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Author Topic: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/  (Read 101474 times)

OpShunned

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #50 on: 31-08-17, 07:04PM »
UPDATE
31ST AUG 2017

Another victory for workers in their fight for equal pay against Asda

https://www.leighday.co.uk/News/News-2017/August-2017/Another-victory-for-workers-in-their-fight-for-equ


The Employment Appeal Tribunal has ruled today that Asda has been unsuccessful in another attempt to stop over 10,000 equal pay claims against them from proceeding.

31 August 2017

Solicitors from law firm Leigh Day have been working with the GMB union in bringing this historic equal pay case for GMB members.

In October 2016 the claimants won the first part of their equal pay claim against supermarket giant Asda – the tribunal concluded that workers in Asda’s shops, who are mainly women, could compare themselves to male workers in Asda’s distribution centres.

Asda had argued that because different departments ran the shops and the distribution centres, and as there were different methods for setting pay, that no comparison was possible.

In the October judgment the employment tribunal dismissed Asda’s claims and agreed with the claimants that both sets of workers were employed by Asda and that the pay for all workers was controlled by Asda’s executive board, and overseen by their parent company Wal-Mart.

Asda appealed the tribunal’s October decision on ten different grounds. All were unsuccessful.

The Honourable Mr Justice Kerr concluded today that the employment tribunal had been correct in saying that shop workers could compare to the distribution workers:

“I find no lack of rationality or perversity in the judge’s reasoning […] the judge’s overall conclusion that the terms were common in the statutory sense is not impeachable.”


Chris Benson, Head of the Employment and Discrimination Department at Leigh Day, said:

“Asda continues to appeal every point available to them, rather than focusing on paying men in the distribution centres and women in the stores equally, but judges at every level have been adamant that the claims can continue.

“After yet another defeat, we hope that Asda take this opportunity to reflect on the merits of the claims, and concentrate on why they pay men more than women for jobs of equal value, rather than trying to stop the claims going ahead at all.”

Tim Roache, GMB General Secretary, said:
 
"GMB look forward to Asda management sitting down and finding a sensible negotiated solution to recognising that our female members in stores should be paid and valued as equal to the men.
 
"Instead of wasting money on litigation, we ask Asda to be a market leader in solving this wide ranging industry problem."

Asda have indicated that they will seek permission to appeal the decision again.
 
If the shop workers are ultimately successful in their claims Asda are likely to have to review the pay of tens of thousands of staff who may have been paid unlawfully.

LINK TO PETITION BELOW
http://www.verylittlehelps.com/index.php?topic=15986.0
« Last Edit: 31-08-17, 07:09PM by OpShunned »

optout

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #51 on: 31-08-17, 08:23PM »
Thanks for the Update :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
I AM NOT A REP, BUT......

OpShunned

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #52 on: 31-08-17, 09:20PM »
Tim Roache, GMB General Secretary, said:
 
"GMB look forward to Asda management sitting down and finding a sensible negotiated solution to recognising that our female members in stores should be paid and valued as equal to the men.
 
"Instead of wasting money on litigation, we ask Asda to be a market leader in solving this wide ranging industry problem."

Asda have indicated that they will seek permission to appeal the decision again.

=================================================

In other news:

John Hairnet Generally absent Secretary when it really matters  (USDAW) said,

"Ooh, Dave took me out for a walk today and kicked me in the b ollocks when I asked whether Tesco employees could bring a similar case."

Tesco have indicated that they will seek permission to keep pulling the wool over the minnion's eyes. Hairnet barked his resistance but Dave took all his teeth out with a rusty pliers threatening that Matt the T watt would rip his tongue out if threatened the Partnership/unholy alliance.

« Last Edit: 31-08-17, 09:25PM by OpShunned »

forrestgimp

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #53 on: 01-09-17, 05:21AM »
The pay at each DC differers slightly (another great innovation courtesy of our union) ,  but at my DC all employees are paid the same rate which is £9.33 per hour plus premiums for weekend working £2.33, night premium £2.33 OT £11.66 with the average salary at the depot circa £20k

There currently are no Team Leaders, but there will shortly be Service Coordinators who will get an extra £6 a week (on top of the above rates )

Can you tell us what extra duties the 6 quid extra is supposed to cover, it seems a meagre amount to expect anything to be honest.

OpShunned

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #54 on: 01-09-17, 09:56PM »
How brave were these 4 Sainsbury females?

