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Author Topic: Disciplinary  (Read 4925 times)

dfl

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Disciplinary
« on: 20-01-20, 08:32PM »
For 3 reasons

1) being over %, fair enough
2) not organising shift swaps yourself (surely managers job to arrange other duties)
3) not attending physiotherapy (which was never prescribed by the doctor from which treatment was being sought), can of worms here re managers fitness to offer health/treatment advice AND use it as 1 of 3 reasons to issue a disciplinary.

Answers/comments on a postcard please folks.
DFL

penguin

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #1 on: 20-01-20, 08:52PM »
1 - Fair enough really
2 - When you say shift swap is this due to a medical reason, or just because you want to go out for the night etc
3 - How can Tesco expect someone to attend something that has as you say not been prescribed, what possible basis does a manager have to say you need to go to physio, where did they get that idea from.
Tesco - the moden day word for workhouse

dfl

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #2 on: 20-01-20, 08:59PM »
2 - medical reason, lighter work but in same dept

3 - I'm puzzled too, they have no right nor are they qualified to make that call let alone use it as a reason
DFL

penguin

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #3 on: 20-01-20, 09:04PM »
It is indeed a managers job to arrange light or alternative duties if needed for medical reasons, was just a bit unsure as when you said shift swap I thought you were talking about a shift swap where you just swap with another person because you want or need a certain day off.
Tesco - the moden day word for workhouse

dfl

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #4 on: 20-01-20, 09:13PM »
They said not enough done by the employee to arrange swap with other staff as part reason for disciplinary
DFL

NightAndDay

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #5 on: 20-01-20, 10:38PM »
If you're over the percentage, disciplinary action will be based on absence patterns, rtw process will be followed regardless of the reason, ARM's will be followed if over the percentage but the absence didn't have a fit note.

Shift swapping depends on period of notice, if plenty of notice was given, then the managers should try to arrange cover for medical reasons, otherwise the onus is on you.

If it was short notice but called in sick within timeframe stated in policy, then they can't discipline you for not being able to find cover, it has to be treated purely as absence.
« Last Edit: 20-01-20, 10:40PM by NightAndDay »

dfl

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #6 on: 20-01-20, 11:42PM »
Shift swap wasn't to cover absence illness, it was supposed to be to allow lighter duties. But Rosco say that's up to employee to arrange, I'd have thought clearly not and that would be managers job
DFL

NightAndDay

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #7 on: 21-01-20, 12:11AM »
If you have a sick note, then Tesco has to support you if amended duties are noted, depending on what the sick note exempts you on and for how long, it may mean you are exempt from a lot of the duties required to fulfil your role, irrespective of this, it's the employers responsibility, not yours to accomodate your disability, whether it's temporary or permanent, the only way Tesco can discipline you over this is if they have attempted to make reasonable adjustments (which will be documented) and you haven't been cooperative (i.e you reasonably could fulfil their accomodated changes but refuse for an unreasonable reason). You shouldn't be arranging shift swaps off your own back to facilitate your disability, that's your managers job. You should either be doing your role to the best of your ability, not fulfilling the aspects of the role that would exacerbate your condition as per doctors fitnote, or your manager should be arranging another position for you where you can be more productive while at the same time not being limited by said disability.
« Last Edit: 21-01-20, 12:13AM by NightAndDay »

madness

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #8 on: 21-01-20, 04:10PM »
Dfl you have started quite a few topics and varies people have commented but you are not coming across well. Obviously you have back issues but not knowing your history of meetings and agreements I will make a couple off presumptions.

Have you previously in welcome backs or investigations discussed what YOU can do to improve your back. You and a manager might have talked about doctors and getting physiotherapy. If you have said yes that is an option then a month or 2 down the line you are in another meeting and have done nothing about it then the above point about not going to physio would be valid enough.

If you can no longer do the dot com job then get a job on checkouts. If that's not enough money then go  work for the german discounters and see what a real workload is like.

Shift swaps for days off are up to you to arrange with someone who is trained to do the job.

Shift swaps as part of a support plan are up to the manager ie being put on checkouts for x period of time to get away from heavy lifting (which you have had on another thread and moaned about)

Absence percentage and OR occasions off are a valid enough reason for a disciplinary if they are too high.

