* *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
08-12-19, 05:40AM

Login with username, password and session length

Recent

Members
Stats
  • Total Posts: 62781
  • Total Topics: 1104
  • Online Today: 109
  • Online Ever: 826
  • (23-02-15, 06:44PM)
Users Online
Users: 1
Guests: 86
Total: 87

Author Topic: Investigation  (Read 4962 times)

sarah85

  • VLH Supporter
  • Newbie
  • ******
  • Posts: 13
Investigation
« on: 29-09-19, 07:39PM »
After some help.

I have been given an investigation letter for last Thursday to attend an investigation meeting. Reason is tl500 over the last 6 weeks.

I then got a text on my day off to say the meeting has been rescheduled and someone from out of store is doing it. I’m not an issue. I have worked for the company for over 18 years and have not had anything like this before not even a let’s talk.

My issue is the meeting is over a week from the first meeting. My anxiety is horrendous and I am in all week this week.

Is this allowed what can I do about it? Can I ask why it’s sent out of store and why none of the 17 other managers or 4 leads in the store can’t do it? Is it normal?
 

surlaroute

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 36
  • (Age is yrs I've been doing this ridonkulous job…)
Re: Investigation
« Reply #1 on: 29-09-19, 09:14PM »
your first mistake is thinking any power exists instore anymore. Ask yourself when was the last time any of those "managers" or "leaders' did anything managerial or that suggested leadership? You're probably just the next on the list. My advice - only based on what I plan to do when my number comes up - is just go to the meeting and stare them out… say nothing till they get bored. I just think that would be a fun scene to play out. The company is a catastrophe, might as well enjoy the inevitable.

lucgeo

  • VLH Supporter
  • Sad Muppet
  • ******
  • Posts: 2155
Re: Investigation
« Reply #2 on: 29-09-19, 09:15PM »
Are you a team leader or a manager?? Have you been coding your own exceptions??
Live for today. Learn from yesterday.

londoner83

  • VLH Supporter
  • Smart Arse
  • ******
  • Posts: 915
Re: Investigation
« Reply #3 on: 30-09-19, 06:48AM »
Its perfectly reasonable to have a out of store manager conduct the investigation. Policy states that the people carrying out the investigation must be impartial so it may well be in this case it's better to have someone unconnected to the issue look at it, rather than managers who may have been directly affected by your absence thru TL500 and may well let that cloud their decision making.

sunshineman

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 72
Re: Investigation
« Reply #4 on: 30-09-19, 03:06PM »
what is a tl500

BlueToon

  • Regular Pain
  • ***
  • Posts: 160
Re: Investigation
« Reply #5 on: 30-09-19, 03:48PM »
My first question would be,
"Where in Tesco's policy does it state that a "text" is an accepted/acceptable form of communication to use in any matter that MAY POTENTIALLY lead to disciplinary action?

My response would have been to turn up at the appointed time of the first meeting, if for no other reason than to get them to detail in writing what had happened to delay it.


NightAndDay

  • Smart Arse
  • *****
  • Posts: 658
Re: Investigation
« Reply #6 on: 30-09-19, 04:41PM »
what is a tl500

Time in Lieu code.

oldfashionedplayer

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 44
Re: Investigation
« Reply #7 on: 01-10-19, 11:14AM »
My first question would be,
"Where in Tesco's policy does it state that a "text" is an accepted/acceptable form of communication to use in any matter that MAY POTENTIALLY lead to disciplinary action?

My response would have been to turn up at the appointed time of the first meeting, if for no other reason than to get them to detail in writing what had happened to delay it.

