level) snoop on this site
Was told by some in the DC near us that the Managers that worked hard and Understood the Job had been made redundant , And those that did not have a clue had been kept on , 2 months on The same Guys have told me that some of them that had been made redundant are back ???
Seems those at the top have no clue to what is going on :(or no clue to what they are doing 8-)
Quote from: Duracell on 31-05-17, 09:15AM
Key or Scan booking reference at the barrier?
The company will need a shed load of luck with that process and task, it will be a far from a slick process that it would need to be to succeed especially without the back up of people in seats to adapt when problems arise.
Obviously there will be a transition period , but change will happen, the concept is piloted at a depot n the very near future and rolled out across the network in the next 12 months
Quote from: Duracell on 31-05-17, 09:15AM
Key or Scan booking reference at the barrier?
The company will need a shed load of luck with that process and task, it will be a far from a slick process that it would need to be to succeed especially without the back up of people in seats to adapt when problems arise.
Totally agree with Duracell. As a clerk working in the fresh side of distribution i see more flaws in this concept then anything i have ever come across in my time with the company. How is the system going to react if the supplier has not sent an ASN, something which happens on a daily basis (If not hourly) Will the system be able to park drivers up they arrive to early?, How will the system know if the trailer they bring is conventional trailer or a high trailer (Double Deck). Some hauliers have both, my D.C only has a certain number of high bays so sometimes we tell the driver to wait for a certain bay. Without a clerk telling the drivers which bay to go on i can only see this concept being an expensive failure.
Has anyone else used this system before ? or is it something that has been developed just for or by Tesco ?
Quote from: Looselips on 31-05-17, 10:49PM
Quote from: Duracell on 31-05-17, 09:15AM
Key or Scan booking reference at the barrier?
The company will need a shed load of luck with that process and task, it will be a far from a slick process that it would need to be to succeed especially without the back up of people in seats to adapt when problems arise.
Obviously there will be a transition period , but change will happen, the concept is piloted at a depot n the very near future and rolled out across the network in the next 12 months
I don't disagree that that is a stance that is rolled with D2D compliance, What I disagree with is that it is not a factually correct stance or directive when may not necessarily happen, from past experience some things aren't practical at some DC's and don't happen because of it, that is fact.
So "Change will happen" will depend on many things, it's been said before but they couldn't pull it off.
Also some of the suggestions from senior level outside of the DC's when they try to roll things out that are clearly not going to work, well let just say they are not at a level of intelligence that demands work level 4/5 salary.
Quote from: Looselips on 31-05-17, 10:39PM
Just one word of warning , please be careful that your comments don't identify you because Tesco Senior Management (at board level) snoop on this site
I would hope they do, they could glean some very useful information that would benefit the company from this site.
Yet if your warning is intending to suggest that simply by participating in this site we are somehow at risk, I in my own humble opinion very much disagree, I believe the nature of participation and content is what (if anything) would put some at risk.
Going back to Teesport, yes there have been a few shocks but honestly the impression i have gotten from those who are staying is that they would rather have gone. Obviously if they had been told they were for the chop they may not be so keen on the idea of leaving as nobody wants to lose their jobs but with the direction the warehouse is going i am not surprised some would rather go.
Quite apt that we are based on a dock, it really is looking like a sinking ship ...
I think for those staying the job will be a totally different experience and not a pleasant one and it wouldn't surprise me if some of them staying will not stay for long. :-[
Agree with both coffee gate and snowy owl there has been a few shocks and having spoke to most the management off B Shift anyone any idea why most except one actually wanted to go ,I do feel quite a few of these guys are good eggs and will be sadly missed ,but as I said what does any one think could have happened to make them want to leave and what will happen to the shift
Coffeegate,snowyowl & jetplane can you not see the devious hands of A.D & G.F at play here.what you will find is A shift managers been moved to B shift to raise B shift to be A2 shift.
To those managers going i have sympathy with losing your job is not a nice thing and especially when out of your control. As for a sinking ship if the W1 dont want to go way of managers then speak up help man the bilge pumps, get the depot to a good place to be.