Contrary to popular belief on here managers do not want to sack people as it is such a ball ache to get people replaced (ironically dot com drivers are ten a penny in our store when a vacancy arises as its good money) The department managers are either left to cover a vacancy with overtime or like magically told they are over houred anyway.

I'm happy to answer questions you have about the disciplinary process as are others here but it looks like you are clutching at straws trying to find a technicallity to get you out of it.

"flame suit on"

dfl

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #9 on: 21-01-20, 08:59PM »
No need for fire retardant here. The back pain has only been on 2 occasions and I always follow the doctors advice, if they advise physio I'd take it as soon as it's available, it's not possible to tell a doctor that you need physio that's up to the doc. And most certainly isn't up to a Tesco manager either. As for moaning, I've never had back pain so bad as I had this time around, if you'd had it you'd be "moaning" too. Don't get me wrong I totally accept I'm over percentage, but requesting lighter duty even a spell on c&c which other staff routinely get but I don't would help in long term as well as short but managers do t see it that way. A technicality as you put it as a way out is not what I'm looking for as I've already said I'm over % but saying it's because I didn't go to physio or arrange to go on c&c myself isn't really a valid reason now is it.
DFL

Smiler

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #10 on: 25-01-20, 12:55AM »
dfl
I suffer with back pains myself and have done so for many years. When the pain gets to the level that I cannot go to work for a period of time I will visit my GP for any advice/fitnote etc. You CAN ask your GP for referral to physio and she/he will do that, you don't need to wait for them to tell you that you need physio  8-) 8-)

dfl

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #11 on: 25-01-20, 10:29PM »
Smiler, yip I know I can ask for referal, haven't done so far as this is second time I've been off with back pain, this time so bad I couldn't even walk without spasms occuring for about 4 days. The issue I had with the disciplinary was Tesco telling me part of the reason for issuing it is because I hadn't went to physio (not the Tesco doctor/grocery managers forte)
DFL

Redshoes

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #12 on: 26-01-20, 04:19AM »
Physio is not a referral in my area. Dr told me to get physio once but I had to go to clinic myself to ask for appointment. I gather this is the way it is done now, it's no longer by gp referral but only a recommended next step by gp.

Captain001

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #13 on: 27-01-20, 10:12PM »
As anyone any more information on the changes to scan as you shop, pi team,checkouts, management team had meeting this morning.more info to come.

[gmod]This isn't relevant to Disciplinary. Please look for a more suitable topic to post your question in.[/gmod]
« Last Edit: 28-01-20, 06:52PM by tumshie »

forrestgimp

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #14 on: 28-01-20, 05:59AM »
I would consider a grievence, its clearly not the responsibility of the person who is in distress through illness to cover the fact that to return to work they have to be given lighter dutys, this simply strikes me as a lazy manager who is incapable or unwilling to do so theirself.

This can be seen as bullying in so far as 'do this or risk your job'

Now grievences are intrinsicaly stresfull and need to be thought out carefully but in this instance I really do not see an altenative.

dfl

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #15 on: 28-01-20, 06:26PM »
Agreed forrestgimp
DFL

Ironightbeast565

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #16 on: 30-01-20, 08:52PM »
Just a quick one for anyone who may know the answer.How many hours need to be completed before you are able to go home sick and get paid for the rest of the shift?

madness

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #17 on: 30-01-20, 09:09PM »
Pulling that stunt will not go down well.

NightAndDay

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #18 on: 30-01-20, 09:40PM »
Half your shift.

lucgeo

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #19 on: 31-01-20, 08:29AM »
@madness

Maybe they've been docked the money from their pay and been told it's right, so seeking clarification.

Live for today. Learn from yesterday.

Dougall

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #20 on: 31-01-20, 01:36PM »
Incorrect, it is no longer half the shift .

lackofinterest

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #21 on: 31-01-20, 07:12PM »
what is it then??

Katarn2000

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #22 on: 01-02-20, 07:27AM »
Any part of the shift e.g. 15 minutes then the absence will go though as paid.

Tommo1961

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #23 on: 01-02-20, 05:21PM »

80377494

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Re: Disciplinary
« Reply #24 on: 01-02-20, 07:26PM »
Tommo1961

It depends on whether or not you have Company Sick Pay entitlement remaining.
If you have Company Sick Pay remaining you should be paid for the hours you don't work.
If you have run out of CSP the hours not worked will be deducted but the company must ensure that you are not deducted below the level of Statutory Sick Pay