Correct, text isn't viable form of communication, should be a phone call and letter, op should turn up at the first date / time and inform them that they haven't been given a proper form of communication therefore they have attended on the time and date specified originally and like you say, get a letter explaining why it was changed and not communicated properly.

alf

  • VLH Supporter
  • Know All
  • ******
  • Posts: 454
Re: Investigation
« Reply #8 on: 01-10-19, 03:18PM »

Comes down to whether they acknowledged the texts, can't really plead ignorance if they responded.

oldfashionedplayer

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 44
Re: Investigation
« Reply #9 on: 01-10-19, 04:07PM »
Don't need to plead ignorance, just gotta tell them they aren't using proper communication, so whether they turn up at the arranged one or the new one they can use it to their advantage of the incompetence of proper procedures being followed, if they can't communicate properly, how are they investigating properly? :P

alf

  • VLH Supporter
  • Know All
  • ******
  • Posts: 454
Re: Investigation
« Reply #10 on: 01-10-19, 05:20PM »
Funny thing is, you are prepared to accept a phonecall as "proper communication", despite it being no more valid than a text i.e. The policy dosent mention either.

For what's it's worth the wording for being invited to an investigation is,
"You will usually receive a letter inviting you to an
investigation meeting giving you 24 hours’ Notice".

So by all means OP turn up on the original date, but it'll be a lonely "meeting", or request a letter, but it'll evitably just  reiterate what you got by text.

Or if you want, try to go down the improper procedure route, your call.

Though I can't see any route getting what you want i.e. To get it over with to help your anxiety, if anything it'll just delay any action further.

Redshoes

  • Smart Arse
  • *****
  • Posts: 605
Re: Investigation
« Reply #11 on: 02-10-19, 02:51AM »
What if it was a text to say date changed, just letting you know that new letter is on its way.

lucgeo

  • VLH Supporter
  • Sad Muppet
  • ******
  • Posts: 2155
Re: Investigation
« Reply #12 on: 02-10-19, 07:46AM »
Then if the letter arrived within the correct notice period, alls well. If not then the original stands.
Live for today. Learn from yesterday.

orangekoala

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 1
Re: Investigation
« Reply #13 on: 04-10-19, 12:20PM »
(Hi sorry unrelated but I can't for the life of me work out how to start my own post!)

So I have worked at Tesco for 18 months and in that time I have proven myself to be a good worker. I work hard, I'm good at my job, I get on with everyone, I've never been in trouble, I'm good with customers, always on time.

The other week I phoned in sick for the first time this year and the manager who answered the phone was very nasty. Interrogated me as if I was lying and spoke angrily to me. I'm a bit embarrassed to admit it but I cried after the phonecall (I was stressed out anyway, feeling rubbish because I was ill, and now upset because I'd been spoken to like s*** by my employers who should trust me).

I just wondered if it's normal in your stores to be treated like this when phoning in ill? Are managers trained to be horrible to try deter staff from taking time off or are your managers more understanding?

I find the welcome back meetings very invasive too. The entire sickness procedure is stressful. Do others agree or am I too sensitive? Should I complain about this manager/should I have stuck up for myself? Interested to hear other stories and opinions.

NightAndDay

  • Smart Arse
  • *****
  • Posts: 658
Re: Investigation
« Reply #14 on: 04-10-19, 12:28PM »
There's a policy in place when you call in sick, if you are sick, you must notify the duty manager giving at least 1 hour (2 hours for convenience) saying that you won't be in and why, the nastiness is not part of the process and should be challenged through a grievance (put it under as dignity at work the PM will thoroughly reprimand the manager in question).

The return to work meeting is to document why you were off sick and to calculate your percentage, (calculated as the hours you've missed by going off sick, divided by your weekly hours x 26 (6 months worth), if it's either under 3% or less than 3 occurences if full time, you'll be fine. Anything over will result in an invite to an ARM where a disciplinary will be decided based on a number of factors, there should be no nastiness, harassment or victimisation in any part of this process.

As said earlier, put in a grievance under dignity at work and make a habit of documenting any future occurences as well as putting forward further grievances, if it continues to.be unresolved, contact ACAS to get advise on proceeding with employment tribunal negotiations.
« Last Edit: 04-10-19, 12:33PM by NightAndDay »

randomworker

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 73
Re: Investigation
« Reply #15 on: 04-10-19, 12:36PM »
(Hi sorry unrelated but I can't for the life of me work out how to start my own post!)

So I have worked at Tesco for 18 months and in that time I have proven myself to be a good worker. I work hard, I'm good at my job, I get on with everyone, I've never been in trouble, I'm good with customers, always on time.