Think you are overlooking the obvious there redcar, I think the reason so many wanted to leave was more to do with a more local irritant. If it's to hot, get out of it! ;)
an irritant in the form of a certain 'bawbag' perhaps :D
At my friends store they are advertising for night manager. Wtf. (-*-)
Quote from Coffeegate;
Quotean irritant in the form of a certain 'bawbag' perhaps :D
Let's hope the old adage "what goes around comes around" applies. I'm sure the two previously mentioned are still working on it. :-[
Quote from: Tesco bird on 02-06-17, 09:08PM
At my friends store they are advertising for night manager. Wtf. (-*-)
It is not the first time I have seen Tosco employing someone to scrap the role a week or few months later. :thumbdown:
So all in all 7 managers off B Shift will be leaving and the 2 that are staying are not happy about staying which means we will be getting 3 of A.D super stars on Shift, I for one will not be putting up with a certain manager's bully boy tactics if he is chosen, I hope the rest will follow sound like B Shift will become grievance shift.
There is no knowing who will be transferred to B-shift and bullying is gross misconduct so will be dealt with accordingly. If you work at Teesport i would have thought you would be used to bullying. :D
I hear D.M , P.H and D.H going to b shift to get you all up to A.D's work ethic
I think a more realistic scenario is that he will have a want to rid himself of those that have or are likely to cause him problems. I don't think any you have mentioned are troublesome are they? ;D ;D ;D
who or wot is BAWBAG teesport certainly seems to be a very dysfunctional place too work at..from the previous comments! this a.d fellow seems too have a lot of influence on what goes on within teesport... :question:
Quote from: tiptop on 07-06-17, 07:59PM
who or wot is BAWBAG teesport certainly seems to be a very dysfunctional place too work at..from the previous comments! this a.d fellow seems too have a lot of influence on what goes on within teesport... :question:
Tiptop in answer to your question the person in question talks the talk but doesn't walk the walk , Dictator had plenty of influence and look were it got him.if senior management took off the rose tinted glasses off they would see the truth we get support from other depots that cannot pick or load wagons on double time and wonder who is responsible A.D and his amazing flying Circus
redcar renegade many thanks for reply..from your comments it is clear too me that teesport is clearly in a bad place with regards senior management leading by example ref taking the site forward in what I'm sure must be a very challenging time for all at teesport..maybe a.d and his amazing flying circus will come too the rescue!!! LOL (-*-)
How long before the managers that are leaving go sick from the way they are been treated can't see it been long and who can blame them not me for one
We have a compliance manager now off sick I wondeR why 😂 I would though if I was in her position. Take the bloody money and RUN lol 😂
Consultation well under way at Reading dc. Ploughing ahead despite vulnerability of site re volumes and hygiene standards. Absolutely no empathy demonstrated. Some managers already seem to regret being matched. Happiest seem to be the ones at risk. Really sad to see how quickly depot has changed in 4 years
Is it true there has been a power cut at Reading? That's what our management(what's left of them) are claiming. This, so we are told, is why we are picking London area stores orders.
Tiptop i get the feeling in my water that you are management sure your user tag should not be bricktop from the movie snatch and to use a qoute from the movie:
Brick Top: Do you know what "nemesis" means? A righteous infliction of retribution manifested by an appropriate agent. Personified in this case by an 'orrible c#nt... me. Brick Top: In the quiet words of the Virgin Mary... come again?
Quote from: Pochin123 on 31-05-17, 11:21PM
Quote from: Duracell on 31-05-17, 09:15AM
Key or Scan booking reference at the barrier?
The company will need a shed load of luck with that process and task, it will be a far from a slick process that it would need to be to succeed especially without the back up of people in seats to adapt when problems arise.
Totally agree with Duracell. As a clerk working in the fresh side of distribution i see more flaws in this concept then anything i have ever come across in my time with the company. How is the system going to react if the supplier has not sent an ASN, something which happens on a daily basis (If not hourly) Will the system be able to park drivers up they arrive to early?, How will the system know if the trailer they bring is conventional trailer or a high trailer (Double Deck). Some hauliers have both, my D.C only has a certain number of high bays so sometimes we tell the driver to wait for a certain bay. Without a clerk telling the drivers which bay to go on i can only see this concept being an expensive failure.
Tesco is full of expensive failures, fresh and easy, better fresh express, AMC on MHE to name a few, no doubt some fresh out of college graduate has decided that the concept will work and save a couple of pennies (but cost thousands in lost productivity).