Well done to them  :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:
-------------



Sainsbury’s instructs TLT to defend equal pay claim by Leigh Day
By Tabby Kinder   14 July 2015 00:03
Sainsbury’s has instructed TLT to defend it in an equal pay battle brought by four female shopfloor workers.

The claimants, represented by Leigh Day, claim they are paid less than men to do equally valuable jobs at the supermarket.

Leigh Day lawyer Michael Newman, working on the claim, said it believed the Sainsbury’s action could be joined by many more female staff members and could be as “big as the Asda case”. Newman is in the process of setting up a group register for claimants.

The firm is currently working on a colosssal equal pay claim against Asda due to go to trial in 2016 (23 March 2015).

A preliminary hearing in the Sainsbury’s case was held at an employment tribunal in Birmingham on Friday (10 July). Sainsbury’s requested at the hearing that the claim be stayed until the conclusion of the Asda case, but the request was denied. Such a move would have resulted in a stay on the claim of likely more than five years.  >:D

TLT employment partner Mark McQuillan has instructed 11KBW’s Sean Jones QC for Sainsbury’s.

Leigh Day partner Chris Benson is leading the claims against both Asda and Sainsbury’s, instructing Outer Temple Chambers’ Andrew Short QC on both.

The next case management conference on the Sainsbury’s claim is scheduled for October. Leigh Day is understood to have requested various information from the supermarket giant in relation to job titles and pay.

Asda has drafted in Herbert Smith Freehills, Gibson Dunn & Crutcher and Pinsent Masons to defend it in a claim brought by around 4,000 shopfloor staff in what is expected to be one of the most expensive equal pay cases ever brought in the UK.

Leigh Day said around 20,000 workers contacted the firm after reading about the Asda case.

Claimants could be entitled to six years’ back pay for the difference in earnings should they win against the retailers due to rules brought in following a 2012 equal pay claim, which extended the time limit for claims from six months after leaving the company to six years.

Sainsbury’s faced a similar case in 1989 brought by a woman working in its Lewisham store in south London. The ruling found that the roles of warehouse men and shopfloor workers were consistent at the supermarket meaning pay should be equal.

Leigh Day brought a successful equal pay claim against Birmingham City Council in 2012 (24 October 2012). The ruling in the Supreme Court led to the council shelling out around £1bn to settle claims brought by tens of thousands of female employees. It also led to the change in time limit legislation for claims named the “biggest change to equal pay legislation” since it was introduced in 1970.

https://www.thelawyer.com/issues/online-july-2015/sainsburys-instructs-tlt-to-defend-equal-pay-claim-by-leigh-day-2/

alf

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #55 on: 01-09-17, 10:50PM »
What I wonder, if distribution pay is so great and the jobs are so comparable (according to the claimants anyway) why isn't there a mass exodus of shop workers going from retail to distribution?

I mean from reading stories on here, it seems distribution centres struggle to get/maintain enough staff.

 

OpShunned

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #56 on: 01-09-17, 11:21PM »
That's a good point well made Alf. Of course, when there is /if there is parity between codes, I feel certain that a mass exodus from Distribution to stores will commence. I mean to say from hearing anecdotal accounts from distribution staff as to  the complex nature of warehouse work, allied to the tough physical demands, the rotational shift patterns and various other demanding 'stuff' I would envisage a stampeded to store?

..yet, are there jobs in store that consist of anything other than 11 hours or so?

...although store colleagues are already acutely aware of the ensuing carnage warehouse colleagues face when Drastic ties them up with Booker? The minimum wage by then will be £9 per hour which means working for Booker/Tesco for a few bob extra under a new regime will feel like hell.  Moving from store to warehouse will be like crawling down the barrel of a cannon  :o
« Last Edit: 01-09-17, 11:27PM by OpShunned »

alf

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #57 on: 02-09-17, 01:25AM »
I certainty wouldn't work in a depo for the same money as retail.

But I wouldn't be so sure about retail being any better if this goes through, those massive payroll increases will need to come from somewhere.


forrestgimp

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #58 on: 02-09-17, 05:30AM »
I wouldnt work in one you are treated like a slave, my mate is a manager in one and the storys he tells me are unreal how they treat shop floor workers.

There is no wonder they have to ship boat loads of Polish, Lithuanian and any other eastern European person they can get their hands on over here to work.