The other week I phoned in sick for the first time this year and the manager who answered the phone was very nasty. Interrogated me as if I was lying and spoke angrily to me. I'm a bit embarrassed to admit it but I cried after the phonecall (I was stressed out anyway, feeling rubbish because I was ill, and now upset because I'd been spoken to like s*** by my employers who should trust me).

I just wondered if it's normal in your stores to be treated like this when phoning in ill? Are managers trained to be horrible to try deter staff from taking time off or are your managers more understanding?

I find the welcome back meetings very invasive too. The entire sickness procedure is stressful. Do others agree or am I too sensitive? Should I complain about this manager/should I have stuck up for myself? Interested to hear other stories and opinions.

Long term/

Go onto the ourTesco website and learn about their policies. Maybe join a club like toastmasters that helps with public speaking. Hopefully those tools will give you the confidence to be able to negotiate and argue with clear and precise language.

Short term/

Join the union and talk with your rep on how best to get support.

NightAndDay

  • Smart Arse
  • *****
  • Posts: 658
Re: Investigation
« Reply #16 on: 04-10-19, 12:56PM »
There is no negotiating around policy, everything has a process, policy is Tesco law, if anything is out of process it must be challenged.

randomworker

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 73
Re: Investigation
« Reply #17 on: 04-10-19, 01:09PM »
There is no negotiating around policy, everything has a process, policy is Tesco law, if anything is out of process it must be challenged.

A definition of negotiate

"to have formal discussions with someone in order to reach an agreement with them"

So if I felt someone was talking to me inappropriately I would have a chat with them explain why it was inappropriate and ask them why they felt the need to say those things and work out our differences without running off to make a complaint or grievance or automatically assuming the worse of that person and making a bigger deal than it needs to be.

Jondoe2016

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 7
Re: Investigation
« Reply #18 on: 04-10-19, 01:19PM »
It seems to be the same on all levels. Please done write off all managers because I am in the same boat. I would never treat anyone the way I am being treated at the moment. My lead manager is being unprofessional and I am in the middle of a grievance.

If you feel it is wrong, then it IS wrong. Do not sit in silence.

There is a charity that offer support and even give legal advice for those who can’t afford it called groceryaid.

No one is above the law and anyone who mistreats staff DESERVE what comes their way if people speak up.

NightAndDay

  • Smart Arse
  • *****
  • Posts: 658
Re: Investigation
« Reply #19 on: 04-10-19, 01:28PM »
There is no negotiating around policy, everything has a process, policy is Tesco law, if anything is out of process it must be challenged.

A definition of negotiate

"to have formal discussions with someone in order to reach an agreement with them"

So if I felt someone was talking to me inappropriately I would have a chat with them explain why it was inappropriate and ask them why they felt the need to say those things and work out our differences without running off to make a complaint or grievance or automatically assuming the worse of that person and making a bigger deal than it needs to be.

I know what negotiation means, and in the context you used it in, it's used incorrectly, you don't negotiate misconduct with someone, you hold them to account, negotiation is more suited in use when discussing the terms of a deal.

On the other foot, you, by all means make it a bigger deal than it has to be, if they hold a position of seniority such as manager, then you should hold them to account, if for no other reason then to draw scrutiny on Tescos personnel development, promotion and recruitment strategy.
« Last Edit: 04-10-19, 01:35PM by NightAndDay »

randomworker

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 73
Re: Investigation
« Reply #20 on: 04-10-19, 01:56PM »
There is no negotiating around policy, everything has a process, policy is Tesco law, if anything is out of process it must be challenged.

A definition of negotiate

"to have formal discussions with someone in order to reach an agreement with them"

So if I felt someone was talking to me inappropriately I would have a chat with them explain why it was inappropriate and ask them why they felt the need to say those things and work out our differences without running off to make a complaint or grievance or automatically assuming the worse of that person and making a bigger deal than it needs to be.

I know what negotiation means, and in the context you used it in, it's used incorrectly, you don't negotiate misconduct with someone, you hold them to account, negotiation is more suited in use when discussing the terms of a deal.