Quote from: redcar renegade on 07-06-17, 08:26PM
Quote from: tiptop on 07-06-17, 07:59PM
who or wot is BAWBAG teesport certainly seems to be a very dysfunctional place too work at..from the previous comments! this a.d fellow seems too have a lot of influence on what goes on within teesport... :question:
Tiptop in answer to your question the person in question talks the talk but doesn't walk the walk , Dictator had plenty of influence and look were it got him.if senior management took off the rose tinted glasses off they would see the truth we get support from other depots that cannot pick or load wagons on double time and wonder who is responsible A.D and his amazing flying Circus
It is probably the same at every site - the bullies and dictators (due to the who they are related to or sleeping with) are safe and those that treat people fairly are at risk.
This is certainly true at my site, one of the safe managers had a serious grievance against him that went all the way to an I T (that could have cost the company over £50k , but he is safe ... why ... because he is related to a senior manager!!!!
this company is corrupt to the core, anybody who doesnt see it needs to take their blinkers off >:(
redcar renegade..COME AGAIN? 8) 8) 8) 8)
So rumour has it that the following managers will be joining A2 Shift at Teesport Our old favourite P.R,D.H and R.A these moves 2 in particular will be really interesting hope I am not in any of those teams or it's time to look for a new job RIP B Shift
I don't think them leaving to join B-Shift will bother the level ones, they'll be to busy rowing with their new Shift Manager. ;)
Since some TM's were let go, more often then not the agency supervisors are the only one's on the assembly podium. Can't be right putting delays etc in with them?
The only place you'll find a TM theses days is sat in the office keeping each other company . The fact is that the majority of the remaining TM now see running the operation as the job of a coordinators.
In the words of Jim Royle , shoulder to shoulder "MY A@@E"
True. We were told as co-ordinators will be on the podium's, this frees Tm's to be walking the shop floor. The only time you see them out of the office though is start/end of shift.
Or when they have a "meeting" in the smoke shed!!!!
At least with the TMswe have on B Shift now are ok to talk to I'm really starting to stress once we get bully boy DH and can't trust him PR on Shift scary times ahead
Looking at the big picture what strikes me is that there was some shocking decisions made across all three shifts as to who has survived "the cull" and who has been made redundant. Who said "the cream will always rise to the top" It seems to me the more skeletons you had in your cupboard the more likely is was you would be retained. Warning, either join the funny hand shake club or watch your back. :( :( :(
I guess It's like this at all depots, at my depot, it depended on who you were related to, sleeping with , or went drinking with... ERRIC was manipulated to achieve the results they wan d i.e. disciplinary records etc went missing etc
Jetplane remember " buddy " the best way to deal with someone who shouts at you like a raving lunatic is simply point out to him you are not an animal the quickly fill in a grievance form. Or better still sarcasm works well with DH on A shift lol
Yeh I know what you mean snowy owl some real good people are going especially on one side of the building you will know who I am on about and really feel for Ds/Jw as I know they are gutted with what's going on
"Oh what an evil web we weave when first we practice to deceive"
The place needs clearing out from top to bottom. It's no good having any expectations of Head Office as I'm sure they do nothing to discourage the behaviour practiced and as for Usbore they care less than North Kensington Council. >:( >:( >:(
Some very sad news, hot of the press.
QuoteMan down, Senior Manager, answers to the name of Bawbag's gone AWOL. Any information please keep it to yourself. :D :D :D
In the case of Bawbag news on the net is he has started a Proclaimers tribute act singing " I will walk 500 miles".
Asked management today said his on the sick also been told I'm going into DH team great news that Buddy not
Heard drastic Dave isn't finished the job cuts in distribution, Belfast and Antrim to get hit again? Security to go? Goods-in to go? Anyone know when?
If these Depots are losing Goods-In and are retaining Goods-Out then they must be closing them! 8-)
Hi,
My friend took cushion pay for shift leader but not sure how long she has to work or how to repay if want to leave immediately as she is very stressed with job.trial period is over so i guess she cant take reduandcy now.can anyone help
The company won't take the cushion payment back if she chooses to leave however if she is still in the trial period she can say it's not working and wants to take redundancy
Stock Control/PI up for the cut in my opinion, they'll simplify the whole thing and try to push some of those hours into Checkout/Replenishment, whilst cutting some hours too.
Once electronic labels are rolled out there will be no need for pi.
Electronic labels are years away for Tesco, they simply could not afford the implementation of it.
PI will lose more hours as will Stock Control (manager in my former store talked of this at our last knees up) and it appears that word through the grapevine is its happening.