The slave trade is alive and well...

cityboy

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #59 on: 02-09-17, 11:14AM »
I will never have any support for this case as long as it is deemed an issue of sexual discrimination. If it was a matter of equal value to the company, they would have my sympathy and support, but to make it a gender issue is twisting the facts. There are a lot less distribution centres than stores, so location is a factor,( my nearest D.C. is 55 miles away ), I work a walk away, convenience. I reckon more men apply for, and stick to distribution. I also reckon more women apply for and stick to retail, ( I have no figures on this, perhaps somebody has?). I would say this is a choice thing, around your family structure. If there was a D.C. and a Tesco Extra a few minutes walk from each other, and both offered the same flexibility and opportunities they do now, I am sure in my mind the store would employ a higher percentage of women and the D.C. a higher percentage of men. If pay was equal, would the percentage of female workers in distribution rise to 50%?. Not a chance! If pay was equal, would male retail workers rise to 50%?. Not going to happen. To base this case on gender is ridiculous. To take your employer to court on the grounds of equal worth of job, has some grounds. To take your employer to court on what suits you and your family, and crying 'sexism' without any grounds that the pay difference does not apply equally to men and women is sexist in itself.

Nomad

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #60 on: 02-09-17, 03:33PM »
Is it not the case that jobs of equal worth should attract equal pay, it is then up to all persons to decide if the job is desirable & suitable for them and the companies to then decide if those persons are able to perform their duties safely and efficiently.   
Nomad ( Forum Admin )
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cityboy

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #61 on: 02-09-17, 05:57PM »
I agree, Nomad, so gender is irrelevant.

OpShunned

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #62 on: 02-09-17, 07:07PM »
I'm not bothered if Leigh Day drag a 3 headed Martian into court citing inter-galactic discrimination as long as they win the case. Leigh day have already stated that men, camels and martians will be able to piggyback the claim.

Does it really matter who initially benefits, if EVERYONE in store benefits ultimately?

Why are Distribution dinosaurs so bothered when Drastic Dave is gonna stiff them in the coming months/years?

If equal/comparable work is worth the same rate of pay, as deemed by the law courts, it doesn't matter what gender you are as long as the whole workforce benefits?

alf

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #63 on: 02-09-17, 07:47PM »
"if EVERYONE in store benefits ultimately?"

At what cost?

Look how retailers have funded the rising wage costs so far, cutting hours where they can, mass redundancies where they can't, or TUPE'ing people to other companies, benefit cuts, premium cuts including night premiums and Sunday premiums.

What is find amazing, certain posters here (I can't recall if you are included or not) bemoaned the Tesco pay rises in retail over these past couple of years, as they were funded through cuts to night shift premiums and Sunday premiums. In other words they f***ed overall certain staff to appease other staff.

Do they think the exact same thing won't happen to distribution workers? Someone mentioned they get weekend premiums and night shift premiums, they may have to say goodbye to them.

There isn't going to be some fairytale ending where we all get paid more with no consequences.

memberx

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #64 on: 02-09-17, 07:59PM »
Distribution runs big time on nights. Take away night premiums staff will leave and they cannot get enough staff now. So it will never happen.

OpShunned

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #65 on: 02-09-17, 08:01PM »
Distribution colleagues might as well face the future:

Dave will have your premiums off them just like he has done elsewhere?

It's over! The company has changed irrevocably whether you or I can accept it.

As far as Drastic is concerned, resistance is futile. He has USDAW on a leash which means he has its members cornered.

Why not grab what you can by force than end up on minimum wage anyway. He's not going to save another billion by pussyfooting around departments. He goes in swiftly for the kill. It will be brutal and merciless.

John Hairnet will be the only beneficiary in real terms  ???


OpShunned

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #66 on: 02-09-17, 08:04PM »
Distribution runs big time on nights. Take away night premiums staff will leave and they cannot get enough staff now. So it will never happen.

Rubbish! The same argument was made about removing night-fill. Stores still running?

Do you believe Alan Stewart hasn't number crunched scenarios, some are based on Booker's distribution sites.

Get real.

alf

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #67 on: 02-09-17, 08:23PM »
Who needs drastic, when we have opshunned, nobly sacrificing others for potential personal gain, under the guise of "it'll happen anyway".
 
Distribution runs big time on nights. Take away night premiums staff will leave and they cannot get enough staff now. So it will never happen.

I do agree, which is why I think this equal pay claim nonsense, is nonsense.
Distribution need higher rates of pay (and premiums) to attract workers, as it clear they struggle to maintain staff levels, retail do not, our last recruitment drive in-store resulted in far more applicants than there were jobs.

There will be major consequences if this goes through, and not just for Asda and Tesco, consider how many retailers operate their own distribution.