On the other foot, you, by all means make it a bigger deal than it has to be, if they hold a position of seniority such as manager, then you should hold them to account, if for no other reason then to draw scrutiny on Tescos personnel development, promotion and recruitment strategy.

Fine If you can’t talk to someone personally at a one to one level about how there conduct is affecting you and work it out then go all out and hold them to accountability by reporting them. Don’t even give the chance of talking it out just report and ask questions later.  :thumbup:

Hope your sound advice is reflected in every encounter that you face in your life when someone is not following procedure, rules and law. Don’t discuss (can’t dare use the word negotiate) just report.

NightAndDay

  • Smart Arse
  • *****
  • Posts: 658
Re: Investigation
« Reply #21 on: 04-10-19, 02:32PM »
That is how I go through life, it has served me well, when personal integrity held by a person in a senior position is compromised then that person isn't fit for the position they hold, especially in a regimented tower hierarchy organisation such as Tesco.

At the end of the day it comes down to severity of misconduct, victimisation/harrassment caused by someone at equal level should be try to be reconciled, but the grain of standard is much higher when said perpetrator holds a more senior position.


randomworker

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 73
Re: Investigation
« Reply #22 on: 04-10-19, 02:38PM »
That is how I go through life, it has served me well, when personal integrity held by a person in a senior position is compromised then that person isn't fit for the position they hold, especially in a regimented tower hierarchy organisation such as Tesco.

At the end of the day it comes down to severity of misconduct, victimisation/harrassment caused by someone at equal level should be try to be reconciled, but the grain of standard is much higher when said perpetrator holds a more senior position.

Simple little advice from acas

It's always simpler to talk to people directly and informally about a problem.

but Yeah you keep pushing the "them and us" narrative


« Last Edit: 04-10-19, 02:42PM by randomworker »

lucgeo

  • VLH Supporter
  • Sad Muppet
  • ******
  • Posts: 2155
Re: Investigation
« Reply #23 on: 04-10-19, 04:35PM »
(Hi sorry unrelated but I can't for the life of me work out how to start my own post!)

So I have worked at Tesco for 18 months and in that time I have proven myself to be a good worker. I work hard, I'm good at my job, I get on with everyone, I've never been in trouble, I'm good with customers, always on time.

The other week I phoned in sick for the first time this year and the manager who answered the phone was very nasty. Interrogated me as if I was lying and spoke angrily to me. I'm a bit embarrassed to admit it but I cried after the phonecall (I was stressed out anyway, feeling rubbish because I was ill, and now upset because I'd been spoken to like s*** by my employers who should trust me).

I just wondered if it's normal in your stores to be treated like this when phoning in ill? Are managers trained to be horrible to try deter staff from taking time off or are your managers more understanding?

I find the welcome back meetings very invasive too. The entire sickness procedure is stressful. Do others agree or am I too sensitive? Should I complain about this manager/should I have stuck up for myself? Interested to hear other stories and opinions.

To start a new topic you need to become a member for an annual subscription of £2.

You state you rang in sick for the first time this year. Have you rung in sick before and been treated the same by any other manager? If so, this is a store issue of management training, and needs to be highlighted, by speaking to your lead manager.

When 'phoning in sick, managers will query your reasons, some will try to be persuasive in trying to get you to come in, this is probably because they are short staffed, or had other sick calls that day, which will make the store short staffed. As long as you follow policy and ring in within the timeframe, you are following correct procedure. Once you have stated you are unfit for work and the reason why, they should accept that it is your decision, any sort of interrogation or nastiness should not be tolerated, you just insist that you are unfit for work and are following company procedure by informing them of your absence, and you will keep them updated. You then end the call and make a note of time, managers name and what was said!
On your return to work interview, when they ask if you are fit for work, you state what was said, by whom, how it made you feel, and could you have an assurance that this is not accepted practice?
Live for today. Learn from yesterday.

Captain001

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 4
Re: Investigation
« Reply #24 on: 05-10-19, 02:56PM »
So non- food managers are being cut, was announced this morning.