PI lose hours :D :D they're the only department in our store with endless supply of overtime
Yorkshire Dave your store is very lucky then as you have a manager who actually cares whether they trade legally or not. After 27 years in pi I'm waiting patiently for my redundancy and have it on good authority the electronic labels will be sooner not later and have been trailing in stores for a while.
Quote from: Equalizer87 on 30-06-17, 01:58PM
Electronic labels are years away for Tesco, they simply could not afford the implementation of it.
PI will lose more hours as will Stock Control (manager in my former store talked of this at our last knees up) and it appears that word through the grapevine is its happening.
they are away to start roll out soon. they have been trialling a more cost effective version than one previously tested and has been signed off for roll out.
If you go abroad they have electronic shelf labels everywhere?
This country is a joke.
Tesco stores in Hungary have electronic SEL as do multiple other stores all over Europe.
Yes initial cost may be high but you would then only need one computer to do the job currently undertaken by PI in store. Long Term the cost savings would be massive.
After the second world war every other bugger in western Europe moved on. We stood still, regressed and never recovered (except for one square mile of Londinium that made money out of the war at our ancestors expense, in much the same way as they have always done).
Quote from: londoner83 on 30-06-17, 09:30PM
Tesco stores in Hungary have electronic SEL as do multiple other stores all over Europe.
Yes initial cost may be high but you would then only need one computer to do the job currently undertaken by PI in store. Long Term the cost savings would be massive.
What have the Hungarians got to do with the management restructure. :)
No sure how any of this ( electronic SEL) has anything to do with management restructure, but Tesco are miles behind the competition.
Amazon are trialing using RFID (intelligent barcodes) in their brick and mortar stores.
This not only will make PI redundant, but also stock counts and gap scans.
Rolling this technology out to their distribution network, will also have a massive impact (and cost savings ) on their policies and procedures
Sad day yesterday end of an era as last 2 B Shift managers went, B Shift is no more A Shift starts today only god can help us now.
What will be the problem that the restructure will cause, in your opinion?
I feel the issue on our shift will be that when we have followed A S gift our shift as always fire fighting to put the shift back on course and a lot of the guys think that because of this it has basically cost our managers their jobs while the other shift have tossed it off but hit the Lois and has Tosco is all about figures this will have been the downfall A S gift managers coming over are the worst of what they had a bully a corrupt unwashed dodgy thief and all the decent ones made redundant not good times But at least DL will get his bonus again
[admin]Predictive spelling ?[/admin]
It's (I'm sure) at all depots , it's the t***ers that kissed the senior teams a**e that kept their jobs, the decent guys who went the extra mile and looked after colleagues have gone
In reply to jetplane accusation that A shift at Middlesbrough D.C seem to drop B shift in the mire,sorry but I couldn't stop laughing at this statement. Either there is an alternative reality at our D.C or Jetplane needs drug testing. Our Jetplane are you a management stooge with a plan to wind staff up.
When the shifts infight all it does is empower shift Managers like No No & the Ginger Grinch to dump on us more.
Redcar renegade surely you must have seen the abysmal hand overs from No no whoes instruction is pick pick pick I work a lot on goods in or Tetris as we like to call it when trying to unload a trailer with no spaces but once he goes to the dark side and you are getting hand overs like this you too will see the truth and I am bitter with all the good managers from our shift being stitched up by the corrupt gangsters lead by a certain shift manager who looked after his own
So now the axe is now hovering over the heads of the maintenance managers , the new "structure" will mean that that one manager will cover two sites.
Yet again it is a complete mad cap concert, with some managers expecting to cover sites over 150 miles apart .
That is also the plan with the group business and finance manager currently cover one group rumoured to go to two
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 08-08-17, 07:44PM
So now the axe is now hovering over the heads of the maintenance managers , the new "structure" will mean that that one manager will cover two sites.
Yet again it is a complete mad cap concert, with some managers expecting to cover sites over 150 miles apart .
Some have 3, some even more.
I think the Manager that takes on Livingston, Antrim and Belfast with have their work cut out.
Also anyone "under the axe" in this restructure can apply for any of the "New Roles", which may create a few moves and a few surprises.
Another Cherry Picking exercise.
If managers got paid for being on the warehouse floor they would get paid very much. A culture of do what I say not as I do is alive and well in distribution. Think drastic Dave needs to get rid of some more dead wood?
I think when the dust settles they will then probably purge the Shift Managers now all the remaining Team Managers are duty trained.