OpShunned

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #68 on: 02-09-17, 08:36PM »
Lovin' it Alf. You're a dinosaur of the finest quality?

I find it staggering to discover your revelation that supply outstripped demand during the latest Store's recruitment drive. I can picture those hoards banging down the barriers in search of an eleven hour contract in order they can secure their futures  ;D ;D ;D

Get real and sign the petition!

Alf for one and Alf together!

alf

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #69 on: 02-09-17, 09:03PM »
So anyone who supports staff in certain areas of a business, having better rates of pay, is now a dinosaur?

Bizarre, but good to know.

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/03/26/uk-jobs-vacancies_n_5029260.html
Admittedly, it's a few years old now, and undoubtedly they are extreme examples, but yes we had far more applicants than positions. There's a reason Tesco use assessment centres to batch interview applicants.



OpShunned

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #70 on: 02-09-17, 09:07PM »
You sound like another poster on here wink wink  8-)

OpShunned

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #71 on: 02-09-17, 09:08PM »
I've emailed Leigh day and been in touch with Tom Hewitt (Employment Law Solicitor)

[my email]

Hi there,

I've been closely following the recent claims made by workers at both Asda and Sainsburys regarding comparative roles between their stores and distribution centres. I am led to believe that Asda (female) claimants have been given the green light to proceed with their claim. Naturally, and, as has been pointed out there must be a case for male counterparts to pursue the same direction.

We' at T**** may be in the the same situation we believe, given the nature of duties at our stores compared to those at our distribution centres. Some colleagues might be reluctant to pursue a claim preferring to wait until the Asda judgement is settled (although this could take a while from what I can gather)  although it has been explained that no victimisation can take place as a result of any claim made regarding Equal pay. The other thing is is that Leigh day are not going to approach 'us' to make a claim so it is down to 'us' to approach yourselves.

Can you provide me with some general advice on how to start the ball rolling please?

Is it ok to forward your number on to colleagues who work in store?

Many thanks
---------------------------

[Reply]

Yes, of course – if that is preferable.

Hi,
 
My number is 020 7650 1182 if you are available to have a short discussion with me?
 
Kind regards,
 
Tom

Tom Hewitt, Solicitor, Employment
Leigh Day Priory House, 25 St John's Lane, London EC1M 4LB
Tel: 020 7650 1200 Fax: 020 7253 4433 DX 53326 Clerkenwell
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The guy said it's ok for any store colleague to give him a call on 020 7650 1182.

Feel free to call him if you want to make a tentative enquiry.

Good luck to all if something comes of it! If not, at least an attempt was made!

OvaSees

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #72 on: 02-09-17, 10:03PM »
I have no issue with the case or its merit, but I do have concerns about the potential implications - which is where I agree with alf. This isn't a pop at the case or at OpShunned ;) but I'm not sure many people have grasped the longer term implications.

This wil undoubtably lead to a situation where rates of pay will have to be normalised or harmonised across different roles and functions - either store colleagues will get big rises to catch up with those in DCs (possibly at the cost of another element of their pay package), and/or DC colleagues will receive little or no pay rises (or erosion of some element of their pack package) until store colleagues pay rates catch up, with both rates of pay eventually matching. Whatever the outcome, all Tesco will do is rob Peter to pay Paul - it must all be funded from the same pot. If anyone seriously thinks that the company will simply throw more money into payroll to fund an increase to achieve parity across stores and DCs they are living in a dream land.

Whatever happens, if parity between stores and DCs pay rates is indeed achieved, then there will be no incentive or reason to do a different role in a different function for which you may or may not be suited - and I guarantee this will not deliver equality of outcome in terms of the proportion of males/females working in either function. That will remain as it has always been, a matter of personal choice partially determined by geographical proximity to your chosen work location.

Whilst in stores we may end up getting a better hourly rate, my question is 'at what long term cost' - somebody somewhere is quite literally going to pay for this through removal or erosion of some other element of their pay package. It also sets a dangerous precedent, where will it end?

trigger

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #73 on: 03-09-17, 03:59AM »
just got in from the pub,stores pay,dc pay,whatever.were not givin up out t&c.
BRING ON THE WELSH HA HA HA.GRAND SLAM 2008.
VOTE UKIP.

cityboy

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Re: Equal Pay/Leigh Day /Tom Hewitt/
« Reply #74 on: 03-09-17, 11:14AM »
Openandhonest, what do you mean in regards to the previous post and this topic....what?.

Administrator Comment Openandhonest's post has been deleted as it was way off topic. Nomad