This was phase 2 of ??? Phases... give it 12months to settle and all team managers will be replaced by coordinators...
Is this the same as lead managers ?
The first structure change I was involved in was changing department managers to co-ordinators lol
In Middlesbrough it looks like the new restructure has taken its toll with 2 out of 3 shift managers off with stress.
They are now advertising for 2 secondments as a Team Manager to cover the two who are basically running shift and will step into the shift manager roles as they have already been doing this for some time. Couldn't be worse timing as those who left have only been gone a matter of weeks and now the warehouse is already in a situation where they have realised there is a shortage of managers! Could there be another company as poor as Tesco at trying to bring in change and making everything twice as bad? :D
I know a number of Express (and a Metro) where some of the Shift Leaders have stood down ( some them replacing precious SL).
Just goes to show how badly the whole thing is being run, both in store and distribution.
The SL role in Metro has been around for a year now and my former store has had five in that time. Doesn't that tell you it's not worth the money?
Coffeegate would have loved to see latest casualty flip out in goods out how the mighty have fallen this is same guy who in the recent past had no sympathy for people in ARM's.
Good job we have a calibre of ex- shift managers to step in to the breach.we can all see Tesco made a mistake depot as it has been pointed out is running red mainly because of having inexperienced Staff on agency causing chaos in aisles
Been reading the many posts on this subject over the recent period - worked for Tesco for 22 yrs and went in the first phase along with 2 others, in total they lost 72 years of knowledge and skills (just the 3 of us) and I wonder how such gaps will be filled when you combine this with all the others individuals who have gone - yes agree some will be no loss but not all fall into that category.
Sadly I left with a bitter taste in my mouth as I (as most others) were treated with utter contempt by the company and the whole process so badly handled that if became a complete farce, the level of incompetence unbelievable!
There was never any acknowledgement of this from start to finish and any issue raised fell on the closed ears and minds from Senior management - they projected the "our people matter" message and yet the reality was that they could not care less about how/who these changes affected and the impact of their decisions on their lives.
Good luck to anyone still working for them - your going to need it with their poor attitude to their staff and unbelievable arrogance from the Senior management!
Keep looking over your shoulder ! You could be next!!
Rant done!! >:(
Well said 👍 👍 👍
There is currently too many check the checker/Senior Team roles and incompetent Line Managers. I have a LM just now who can't give out holidays without running it past the Lead Manager. You eventually get fed up of the lack of response so go to the Lead direct and he always says "your LM should be able to give you the answer." A simple holiday request can take days if you hear atoll. They could hire a £7/hour admin person and they would be able to do this better.
Quote from: redcar renegade on 22-08-17, 07:41PM
Coffeegate would have loved to see latest casualty flip out in goods out how the mighty have fallen this is same guy who in the recent past had no sympathy for people in ARM's.
Good job we have a calibre of ex- shift managers to step in to the breach.we can all see Tesco made a mistake depot as it has been pointed out is running red mainly because of having inexperienced Staff on agency causing chaos in aisles
How the mighty have fallen indeed, i was surprised when i heard the reason for his absence.
Also the aisles its like dodge the llop or the box that has been flung from a cage at the moment!
With inexperienced agency staff, together with new remote controlled llop's, you don't know how close to the truth you are with your 'dodge the llop' in the aisles.
Let's face it at the moment Distribution is totally f***ed, Middlesbrough has had to call in John Wayne and the cavalry, support of this depot must be costing an absolute fortune in travel and hotel costs , currently running with (effectively) two DCM's ( costing at least 110 pa)
Livingston lost 50 +agency, Lichfield lost 50+ agency, widnes will lose a lot of agency when amazon opens in Warrington... so in short ghe corner has clearly land on a snake ...!!!! The
Arizonarugby yes it will be costing a fortune to get support for Middlesbrough but when they come the support take the p*ss by messing about when dekitting, not wrapping the last three cages on double deckkers which middlesbrough staff would get hammered for.
Don't want to see anyone else lose their job but surely it's time that someone goes for going ahead with this great idea of cutting costs and getting rid of all the management. The ones that have gone that I know are enjoying life and new jobs, but that doesn't help those who are still serving their sentence. Dave time to go you have destroyed distribution.
Distribution isn't half a mess. Our deliveries don't arrive or arrive all at once. The cages are full of damaged stock with items missing.
Unfortunately it wil only get worse when the depots fully integrate the one stop in to their distribution network , on top of this they are now also having to distribute cigarettes through the tesco network
Time for more managers to go as they don't get off their backsides coming onto the warehouse floor, turn a blind eye to health and safety breach's, smoke their brains out and leave before everyone else, in our dc in Belfast we've still too many managers, costing us a fortune. Too many chiefs and not enough Indians.
Stores also have too many managers. Our store forks out TM/LM wages to get the cereal aisle finished and for someone to wait at the clock machine to dock colleagues wages who clock out 5 minutes early.
weed it baffles me mate,would tesco rather an elite force,on a decent wage,or rely on agency.
Probably agency coz then they ain't accountable for pension payments/sick/holiday/training.
Quote from: trigger on 12-02-18, 01:25AM
weed it baffles me mate,would tesco rather an elite force,on a decent wage,or rely on agency.
Agency for the reasons above. I don't bother my arse now. Our TM is clueless and managers are now filling cereal or toilet paper. Just laugh at the managers every night as my to do list gets longer, wages worth less than ever.
Goods in clerks to go, all depots as well as remaining security in all Tesco security sites! >:(
explain, does this include stores also?
Just distribution at this time but watch this space! ???
Do the above posts relate to manager positions ?
Quote from: Arizonarugby on 26-08-17, 06:19PM
Let's face it at the moment Distribution is totally f***ed, Middlesbrough has had to call in John Wayne and the cavalry, support of this depot must be costing an absolute fortune in travel and hotel costs , currently running with (effectively) two DCM's ( costing at least 110 pa)
Livingston lost 50 +agency, Lichfield lost 50+ agency, widnes will lose a lot of agency when amazon opens in Warrington... so in short ghe corner has clearly land on a snake ...!!!! The
Amazon has already opened in Warrington and yes the amount of agency staff Widnes have lost is incredible, trainer's are training new staff every week and 50% only last a couple of weeks.
Totally right, I know a guy who went to Amazon at Warrington and was let go by the end of his first week. Though what he spoke of it sounded dire.
apparently working for amazon makes working for tesco seem like paradise. there was something on tv about it comparing it with the old sweatshops of victorian times. treated like slaves!!
What I was told fits that description very well. Apparently staff got sent home early on occasions to save on unwanted expenditure, something like 20 seconds to get to the next item. Sounds horrible to be honest. Doesn't mean I'd prefer Tesco though, I wouldn't do either.
Distribution still has too many managers still, so why is the company still paying for dead wood? Yeah morale in dc's is at an all time low, but the company can do something about it if it wants.
1 one or two managers per shift after all thought that's why they brought in podium monkeys
2 transport is top heavy with managers as you've got the same amount of clerks as managers why?
3 start being honest with everyone at the coal face and talk to us properly instead of bribing your staff to like the place so we have a better chance of getting a bonus!
4 why do some dc's have health and safety managers and people managers combined and others have both? What a waste of money!
5 take health and safety seriously not just lip service!
Kingkong2015 in reply to your post here are a few suggestions.
1.managers replaced by podium monkeys why have a £6 /wk numpty telling experienced staff what to do.if Tesco want better utilisation ask the people who do the work.
2.transport staffing levels need looking at more tansport staff in goods out than really needed.
3 we are human beings not animals treat us as such
4 if only one person doing two jobs think of the savings made in salary and savings in amount of coffee
5 Tesco do not really take safety seriously it's easier to pay the compo
6 if staff started to work as they are trained and work to safe system of work rather than rushing about to get performance the depots would be better.
It is the same at stores. Too many overpaid managers. The nightshift lead is one overpaid labourer. Moral is poor also. Why do we need managers without staff during the day and managers filling shelf at night because staff keep leaving. Maybe the TMs are selecting people they know will leave so they can keep themselves in a high paid labourer job. ??? The lies are constant in store from the TMs. The PM and CM removal was one of the best cost savings. Stores do not bother with health and safety.
Quote from: Weed on 19-03-18, 09:12PM
It is the same at stores. Too many overpaid managers. The nightshift lead is one overpaid labourer. Moral is poor also. Why do we need managers without staff during the day and managers filling shelf at night because staff keep leaving. Maybe the TMs are selecting people they know will leave so they can keep themselves in a high paid labourer job. ??? The lies are constant in store from the TMs. The PM and CM removal was one of the best cost savings. Stores do not bother with health and safety.
Totally agree with weed except every night lead manager we had stayed in the office all night playing candy crush or on Facebook! The store manager was even informed of this happening but they chose to ignore it😂😂 just shows you that all management are in the same lazy overpaid club! And they all think they are better than the GA'S who are the real ones making the profits come tumbling in for the shareholders! Less management = better paid and happier GA'S. Simple solution as shown by Aldi/Lidl
Quote from: Equalizer87 on 18-03-18, 12:24PM
Totally right, I know a guy who went to Amazon at Warrington and was let go by the end of his first week. Though what he spoke of it sounded dire.
A mate of mine went to work for Amazon, got told on his first day "your just a number to us and can be replaced whenever we feel like it" at least Amazon are honest about it unlike Tesco who like to talk about being all caring and supportive despite it not being the case in reality.
Quote from: redcar renegade on 19-03-18, 08:30PM
6 if staff started to work as they are trained and work to safe system of work rather than rushing about to get performance the depots would be better.
If staff started to work as they are trained at Tesco there is no way they would ever hit the ridiculous productivity targets, get much done on current payroll budgets or deliver anything to the ludicrous standard of expectation. The company can't afford to do what it wants us to do and thus can't afford to have us working exactly as we are trained, a situation that will only get worse as minimum wage drives costs up and thus technology eventually becomes cheaper than employing people.
Is there any more redundancy on the way. Dual site express managers for e.g.
Why wouldn't there be more redundancy's. The business has too many Chiefs. With the Booker merger hopefully things will change quickly. SMs should never be in charge of just one Express.
More to the point, the business is failing. Hence the launch of the 'discount' brand to take on the real threat to Tesco that they've deliberately ignored for years.
The plan is to open up more revenue streams as the main one is completely wrecked.
Weed, I'm interested in why you think one SM should not run one Express store - what about the cat3s, the fuel sites legally require a mngr and I'm sure it would be part of Esso's agreement, stores that take Money and open 24hr .... dual site may have a place but is it a blanket approach? Redundancy was not an option for the SMS affected by dual site last time
I appreciate that this is tosco but of my contracted rate is say £9.50 an hour then that's what it is regardless of which department I work in. Otherwise managers wouldn't be overpaid ga-s and options muppets slave labour
It was not a redundancy situation when the dual sites came in, the standard single store express sm job continued to exist as before, all signed off express store mangers had the chance to apply for the new role of dual site store manager, those who were in affected stores who chose not to or did not pass the interview were offered another single site sm job.
They need to do something to fix Livingston. We get late deliveries literally every day now. Working and post-sorting 15 - 20 cages that should have been delivered the evening before is no bloody fun at all. Especially when some of the cages are so badly packed you have to break them down and rebuild them before you can even take them onto the shop floor.
I don't care about Livingston DC's problems and I don't want to hear their pathetic excuses. Either do your job or find another one.
VladPutin embrace it
Bullying going on in goods-in clerical night-shift office at Livingston DC.
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Not just Livingston that is struggling, all the fresh stream is beginning to loose control. Moral is poor some clerical staff are worried about their jobs some just want to take the redundancy and run (Don't blame them)
Problem is if the clerical operation starts to fail the repercussions across the operation will be dire. Just hope the business has ironed out all the creases, if not it's going to get even rougher. Maybe Mr Milne can offer his team at Livingston another meal voucher to entice them stay on overtime.
(-*-)
Quote from: Gaza1985 on 13-03-19, 06:19PM
Bullying going on in goods-in clerical night-shift office at Livingston DC.
Livingston DC's performance is shockingly bad where my store is concerned. Deliveries are up to 24 hours late. We've had to work Sunday night's delivery on a Monday morning. You can imagine the kind of impact that has on customers and dot com, to say nothing of screwing up the department routines.
Someone from Dave's gang should be walking around with the banner. "THE END IS NIGH".
I dont think any of the goods-in clerks are capable of being a bully..most just want their redundancy. ...
Meal vouchers aren't the answer😁
"Meal vouchers" in store the management wont even give you an Easter egg
Can the manager take voluntary redundancy at DCs? They should introduce it to stores for all. Many would opt for it and it would save them having to slash the hours of those who have mortgages to pay.
I have noticed most DCs are now recruiting for "People Advisor" the role pack appears to be similar to the store admin clerk, but with the DC head count it is a full time position, days & nights.
Does anyone have any idea of the salary for this position in DC, is it another watering down of the management role?